Caroline Mary Bear b.1870

[lizdb]

Interesting the children were all christened Great Warley.

The Lunatic Asylum was actually in the parish of South Weald, although geographically much nearer Great Warley. Not sure about Woodman Road and Warley Hill, actually I think they were probably in Great Warley parish (warley hill being the parish boundary) . Inmates from the Asylum who died were buried at St Peters South Weald.

Anyway, of no great significance - the family seemed to use Great Warley, which makes sense as much nearer and they probably were living in that parish (even if he worked in a different one) and we seem to have proved that Caroline was still alive into adulthood.
But where?
Anyone with access to outward bound passenger lists been able to see her?

[Chooch]

Hello lizdb

I've been trying where possible to look for outward bound passengers, come to that anything and anyone, anywhere with initials, similar name etc., to try and find a clue but no luck thus far.
She has to be somewhere doesn't she.

[nannyj]

Hi Chooch,
There were two baptisms fore Ellen Louise, which makes me think one died (hence the PB next to name on baptism record ... Unless that means pauper, but they wouldn't have been paupers, as Robert John was working?)
There were often two or three being baptised at the same time ... Maybe when Robert could get time off or maybe it was cheaper to have several baptised at once? Or maybe the priest badgered them enough?? If there's only one Caroline, it seems they waited til she was five? There weren't any ages or dobs next to the names unfortunately.
Yes, all SEAX, so a sub would be worthwhile now that you know the parish. Several trees suggest that Sarah's surname was Gotts and that she was born in upminster? Does that sound right to you?

[nannyj]

Of course, PB could be private baptism ... But why baptise twice?

[Chooch]

Hi nannyj

Yes the mother was Sarah Gotts and I'm sure they were not paupers. If the PB meant private baptism could that mean that Ellen wasn't expected to live but as she obviously did why baptise again as you say.
Oddly I can only find one birth for Ellen Louisa Bear and that is Oct/Dec. 1878, her age is consistent in census 1881-1901 - 2 yrs- 22 yrs, but then she appears to vary between 1875/1877/1879 Confusing.
You're right now seems like a good time for that Sub.
Many thanks for all the help.

Chooch.

[nannyj]

Good luck. You won't find the hackney ones unfortunately, as they're Middlesex, but you will be able to trawl through the great warley, South Weald and shenfield ones.

[findem]

Very often if a child was baptised privately because it was thought the child's chances of surviving were slim, if it did survive it would receive another baptism ceremony.  I've seen quite a few different names for the second ceremony but the only one I can recall at the moment is "introducing the infant/child to the congregation".

However with your particular instance it is a long time after the Private Baptism so I'm wondering if there was some doubt in the Rectors mind about whether or not she had been baptised fully all those years ago.

[lizdb]

Agree with findem that often a private baptism takes place when a child is sickly and may not survive.
In those cases the second event is not another baptism, it is just being received into the church. Normally that takes place altogether during the christening service, but not in tbe case of a private baptism.

[Chooch]

Thank you findem ( love that name by the way) and lizdb, for clarifying and confirming what I also believed to be the case for private baptism.

Chooch