Lawrence CLEARY - Advice on finding parents please

[Beg Clonrode...]

Hello...

Just looking for any help in tracing the parents mentioned in the following Attestation form...

http://www.rootschat.com/links/0187p/
(Click on image to magnify. Or click "Download" to save to computer)

Lawrence CLEARY born in Cape Town, South Africa
b. 29 January September 1889

Father: Thomas CLEARY b.Southern Ireland

Mother: Ellen Mary née KELLY b.South Africa

The Attestation form is from the NZ WW2 Army Service record for Lawrence CLEARY

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For comparison here is his WW1 Attestation form from twenty-ish years earlier. It says "Parents not known" and gives a date of birth nine months earlier (4 Jan 1889)

http://www.rootschat.com/links/0187q/


If wanted, the full Service file can be downloaded from the following link...

http://archway.archives.govt.nz/ViewFullItem.do?code=24055204&digital=yes

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No record yet found of Lawrence's arrival in NZ c.1892 or his travelling companions. He was in a NZ orphanage c.1900.

Any advice appreciated.

Regards
Beg

[pampoen]

Here is Ellen's estate notice she died in 1918.
DEPOT     KAB                                                                   
SOURCE    MOOC                                                                 
TYPE      LEER                                                                 
VOLUME_NO 6/9/1185                                                             
SYSTEM    01                                                                   
REFERENCE 2939                                                                 
PART      1                                                                     
DESCRIPTION          CLEARY, ELLEN. NEE KELLY. ESTATE PAPERS.                             
STARTING  19180000                                                             
ENDING    19180000   

     Further to the CLEARY/HAYES/KELLY query - Thomas CLEARY went to the Cape from Borrisokane Tipperary IRL as far as we know. The following are the children of Thomas Cleary and Ellen KELLY- all born Capetown.
Gertrude Mary Cleary b. 1891......married Smith. no issue.
Mary Bridget b. 1893............married Mancille.
Thomas Joseph b. 1895.........to Durban or UK/Australia ?
        James b.1898.......       
     
boards.ancestrylibrary.com › ... › Ireland › Tipperary › General
Apr 25, 2001 - 2 posts - ‎2 authors
Did he prehaps have a brother Thomas Cleary who was a member of the Irish Constabulary before he immigrated to Cape Town, South Africa?      Thomas was a policeman?
                     
Found something else with a private email address from 2001 so have sent it to you in a PM. Regards Derek.

[Beg Clonrode...]

Hello Derek...

Thanks yet again :-)

The lady who started the 2001 thread seems to still be with us. She's on the current 2013 NZ electoral roll and is also in the NZ White Pages. I've passed her contact details onto Nerak, the person currently asking about Lawrence CLEARY, so maybe Nerak will make contact and all will be revealed..... hmmmm :-).

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Is it safe to assume the info about the children came from the Estate File or are there other sources for Capetown births. It's slightly worrying that Lawrence (possibly aka John Thomas) born in 1889 isn't mentioned in the 2001 thread.

And where would we look for an 1890-ish presumably South African marriage between Thomas CLEARY and Ellen KELLY. I see that marriage details aren't given on the Estate File example, just the name of the spouse.

Thanks again
Beg

[pampoen]

Hi Beg if you look on the Forum there is an example of what an estate file contains written by Empea. There are parish records for Cape Town on Familysearch but one has to know which suburb they were born in and if they were Anglican or Wesleyan then you need to browse through the images one by one. I have put your request on a South African genealogy site on Facebook which has many members.

[Beg Clonrode...]

Hi Derek...

Just a quick update... the email address you found on Rootsweb seems not to lead anywhere. I've found an alternate email address but that seems to be a bust as well. I'm reasonably sure (although I may well be wrong) that I've found the Rootsweb lady in the current NZ electoral rolls and also the current NZ White Pages so it may be a case of writing a letter or picking up the phone.

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The eGSSA website says...

NB. We cannot obtain document copies from the The Cape Town Archives Repository (KAB) which has banned mechanical copying by any means of documents in their care. We understand they will offer a copying service themselves.

Do you know the latest on KAB's offer. I've had zero success trying to find further info about the copying service on the Cape Town Archives website.

All the best
Beg

[braw]

Hi Beg, I  sent you a PM of a researcher I use.
Regards

Bruce

[Beg Clonrode...]

Hello Bruce...

Thanks very much for taking the time to help And thanks for the link to the website.

His charges seem very fair so it looks like he'll be the one to use.

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A slight update to my earlier update :-)

It looks like the email lead Derek found is still active. The lady he found is currently on holiday and the person I found in the NZ electoral rolls and White Pages is actually her daughter. They have very similar names, which threw me.

Contact has been made with the daughter but she seems not to know all that much about the genealogy side of things. She has contacted her mother to give her a heads-up but I'm guessing there will be a slight pause in play until the mother returns from holiday.

Fingers crossed we're back on track.

All the best
Beg

[arthuranderin]

If you are looking for information on Lawrence Cleary. I am his grand daughter and I have all the information on the South African family. If you are related I will share it all with you. Please reply and let me know. It is a very complicated story. Cheers Erin