How did he get to an industrial school?

[Triboy]

Thanks for the positive comments. There are some complications.
I think the 2 Richard Spencers' could be the same. I don't know about being a Methodist but he was born in 1867 and married in Chesterfield Parish Church in 1888 and celebrated over 60 years of marriage living in the Chesterfield area the whole time. His wife was a widow age 20 when they married.
The 1871 census, when he was 3, shows his father as Joseph with a wife Elizabeth. His birth certificate shows his mothers' name as Annmarie.

[spendlove]

Hi,
Not sure if you know the following - but here goes:-

Joseph Spencer = Ann Maria Boyer  March Q 1856 Chesterfield 7b 633

Ann Maria Spencer Died  Mar Q 1868 Chesterfield 7b 328 aged 34.

Joseph Spencer then married Elizabeth Wightman Sept Q 1870 Chesterfield 7b 773

This explains why on his birth certificate his Mother is Ann Maria, and that the Elizabeth on the
1871 Census is actually his Stepmother.

It is interesting to see that by the 1881 Census Joseph & Elizabeth have none of Joseph's Children
living with them.  So it is quite likely that it is your Richard in the Industrial School.

Joseph & Ann Maria in 1861 are living in Chesterfield RG 9/2528; Folio: 38; Page: 28;
There is a son Roger John listed as aged 10 years, this is a transcription error his age is actually
10 months.  After the 1861 census he appear to go as John Spencer or John Boyer Spencer.

Spendlove

[Triboy]

Thanks for that Spendlove.

I had worked out some of it but am still unable to find how he got to an Industrial School in York.It is unfortunate that the records for York no longer exist making it much more difficult to find when he actually went there.
I have searched most of the local newspapers without success.
Yes it is interesting that none of the other children are living with Joseph & Elizabeth in 1881. Although Richard was the youngest the others were not much older and one wonders what happened to them.
The Sarah mentioned in the link from ShaunJ  could possibly be the sister of Richard who entered the workhouse in 1882.
If Richard was also forced to enter the workhouse it would suggest that the industrial school was not terribly successful in its work.

Triboy.

[ThrelfallYorky]

I found at least one other family where a re-marriage seemed to lead to two boy children of the first marriage being in an Industrial School by the next census. This one was the Kirkdale Industrial School in Lancashire, though.
Is there any sort of central authority / administration for the Industrial Schools which may have some records? Or if the child was sent there via a Parish council or Poor Law intervention, might there be records locally?

[Gardener]

His sister Helen Boyer Spencer had found her way to Yorkshire by 1881 too:

RG11, piece 4708, folio 40, page 11
Cawood
Helen Boyer Spencer unm 23 domestic servant born Brampton
(in a ladies school)

[Gardener]

And Mary Jane Blenkhorn who is niece/school mistress in the same household in 1881 was a governess at Alfreton in 1871. Perhaps there is some slight connection there?
The Industrial school may have been a solution to a problem not involving any wrong doing. Thirty years later my grandfather was lucky to be placed in one after he ran away from his uncle's house.

[Triboy]

The Helen Spencer you mention I have as being spelt Ellen but everything else matches so likely the same person. It is quite possible there is a Yorkshire connection. I believe that at least one of Richard's children married and lived in the Doncaster area.

I have not been able to check as yet but I wonder if the Ann Toplis where Joseph and Elizabeth were lodging in 1881 could possibly be one of Joseph's sisters. If so this could be the Yorkshire connection.

I have been somewhat sidetracked by looking into the unhappy marriage of one of Richard's grandchildren. She was working at Trowell Hall at the time of her marriage in 1937.

[iluleah]

......................The Industrial school may have been a solution to a problem not involving any wrong doing. Thirty years later my grandfather was lucky to be placed in one after he ran away from his uncle's house.

I was just thinking how 'nosy' we all are in wanting to know why in this case why he ended up in an Industrial School and think this part of family history research is what is so interesting.

I love it that we are not happy with just the basic bmd details and really want to know about our ancestors, what made them tick and how their life panned out for them, it sort of makes you love them more and you can empathise with them.

[Mabel Bagshawe]

There is a son Roger John listed as aged 10 years, this is a transcription error his age is actually
10 months.  After the 1861 census he appear to go as John Spencer or John Boyer Spencer.

Spendlove

His birth and death are registered as Boyer John, or Boyer J, so suspect Roger is also a mistranscription!