Author Topic: ecclesiastical query  (Read 2403 times)

Offline james evans

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ecclesiastical query
« on: Saturday 12 May 07 15:35 BST (UK) »
I have recently discovered an ancestor who was patron of a church in the 19th century.  Could anyone please tell me what this position entailed, how they were appointed etc and what records I should search for any further information.
Thanking you
Jim Evans

Offline Ecneps

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Re: ecclesiastical query
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 12 May 07 15:51 BST (UK) »
Hi Jim,

You could look at widipedia
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ius_patronatus is about rights of patronage
looks as if they provided the land, paid for the church to be built and then
for its minister and upkeep

Barbara
`There are two lasting bequests we can give our children -  One is roots - the other is wings`- Hodding Carter

Census and bmd information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

Lincs & Yorks - SIVILLS PREDGEN    Norfolk - EBBS WHITEROD ZIPFELL       Sweden - JÖNSSON CRONBERG ANDERSSON      Yorks - SPENCE HIDE HIRD      Durham - DALKIN SELBY RENWICK

Offline stanmapstone

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Re: ecclesiastical query
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 12 May 07 16:36 BST (UK) »
The right, known as an Advowson, of nomination or presentation of a clergyman to an ecclesiastical benefice is exercised by a diocesan bishop or by some other person or body corporate either lay or clerical known as the Patron. Even though a candidate may have been nominated by a patron for institution and induction he may still be rejected by the bishop in whose diocese the vacancy has occurred. An Advowson is a form of property which may be bought, or sold or given away and is subject to civil law.
An Advowson in the Church of England is a property right which can pass by gift, inheritance, or until 1923 by sale. However since the Patronage (Benefices) Measure 1986, only communicant members of the Church of England can exercise the right of patronage, and nominations require the consent of the bishop and representatives of the Parochial Church Council.
If you get a diocesan year book for a particular diocese, the entry for each parish will state who the patron is. Patrons of parishes are also given in old directories.
Stan
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Ecneps

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Re: ecclesiastical query
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 12 May 07 16:50 BST (UK) »
I knew Stan would have the full answer, much better than Wikipedia  :D
Barbara
`There are two lasting bequests we can give our children -  One is roots - the other is wings`- Hodding Carter

Census and bmd information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk and www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk

Lincs & Yorks - SIVILLS PREDGEN    Norfolk - EBBS WHITEROD ZIPFELL       Sweden - JÖNSSON CRONBERG ANDERSSON      Yorks - SPENCE HIDE HIRD      Durham - DALKIN SELBY RENWICK


Offline Nick Carver

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Re: ecclesiastical query
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 13 May 07 15:36 BST (UK) »
Actually the identity of the patrons of a parish can tell you a bit about the history of a place. Until comparatively recently, it was not uncommon for parishes to belong to a diocese that you would not expect them to. For instance, my Cambs parish was formerly in the diocese of Rochester (Kent). We recently appointed a new priest for a group of 5 parishes and the patrons (as Stan says) have the power of veto over an appointment. Of the 5 parishes, the patron of one is the Lord Chancellor (consequence of the former lords of the manor going broke and disappearing off to USA in 1600s - patronage reverting to crown in the form of lord chancellor), one is a University of Cambridge college (owns the land), another is the major landowner in one village (who also happens to be landlord of Sheikh Mohammed's Godolphon stables as it happens) and the identity of the other two patrons has been lost in the mists of time. Interestingly, a search of diocesan archives failed to find any clues to the identity of the missing patrons, but as one village has only 200 inhabitants and the other is a similar size, neither has had their own priest for over a century which might account for the confusion.

It's bad enough tracing your own ancestors without looking for mysterious links to long dead clergy, however I would dearly love to have a rummage around the diocesan archives, if only to find the letter written to the bishop in the 1600s complaining about the vicar spending too much time in the local hostelries and being responsible for various other iniquities - no action was taken.
E Yorks - Carver, Steels, Cross, Maltby, Whiting, Moor, Laybourn
W Yorks - Wilkinson, Kershaw, Rawnsley, Shaw
Norfolk - Carver, Dowson
Cheshire - Berry, Cooper
Lincs - Berry
London/Ireland/Scotland/Lincs - Sullivan
Northumberland/Durham - Nicholson, Cuthbert, Turner, Robertson
Berks - May
Beds - Brownell

Offline james evans

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Re: ecclesiastical query
« Reply #5 on: Monday 14 May 07 15:24 BST (UK) »
Dear Stan, Barbara and Nick
Thank you so much the very useful and interesting information. I am most grateful for your responses/
Jim