Looking for Mary PENPRASE or PINPRAZE in Camborne

[osprey]

1871 census for Mary & family
2 Carno Street, Uchlawrcoed, Rumney, Bedwellty RG10/5329 folio 62 pg 47
William Penphase head mar 50 mason b. Cornwall
Elizabeth wife 45 b. Cornwall
William son 12 b. Monmouthshire
Grace dau 10 b. Monmouthshire
Mary A dau 7 b. Somersetshire
Richard H son 6 b. Somersetshire
John P son 2 b. Glamorgan

Possible birth reg for William jnr
William Caddy Penprase march qtr 1858 Abergavenny vol 11a pg 80
& Grace
Grace Penrose Penprase sept qtr 1861 Bedwellty vol 11a pg 74
which makes the 1857 marriage registered Abergavenny look likely.

[G_B_W]

Thank you, osprey,
That looks as though it may be the right family. May I ask how you searched for that? I haven't found any of that 1871 census information by searching for William Penphase.

[Ruskie]

Well done Osprey. I was tearing my hair out searching for that family last night.  I tried dozens of variations of the surname. Did you find it on FindMyPast?

[osprey]

I hadn't tried FindMyPast, it was the other one! Think it has been transcribed as Pemprase or similar but that's not what it says on the actual census. I searched for William, blank surname, born 1821 Cornwall, living in Monmouthshire.. They should have been in the area in 1861, but there's quite a lot missing around there.

 

[Ruskie]

I hadn't tried FindMyPast, it was the other one! Think it has been transcribed as Pemprase or similar but that's not what it says on the actual census. I searched for William, blank surname, born 1821 Cornwall, living in Monmouthshire.. They should have been in the area in 1861, but there's quite a lot missing around there.

 

Well found! I had no luck at all. I think maybe it was the Pem rather than Pen that threw me.

It just goes to show that it is well worth getting as many people on the case as possible. 

[osprey]

just had another look for 1861 & came across this entry

10 Back Row, Aberystruth RG9/ 3997 folio 64 pg 44
William Penprase head mar 40 b. Camborne, Cornwall
Elis wife 34 b. Gwendron, Cornwall
William son 3 b. Monmouthshire
Richard H son 11 m b. Aberystruth

death reg
Richard Henry Pennrase mar qtr 1863 Bedwellty vol 11a pg 59

Church record of their marriage shows William's father as Henry, a miner and Elizabeth's as William Caddy, also a miner.

[G_B_W]

Thank you all for the research! I am astonished at your skills and persistence. I also ordered the marriage certificate for Thomas Williams and Mary. It will try my patience to wait for the copies for confirmation, but this feels like the right family. Thanks you, again.

[G_B_W]

I received Mary Panprase's birth certificate and the marriage certificate for Thomas Williams and Mary Penprase (notice the two spellings). I'm happy to report that the Mary noted in the 1871 census does, indeed, seem to be my great grandmother.

1871 census for Mary & family
2 Carno Street, Uchlawrcoed, Rumney, Bedwellty RG10/5329 folio 62 pg 47
William Penphase head mar 50 mason b. Cornwall
Elizabeth wife 45 b. Cornwall
William son 12 b. Monmouthshire
Grace dau 10 b. Monmouthshire
Mary A dau 7 b. Somersetshire
Richard H son 6 b. Somersetshire
John P son 2 b. Glamorgan

On the birth certificate her father, William, is listed as a journeyman mason and the mother, Elizabeth, is formerly Caddy. Mary Anne was born 7 Nov 1864 on King Street, Taunton.

The marriage certificate has some tantalizing clues about Thomas. Thomas and Mary were married in the Wesleyan Chapel 02 March 1885. Mary, 21 and a spinster, is listed as residing at Tolcarne St, Camborne; her father is William, a mason. Thomas, a Tin Miner, is listed as residing in Troon, Camborne. His father is listed as Edwin Williams, deceased, also a Tin Miner. Thomas is listed as age 33 and as a widower. His death certificate from 1898 lists the informant as his daughter Rose. Rose does not appear in the 1911 census with Mary Williams and the other children so I presume she was older and already married. Possibly she is a daughter from Thomas' earlier marriage. There is one inconsistency. The death certificate from 1898 lists Thomas' age as 50, indicating birth year of 1848. The marriage certificate from 1885 lists his age as 33, indicating a birth year of 1852.

Any suggestions for future research? Thank you for the help!

[osprey]

accoring to the 1901 census, Rose was the couple's eldest child. RG13/2243 folio 39 pg 20.

Do you have the family on the 1891 census to confirm place of birth for Thomas?
By the way, it's not unknown for someone to loose a few years at time of marriage if the person they're marrying is several years younger than them. Again, the census entry could help.

I've given you William & Elizabeth's marriage in a previous post and the names of their fathers.

You can access transcriptions of many parish records on the Cornwall opc database
http://www.cornwall-opc-database.org/search-database/person-search/