Author Topic: Italian Count?  (Read 2439 times)

Offline Cazo

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • South African Irish English Scottish Welsh French
    • View Profile
Italian Count?
« on: Saturday 01 June 13 17:36 BST (UK) »
So my family has a story about a distant relative marrying an Italian Count and I was wondering if anyone had a way to prove or disprove this?
I've found the marriage between the parties: In 1931, London, Ruth Mary Mould (1904-1997) married Giovanni Parrilli.
According to the story, he was one of many given honours under the Italian government post WWI... or something like that. I haven't been able to find out any more information on him.

Any assistance would be appreciated.
Thanks
South Africa, St Helena, Ireland, Scotland, England

Offline Hackstaple

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,872
  • Family researcher
    • View Profile
Re: Italian Count?
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 01 June 13 18:06 BST (UK) »
I think you might have more luck looking under a slightly different spelling - Parrili.
Southern or Southan [Hereford , Monmouthshire & Glos], Jenkins, Meredith and Morgan [Monmouthshire and Glos.], Murrill, Damary, Damry, Ray, Lawrence [all Middx. & London], Nethway from Kenn or Yatton. Also Riley and Lyons in South Africa and Riley from St. Helena.
Any census information included in this post is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Colin D Gronow

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 674
  • Member of the Association of Graveyard Rabbits
    • View Profile
Re: Italian Count?
« Reply #2 on: Monday 10 June 13 16:09 BST (UK) »
You will find an account of the wedding, in the
Evening Telegraph, Angus. Scotland for Friday 27th March 1931.

"... Count Parrilli Married The marriage took place yesterday Princes Row Registry Office of Count Giovanni and Miss Ruth Mary Mould."

You will find it here:
http://www.britishnewspaperarchive.co.uk/

Offline JaneyCanuck

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,031
  • The Famous Five take tea on Parliament Hill
    • View Profile
Re: Italian Count?
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 25 June 13 00:47 BST (UK) »
I wonder whether the Count has been mixed up, in the telling, with Lt. Giovanni Pirelli:

http://www.lagazzettaitaliana.com/pirelli.aspx

Quote
Lt. Pirelli, the youngest son of the senator and industrialist Giovanni Battista Pirelli, earned his pilot’s wings in the early days of World War I. From June 1915 until the end of the campaign, he flew 55 reconnaissance missions and participated in four bombing missions while assigned to the Austrian front.

On February 4, 1919, Lt. Pirelli left McCook Field to conduct a test flight of an Italian-made aircraft built by the Ansaldo Corporation, Genova, Italy. After taking off in a modified A1 Balilla aircraft, he flew toward Wright Field, where his machine suddenly entered a nose-dive and plunged to earth. The day following his death, local Italian-Americans in Dayton assisted in making arrangements to send the body of Lt. Pirelli to his home in Milan. ...

... In January 1930 the Pirelli family requested, through the Italian Ambassador to the United States, that a small memorial be placed at the site of Lt. Pirelli’s crash. On March 12, 1930, a marker was formally dedicated at the Fairfield Air Depot (currently Area C, Wright-Patterson AFB) in memory of Lt. Pirelli.

The Count may have been a Parilli of a slightly different colour:

http://www.rootschat.com/links/0uuz/

Quote
There was, therefore, official concern that Husmann, or the Italian intermediary Count Parilli could react negatively to Wolff's listing as a war criminal and reassignment to Nuremberg.

I'm having to type that out, and it's all very complicated, so I'll let you look at it directly.


... hmm, actually, the britishnewspaperarchive Colin gave has something interesting in that regard but I don't subscribe -- perhaps there was another Count Parrilli?

Quote
Luigi Parrilli, and a Swiss, Dr. Max Husmann, on February 21. PLANNED DESTRUCTION The Swiss Telegraph Agency says that Parrilli had ...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luigi_Parrilli

Quote
Baron Luigi Parrilli was an Italian aristocrat a native of Genoa, who took part in the negotiations between SS leaders and the CIA's future director, Allen Dulles, during Operation Sunrise.

and apparently a Fascist sympathizer.

http://moversandshakersofthesmom.blogspot.ca/2008/08/luigi-parrilli.html

There must have been two Count/Baron-s Parrilli then. ;)

There is a tree at Ancestry/Mundia that shows Ruth Mary Mould 1904 as marrying 1931 in London, but does not disclose the name of her spouse and child. I would contact that tree owner. That can be done by registering (free of charge) at www.mundia.com and sending a private message.
HILL, HOARE, BOND, SIBLY, Cornwall (Devon); DENNIS, PAGE, WHITBREAD, Essex; BARNARD, CASTLE, PONTON, Wiltshire; SANKEY, HORNE, YOUNG, Kent; COWDELL, Bermondsey; COOPER, SMITH, FALLOWELL, WILLEY, Notts; CAMPION, CARTER, CRADDOCK, KENNY, Northants; LITTLER, CORNER, Leicestershire; RUSHLAND, Lincolnshire; MORRISON, Ireland; COLLINS, ?; ... MONCK?


Offline Cazo

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 68
  • South African Irish English Scottish Welsh French
    • View Profile
Re: Italian Count?
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 21 September 14 17:25 BST (UK) »
So I finally got myself an account and read the full newspaper report of this marriage and found that Count Giovanni, age 27 (therefore born c. 1904) was the son of the late Count Gacton Parrilli. Google, Ancestry, Findmypast are all drawing a blank. Anyone able to discover anything else on this family? Ages ago I found a history of Italian aristocrats online which included the Parrilli family (but of course couldn't find the initial Count Giovanni on it) - I have subsequently lost any reference to it so if anyone has any ideas on sites which may fit the bill it would be fantastic!
Gactan may be 'Gactano' or even a misprint of 'Gaetan'...?
South Africa, St Helena, Ireland, Scotland, England

Offline JaneyCanuck

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,031
  • The Famous Five take tea on Parliament Hill
    • View Profile
Re: Italian Count?
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 21 September 14 19:33 BST (UK) »
I would certainly guess that the father was Gaetan/Gaetano.

I think it might be reasonable to get Ruth's death certificate to see who the informant of death was:

Ruth Mary Parrilli
born 12 December 1904, aged 92 at death
death registered in January 1997
death registered in Yeoville, 7263B
register B06, entry 157

The couple could have had children outside England and one of them might have been present at her death, for instance.

If this Count too was involved with the Italian govt during WWII, the couple may have separated and she returned to England ...

One thing just to note is that there were only ever two Ruth Mary Moulds before the 1960s, births registered last quarter 1904 (probably yours) and first quarter 1905, both of whom married in 1931. Presumably the wedding announcement you have confirms the bride's father's name as making her your Ruth? ;)
(I imagine her father was Graham Harley Mould a barrister, although I can't track the other Ruth with parents.)

Did Ruth have siblings Graham Theodore, Ernest Harley, and Joy Gertrude Constance?
Mother was Mary Eleanor James, marriage 1898 Wandsworth, but it seems the Mould-James births post 1911 belong to a different marriage (possibly Albert Edward Mould, married 1903 Southwark), so that seems to be the total chlidren of the marriage.

Joy seems to have married twice, with 2 children to the first marriage.
She died in 2002 in Warminster.
(I will send you info about a child privately.)

Graham I find no further trace of. No wait, he died in Canada.
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/J69N-F38
and apparently was in the US just prior
https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/KY2S-YPZ
oddly he was a labourer ... and seems to have been 'debarred' when the ship docked ?
image: https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.3.1/TH-1951-22094-63302-79?cc=1916081
(father G Mould, seems to match)

Ernest on the other hand did well:
https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/42231/supplement/8901/data.pdf
Ordinary Officers of the Civil Division of the Most Excellent Order of the British Empire
'Ernest Harley Mould, Esq., Principal Assistant to the Remembrancer, Corporation of London'
... but his name is too common to identify a marriage.
He died in 1986 in Chichester.


Anyway I wonder whether you could find descendants of Joy, for instance, who might know more about Ruth.

HILL, HOARE, BOND, SIBLY, Cornwall (Devon); DENNIS, PAGE, WHITBREAD, Essex; BARNARD, CASTLE, PONTON, Wiltshire; SANKEY, HORNE, YOUNG, Kent; COWDELL, Bermondsey; COOPER, SMITH, FALLOWELL, WILLEY, Notts; CAMPION, CARTER, CRADDOCK, KENNY, Northants; LITTLER, CORNER, Leicestershire; RUSHLAND, Lincolnshire; MORRISON, Ireland; COLLINS, ?; ... MONCK?

Offline JaneyCanuck

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,031
  • The Famous Five take tea on Parliament Hill
    • View Profile
Re: Italian Count?
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 21 September 14 22:52 BST (UK) »
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01a2w/

1873 law report in which "Mr. Gaetano Parrilli" and others were respondents in an appeal brought by the Intendenza di Finanza (tax authority) of Salerno from a decision of the Naples Court of Appeal.

It would be a bit of a stretch for that to be the Gaetan Parrilli who had a child c1904, but it could be a grandfather ...

Certainly wealthy enough to have the tax authorities after him and be making his way through the appellate courts. My Italian doesn't go much farther than what I've put above though. ;) The case seems to have something to do with mills/millers (mugnai) but I don't know what -- it seems to be turning on points of law rather than fact.


And a contemporary person with the name:

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01a2x/

Google translate (with a bit of refining) says:
Quote
On June 29 (I think it is 2001), in accordance with Articles 4 and 7 of the Statute of the electoral rules, we elected the new board of directors of the Committee. Based on the votes obtained, the following were elected as members: ... Prof. Gaetano Parrilli ... . The officers will be decided at the next sitting of the Committee.
It is from the Institute for the History of the Italian Risorgimento, which seems to refer to 19th century Italian history.

Could this be another family member (if Ruth had children in Italy perhaps)?
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01a2z/
just given the Italian/English education and employment ...
edit - in view of age, too young to be a child of Ruth ...
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01a31/
HILL, HOARE, BOND, SIBLY, Cornwall (Devon); DENNIS, PAGE, WHITBREAD, Essex; BARNARD, CASTLE, PONTON, Wiltshire; SANKEY, HORNE, YOUNG, Kent; COWDELL, Bermondsey; COOPER, SMITH, FALLOWELL, WILLEY, Notts; CAMPION, CARTER, CRADDOCK, KENNY, Northants; LITTLER, CORNER, Leicestershire; RUSHLAND, Lincolnshire; MORRISON, Ireland; COLLINS, ?; ... MONCK?