Child born out of Wedlock 1876

[New Zealander]

I am a little certain where to place this post which is related to a previous post on Richard and Harriet Green.

Where would you find recorded in 1876 the birth of a child name of Lillian born to Ellen Green?
 
There is nothing in BDM Online, NZSG Kiwi Index or on Papers Past after extensively scouring newspapers of the time.  I have a copy of the 1900 USA Census and all details of the family appear accurate and include Lillian Ludemann (Green?),  23 years born in New Zealand in October 1876.  It is also stated on the Census that the child's father was born in England .

While I am reluctant to think it I would hope that it isn't a case of incest .  George Ludemann who Ellen worked for and had a relationship with was born in Germany.

It might also be useful to consider a report in the Lake Wakatip Mail for the 14th September 1876 and the Queenstown Magistrates Court where Richard Green is convicted of assault against George Ludemann who was called some rather unpleasant names by Green.

There is no record for the birth of Lillian anywhere that I can find nor a marriage for Ellen Green.

Any thoughts or ideas please?

Alex G

[alamar]

Hi Alex

Any baptism records available?

Cheers
Alan

[New Zealander]

None that I have found yet.

The Salvation Army were involved when Richard Green died in 1908 and the Ludemann's are all interred in the Masonic Cemetery in San Miguel, Las Vegas.  This might suggest Presbyterian.  The Greens originate from a Church of England background in Oxfordshire.

Sorry I cannot be more helpful.

Alex G

[shellyesq]

Here's a link to the discussion of this family on the US board:  http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=693196.0

It might be worth noting that a subsequent census lists Lillian's father as born in Germany. 

[Jean Price]

Hello Alex G,

One of my families had 10 children between 1867 and 1882 - all in the mining areas around Ross, Hokitika, and Westport - and not one was registered. But being Catholic, all children were baptised - and even more helpfully, the family kept a birthday book.

But my point is - not all children at that time were registered - your Ellen probably gave birth at home and went on with her life without ever thinking about officialdom.

Jean

[kiwihalfpint]

That reminds me, some of mine were registered about four years after the birth, but that was because they were living in the bush, didn't venture into town much, with father being a Bushman.


Cheers
KHP

[New Zealander]

Jean and KHP

Thank you for your thoughts and comments.

As you will see there is a post on the USA forum where I was hoping to find Ellen's wedding or death and thus her age but that has come to nought as well.

I know when she died and where she is interred and have a photograph of her gravesite but to find the Funeral Directors or a Death Obituary in the newspapers which might have led to her birth date has proved impossible.  In fact just couldn't find a way of searching the American newspapers .. just too difficult.

All I have from the 1900 US Census is that Ellen was born in New Zealand in October of 1876 which is as close as I have come to the actual date 

Alex G

[Johnf04]

You mean Lillian was born in 1876.

[New Zealander]

Yes that was found on the 1900 US Census (the 1st post on this thread), if we can believe it,  but is not showing up in BDM Online records or any baptism records that I have been pouring through.

Alex