WW1 Medal Card Clarification Required

[DavidJP]

Hi all,

Having found the WW1 Medal Card for a distant relative, I am a little unsure of some of the details upon it.

The relative in question is one John Arthur Hussey b1891/92 in Mitcham in Surrey. The Medal Card details are as follows:

Name: Hussey, John A
Regiment: 4/Lond R
Reg No: 1738

He was awarded the 1915 Star, British & Victory Medals. All whilst in the same regiment.

Theatre of War First Served in: (1) France
Date of Entry Therein: 16.1.15

Within the remarks box, there is written the following:

T of E 16.5.17

His service papers do not appear to exist.

I thought that the 4/Lond R meant 4th Battalion London Regiment. However, there doesn't seem to have been a 4th Battalion. There was the 1/4th, 2/4th, 3/4th & I think 4/4th of the London regiment. So now a bit confused. What Battalion/Regiment was he in? What does the detail in the remarks box mean? Anything else about the detail on the card that you tell me?

John Arthur survived the war & appears to go by the name Arthur John Hussey in 1911 & after the war dying in 1962 aged 70 in Surrey.

Any and all help gratefully received.

Many thanks in advance.

Kind regards.

David

[mmm45]

Hi
I'm in a bit of rush so just a quick response ill will add to it later.
Your man was a pre war Territorial and T of E is time expired...he was able to leave the army as he had served the time he signed up for....even in wartime
If 1/4 ths entered theatre on the date of entry to theatre then go with that....2/ 3/ 4/ were different battalions within the same Regiment established on outbreak of war with an influx of volunteers

Will expand later

Ady

[DavidJP]

Hi Ady,

Many thanks for that, no problem with your expanding on detail later, that's absolutely fine.

Going with what you've said re the 1/4th's, I've got the following from the Long Long Trail Website:

The London Regiment

Battalions of the Territorial Force

1/4th (City of London) Battalion (Royal Fusiliers)

August 1914: At Shaftsbury Street in City Road. Part of 1st London Brigade, 1st London Division. Moved on mobilization to guarding the Basingstoke-Waterloo Railway.

4th September 1914: Sailed with Brigade from Southampton to Malta, arriving Valetta 14th September.

2nd January 1915: Left Malta, arrived at Marseilles on 6th January.

10th February 1915: Joined the Ferozepore Brigade in 3rd (Lahore) Division.

11th November 1915: Transferred to 137th Brigade in 46th (North Midland) Division.

15th November 1915: Transferred to 140th Brigade in 47th (2nd London) Division.

9th February 1916: Transferred to 168th Brigade in 56th (London) Division.

Nothing after that.

Before I start tracking him through the various Brigades etc, do you think this fits the medal card details? ie the Regiment arriving in Marseilles 10 days before his entry to theatre or war etc.

Many thanks again.

Kind regards

David

[mmm45]

http://www.1914-1918.net/soldiers/interpretmic.html

A little bit more on TE on link above.
I think he was 1/4th. Looking at his MIC I think the 1 by the 6 could be just a Mark left by clerk and it should read 6th which ties in with their landing in Marseilles
He entered France....2/4th went first to Gallipoli so would have 2b on their card.
3rd and 4th line were still in UK.

Hope this helps

Ady

[DavidJP]

Hi Ady,

Many thanks for that, very much appreciated.

Looking again at the Medal Card, I think that you are probably right regarding the date being 6th rather than 16th Jan 1915. It does look more like a mark rather than a one as you say.

Many thanks also for the link, extremely useful indeed.

My thanks again.

Kind regards

David

[km1971]

Hi David

He was in 4th London Regiment, which at the start of WW1 when they created a second line, became 1st/4th.

I think it is more likely he arrived in northern France on the 16th January 1915 to meet up with the rest of the battalion who arrived in Marseille on the 6th, and then travelled up to the front line in Flanders. He would not have sailed from England to Marseille, and he was not in the Med as his first theatre of war was France.

His musketry/fitness may have been below standard to stop he going to the Med with the rest of the battalion. Although after more than a year service - his four years was up in May 1917 so he enlisted/re-enlisted in May 1913 - this should not have been the case. Or he may have had a job that kept him in the Depot - batman to an officer for example; or he was too young to go overseas (19 at the start of WW1); or he may have delayed signing the "Imperial Service Obligation", which agreed to overseas service. The medal roll for his 1915 Star may give the date he signed the "Imperial Service Obligation". Or he may have been transferred to 2nd/4th to help train recruits. If you have not been able to find his record on Ancestry, you will probably never know.

Interesting that his term of engagement/enlistment expired after the law that brought in conscription. If he was conscripted his VM/BWM would have different details. Also he does not have a six digit number which were introduced for the TF two months before his discharge. He may have been unfit or too old to be conscripted; or had an occupation that was then reserved. Or he moved to Ireland.

Knowing his age would help.

Ken

[DavidJP]

Hi Ken,

Many thanks indeed for your reply, very much appreciated.

John Arthur Hussey was born in 1891/92, therefore would have been 22/23 when the war started & 25/26 when his term of service ended in 1917.

Many thanks also for the background detail/info that you have kindly given, certainly interesting to read & maybe gives a bit of insight too.

Many thanks again.

Kind regards.

David