Author Topic: Czech? family imigrating to Germany  (Read 1072 times)

Offline mermaid-nl

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Czech? family imigrating to Germany
« on: Sunday 26 July 09 23:21 BST (UK) »
Hi guys,

I've been trying to figure this out for ages.....I've got Czech ancestors (at least they were born in Czechoslovakia at the time) that moved to Germany.  Has anyone got any tips on how I can find them?  I'm really stuck and don't know where to look....

My great grandfather was:

Franz (Franisek) Kundratek
b: 9 April 1836 in 19 Posvatna, Kelch, Czech Republic

....he married ( 7 November 1865 Pfarriche in Kelch, Czech Republic)

...Franziska Ficek
b: 19 April 1845 in Kelch, Czech Republic.

Franisek and Franziska daughter....

......Emilie Rozena Kundratek (my grandmother)
 b: 13 August 1884 in Olmutz, Kelch, Czech Republic.
d: 27 Jan 1961 in Mettmann, Germany.

  Emilie married:

....Siegmund Wesely (my grand father)
b: 23 May 1883 in Olmutz, Vsetine, Czech Republic
d: 15 Sept 1951 in Diepensiepen 42, Mettmann, Germany

...Siegmund parents were:

...Innozenz Veseley (father)
b: 31 Aug 1850 in 98 Stupawa, Oswietman, Czech Republic
d: 24 Nov 1910

....Josepha Kundratek (mother)
b: 25 June 1850 in 19 Postvatna, Kelch, Czech Republic.
d: 30 March 1935 in Eiringhausen, Germany

...Siegmunds parents were first cousins...

All this information I have gathered from copies of old documents that my mother had and were passed on to me when she died.

I'd love to go back further and discover more but have no idea how to go about it.

I have check some of it out but believe I may have got some things wrong as some of the writing is very hard to read.

Any ideas from anyone or a gentle shove in the right direction would be greatly appreciated... :)
Martin London / Dodd Essex, East Indies/ Cantan Pembroke, Maidstone)

Offline JustinL

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,804
    • View Profile
Re: Czech? family imigrating to Germany
« Reply #1 on: Monday 27 July 09 12:44 BST (UK) »
Hello,

I was intrigued by your posting, so I did a bit of digging.

When researching European ancestry, you have to establish the old and current names of the towns and the name of the territory at the time they lived.

Czechoslakia did not exist until the end of WWI. Your ancestors came from Moravia (Maehren in German) a province of the Austro-Hungarian empire.

Posvatna (= sacred in Czech) must have been the name of as street in the city of Olmütz (Olomouc in Czech), which was the regional capital for a time.

Keltsch (Kelč in Czech) lies to the east Olomouc.

Vsetin is south of Olomouc, east of Brno.

Stupava must be close to the village of Oswetiman (Osvětimany in Czech).

This region was probably regarded as the Sudentenland, which Hitler annexed in 1938. It is possible (likely) that your grandparents were dispossesed after WWII and even driven out of the post-war Czechoslavkia, thus explaining the deaths in Germany.

I'm afraid I can't tell you whether any records have survived anywhere.

Justin

Offline mermaid-nl

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: Czech? family imigrating to Germany
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 29 July 09 00:34 BST (UK) »
Thanks Justin,

This has given me a lead to folow  :)

At least I now know where to begin.  I do appreciate your time and feed-back.  Looks like I'm going to be busy for a while.  I'm lucky enough to have some old photos of my grandparents and am going to post them in the photo restoration forum because I think they must be quite old and would like to have them restored.

Thanks again for your input and tips, very helpful....

Ursula
Martin London / Dodd Essex, East Indies/ Cantan Pembroke, Maidstone)

Offline JustinL

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,804
    • View Profile
Re: Czech? family imigrating to Germany
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 29 July 09 07:04 BST (UK) »
Hello Ursula,

I have found a couple of good maps showing most of the villages and towns. Osvetimany is the smallest, and difficult to locate.

Franz and Franziska married in the Pfarrkirche von St. Peter und St. Paul in Kelc.

German settlers had been invited to Olomouc is early as the 13th century. The dialect of German spoken there apparently suggests that German settlers from Silesia came in later.

It's an interesting area to research, beautiful to visit too!

Justin


Offline mermaid-nl

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: Czech? family imigrating to Germany
« Reply #4 on: Wednesday 29 July 09 21:42 BST (UK) »
Hi Justin,

Wow you've got me on a mission now!  I can't leave this alone....have you got any connections to Moravia because you seem to know what you're talking about....

Ok one more question.....are my ancestors Czech then?  I can't figure it out, at the time of their birth, the land was under (as you said) Austro-Hungarian rule.

Sorry if I sound dim but I've only just started researching this and am still very confused by it all.

Thanks once again for your help.

Ursula
Martin London / Dodd Essex, East Indies/ Cantan Pembroke, Maidstone)

Offline JustinL

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,804
    • View Profile
Re: Czech? family imigrating to Germany
« Reply #5 on: Thursday 30 July 09 08:02 BST (UK) »
Ursula,

My research has not taken me to Moravia yet, but it has necessitated learning a lot about central European history, which I find fascinating anyway.

Moreover, as I  can read German, I can find things out quickly.

Judging by the surnames (and I am no expert), I would say that both the Kundrateks and the Veselys were ethnic Czechs. However, Siegmund is pretty much an exclusively Germanic forename. There was (is) a town in Moravia called Vesely.

Have you looked in the IGI (familysearch.org)? There are a lot of Vesely records.

Justin







Offline mermaid-nl

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 340
    • View Profile
Re: Czech? family imigrating to Germany
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 30 July 09 22:03 BST (UK) »
Hi Justin,

Thanks once again for the feedback.  I did find the town called Veseley which is very close (if I'm not mistaken) where my family originated from.

I'm absolutely fascinated with this family now and can't leave it alone! 

I should imagine speaking German would help, I speak Dutch which is similar so have a bit of a head-start with translations.

I have visited Vsetine (a long time ago) but unfortunately didn't get the chance to do much research with 2 little kids and a nagging (ex) husband ::)

I hope to go back one day.....
Martin London / Dodd Essex, East Indies/ Cantan Pembroke, Maidstone)