how to find parents of ROBERT LAURIE

[Forfarian]

I am looking for the parents of ROBERT LAURIE. the only information I have is that he married jean scott in 1792 at carlike.
they are on the 1841 census at carlike, Robert is 60 years & a labourer, jean is aged 20.

Are you absolutely sure about that? If Robert is listed as 60 in 1841, that means he was born between 1776 and 1781. By 1792, he would therefore be at the very most 16 years of age. It was legal for a boy to marry at 16, but it is almost unheard of, especially among poorer labouring families where a boy of 16 would not be able to afford to support a wife. I would have thought that this must be a different Robert and Jean, not your Robert and Jean Scott.

[margmo1]

hi forfarian

I wonder if the 1841 census has the wrong ages listed.
my William Laurie on his death certificate in 1870 has his parents as Robert Laurie & Jean Scott.
when I started looking for the parents I could only find the one couple. they were the ones that married in 1792 at carluke.
Robert Laurie's death certificate in 1843 has him as aged 72 years & on jean's death certificate in 1868 is aged 92.
if I go by the ages at death it would make the couple in their early 20's at the time of their marriage in 1792.
on Family search I found the couple had 9 children, the eldest born in 1794 named THOMAS.
so could Robert's father be called Thomas.
thanks
margaret

[Forfarian]

So Robert aged 12 years between 1841 and 1843?

Yes. it's possible that ages on the census, or any other record, come to that, are incorrect. Or that they were correct in the original and wrong on a transcription.

I assume that you have checked the original of the census to make sure that you are not working from a transcription that could be wrong?

There were no death certificates until the start of civil registration in 1855, so whatever death record you have from 1843, it isn't a death certificate and it won't tell you who his parents were. The age could also be inaccurate on that record.

The 1841 census as transcribed on FreeCEN gives ages for them
Robert 60 (therefore DoB 1776/81)
Jean 65 (therefore DoB 1771/6)
William 25 (therefore DoB 1811/16)

The 1851 gives
Elizabeth 39 (therefore DoB 1811/12)
Jane 81 (therefore DoB 1769/70) born in Hobkirk, Roxburghshire

Incidentally I note with interest an Elizabeth Brown, 25, in the 1841 census, and a baptism of Elizabeth Brown Laurie in 1808 to Robert L and Jean Scott.

Unless the one in the census is that daughter with a wrong surname and wrong age (she would actually have been 31 or 32 and should have been listed as aged 30) I wonder if that might be a clue worth investigating? If she is the daughter, she would have been 42 by the 1851 census. so at least she was fibbing consistently about her age. Or maybe the one baptised in 1808 died, and the next child (not listed in the IGI) was named after her?

[margmo1]

hi
the 1841 census downloaded from scotlands people reads
Robert laurie 60
jane 65
William 25
eliz. brown 25

the 1851 census at carlike downloaded from SP reads
alex. cooper 35
eliz. brown 39
jane 5
Robert 2
jane laurie 81 born hopkirk

with the above jane (widow of Robert) being aged 81 it looks like wrong age given on the 1841 census, out by 10 years.
all very confusing.
regards
margaret

[Forfarian]

the 1851 census at carlike downloaded from SP reads
eliz. brown 39

Which just goes to show the importance of the original - the FreeCEN Transcription gives her surname as Cooper.

Since Jane/Jean's age on the 1841 and that on the 1851 are incompatible, at least one of them must definitely be wrong.

If you have her death certificate, you must have her parents' names? Have you found her baptism?

[margmo1]

hi
I have downloaded the birth of Jane Scott from SP.
She was born on 5.6.1769 at Hopkirk. father is John Scott a gardener, no mother named.
but on her death certificate her father is John Scott a gardener &  mother is named as Jeanie Lawson or Hawson, writing is poor.
so I think it is the 1841 census that is wrong & I think ROBERT LAURIE must have been born circa 1771. found 4 births on SP between 1769 - 1772 but not in Lanarkshire. but on the IGI there is a birth in 1771 at Carstairs. Parents Thomas Laurie & Mary Forrest.
Robert & Jean named their first son THOMAS!!! (grasping at straws )
thanks for your help
margaret

[JMStrachan]

I suspect you've grasped at the right straw!

You know with certainty that your ancestor William Laurie died in 1870 and that his death certificate names his parents as Robert Laurie and Jean Scott. According to the 1851 census, William Laurie had just one son who was named Robert, indicating that William’s father was named Robert.

William’s age in the census indicates he was born about 1814. FamilySearch has a birth of William Lawrie at Carluke on 23 December 1814 with baptism 9 January 1814, parents Robert Lawrie and Jean Scott.

Births of children of Robert Lawrie and Jean Scott on FamilySearch are:
1794 Thomas Lawrie at Carluke
1796 Mary Lawrie at Carluke
1798 Martha Lawrie at Carluke
1800 James Brown Lawrie at Carluke
1803 Janet Lawrie at Carluke
1806 Jean Lawrie at Carluke
1808 Elizabeth Brown Lawrie at Carluke
1811 John Lawrie at Carluke
1813 William Lawrie at Carluke

The marriage of Robert Lawrie and Jean Scott therefore fits the one on 7 July 1792 at Carluke.

This also fits the 1841 census entry of:
Lauries Hall, Carluke, Lanarkshire
Robert Laurie labourer age 60
Jean Laurie age 65
William Laurie age 25
Elizabeth Brown age 25
(Elizabeth could have been their daughter Elizabeth Brown Lawrie born 1808)

So now you are looking for the birth and parents of Robert Laurie. From the 1841 census Robert would have been born between 1776 and 1781, and according to the burial record you found of Robert Lawrie at Carluke in 1843 his birth would have been in 1770 or 1771. But neither of those ages may have been accurate. His eldest son was named Thomas, which could indicate the likely first name of Robert’s father.

FamilySearch has Robert Lowrie baptised 1 December 1771 to Thomas Lowrie and Mary Forrest at Carstairs. Carstairs isn’t far from Carluke, and this is the only entry that looks feasible, so either it’s the right Robert or Robert’s baptism isn’t recorded.

Thomas Lawrie and Mary Forrest had the following children baptised:
1762 Robert Laurie at Lanark
1764 Janet Laurie at Lanark
1766 James Laurie at Lanark
1767 Anna Laurie at Lanark
1769 Margaret Laurie at Lanark
1771 Robert Laurie at Carstairs

It looks as if their first son Robert died, and between 1769 to 1771 they had moved to Carstairs, which is a neighbouring parish to Lanark.

Difficult to say with certainty going back that far, but I’d say there’s a good chance Robert Lawrie’s parents were Thomas Lawrie and Mary Forrest.

[margmo1]

thank you for putting all the information down in order.
I know there is no definite proof that Robert's father is Thomas Laurie but he is the likely candidate.
still wonder where the 'brown' name comes from - Elizabeth BROWN Laurie & James BROWN Laurie.
I will do more digging.
thanks again
margaret

[margmo1]

having found out that Robert laurie died in 1843 & was buried in carluke ,does anyone know the name of the cemetery in carluke & where I could find out the lair number.
thanks
margaret