The Mysterious James NEWBERRY

[Newberrychaser]

Hello Rootschatters:

Oh, here we are back again with the Newberry's of England and America.  I have a new question to posit to those of you who are historical anglophiles.  Thomas Newberry one of the first to show up in America circa 1633/34 was married to two Dabinott women.  Actually in doing some more medieval work, I ran into the d' Abetot surname and wondered if this was not a permutation of the Dabinott name.  In doing a bit of research, it seems that the Despenser's were actually d'Abetot's but took the name Despenser.  Here is what wikipedia has to say about it:

"The origin of the surname Spencer (also Spence, Spender, Spens, and Spenser) can be traced directly to Robert d'Abbetot[2][3][4] who is listed as Robert le Dispenser, a tenant-in-chief of several counties, in the Domesday Book of 1086. Robert was possibly one of the Norman knights who fought alongside (or accompanied) William the Conqueror in the defeat of Harold II, King of England at the Battle of Hastings in 1066. There is little doubt that both Robert and his brother Urse came to England at about the time of the Battle of Hastings. They were both beneficiaries of William over the years, and were given titles and substantial land and property—suggesting repayment for some earlier deeds. It is likely that Robert's first acknowledgment was his official appointment as Royal "Dispencier" sometimes expressed more grandly as "Royal Steward", "King's Steward" or "Lord Steward". As dispenser of provisions to the King and his household Robert was known and recorded as Robert le Despencer or, in its Latinised form, Robertus Dispensator.[5] There is also the possibility that Robert held this official position before arriving in England.[6]"

So my question is, does anyone know if the Dabinott name may have been handed down through Urse, and the origin of the name is actually Abetot?  Dear Moderator, if you think it is better to move this to it's own space, I would appreciate your wisdom on the subject.

[alunno-a]

Spencer/Spenser etc is an occupation surname like smith- a spenser was a servant like a steward.
 I don't think Spensers are ALL descended from one frenchman!

Is Abbetot not an old french placename? d'Abbetot meaning a land owner of Abbetot, of "from" Abbetot? Sounds too far off Dabinott to me.- differant vocal altogether. ( double "T"- extra "N"- soft b/v etc??)- there's probably a better place for this question- as you say..good luck.

[MilDot]

Re the Dabinett name and origins. Possible origins of the Dabinett name:

DABIN: (French) Diminutive of DABB (a diminutive of Robert), based on the first name of the ancestor's father.
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http://worldconnect.rootsweb.com/cgi-bin/igm.cgi?op=GET&db=sanderstocaesar&id=I08918 Contact Bob Sanders, Title: SandersTo Caesar

This relates the marriage of Thomas Newberry, b 10 Nov 1594 in Yarcombe, Devonshire, England to Jane Dabinott, dau. of Christopher, who was born abt 1600 in Yarcombe and died in 1655 ‘in the colonies”.

Birth and ordinances: IGI film 7834730, sheet 91; call# 1126453
In son John's records: Christening and ordinances: IGI film 7315909, Sheet 71; call # 822780
In sons John's records: Christening and ordinances: IGI film 8507303, sheet 33; call # 1395969
In daughter Mary's record: Christening and ordinances: IGI film 8507303, sheet 32; call # 1395969
In son Joseph's records: Birth and ordinances: IGI film 7315909, sheet 72; call # 822780
Dau. Sarah's record: Birth and ordinances: IGI film 7315909, sheet 72; call # 822780
Son Benj. record: Birth and ordinances: IGI film 7315909, sheet 71; call # 822780
Dau. Mary's record: Birth and ordinances: IGI film 7315909, sheet 71; call # 822780
***********************
Entries: 26696    Updated: 2007-02-02 Contact: Robert M. Sanders  
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ID: I08918
Name: Jane Dabinott , W253.40, Img 1 2 3 4 5
Sex: F
Birth: ABT 1600 in Yarcombe, co., Devon, England
Birth: ABT 1600
Death: 23 APR 1655 in in the colonies
Event: AKA (Facts Page) Dabinett
Reference Number: 8921
Note: Also married Joan Dabinott (probably a cousin & 2nd marriage to Newberry)

Father: Christopher Dabinett , W253.40 b: BET 3 FEB 1562 AND 1563 in Yarcombe, co., Devon, England
Mother: NN wife of Dabinett Jane b: ABT 1580 in England

Marriage 1 Thomas Newberry , W253.40, Img b: 10 NOV 1594 in Yarcombe, co., Devon, England
Children
 Sarah Newberry , Img b: 1614 in Devonshire, England
 Mary Newberry , IMG21 b: 22 OCT 1626 in Devonshire, England

Sources: Title: Ancestral Roots of Certain American Colonists, (W) - Weis, Author: Frederick Lewis Weis, GPC 7th ed., Publication: "W" + number refers to the Line in the associated book, Note: 100%, Repository:
Media: Book, Title: Immigrant Ancestors (IMG)-Virkus, Author: Frederick Virkus, GPC 1942, Note: Img-V indicates that the source is from the seven volumes. Img and a number (Eq, Img6), indicates that it comes from the extraction of Vol VI published separately as an Index. Repository: Note: "IMG" + number denotes book and page number, Page: pg 50 Index, Title: See Husbands sources, Author: same as husband, Title: A Genealogical Dict' of the First Settlers of New Eng- Savage, Author: James Savage, Publication: Genealogical Pub. Co. Note: "A Genealogical Dictionary of the First Settlers of New England" by James Savage; The Genealogical Publishing Company, Inc.; Baltimore, Maryland; 1981 (929.274 S264 LAPL) (NE Sec. SR)
Page: pg 269 Vol III. Title: Pioneers of Massachusetts - Chas Pope, Author: Charles Henry Pope; Publication: Genealogical Publishing Company, Note: "Pioneers of Massachusetts" by Charles Henry Pope; Genealogical Publishing Company, Inc; Baltimore, Maryland; 1900 (974.4 P81P ACPL) 1635, March 4: Page: pg 326
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Dorset, England, Marriages and Banns, 1813-1921

Name: Bertie Dabinett, Bachelor, Birth Year: abt 1894, Age: 26, Occ: House Decorator, Address: 6 South Walks, Fordington, Marriage or Bann Date: 25 Apr 1920. Parish: Fordington St George, Father's name: George John Dabinett; Occ: House Decorator, Spouse's Name: Beatrice Mary Newbury, spinster, Age: 28
Address: 4 Arlington Road, Fordington, Spouse's Father's Name: Joseph Newbury; Occ: Labourer, Married by: Rev Grovesner Bartelot, Vicar. Witnesses: Joseph Newbury and Wilfred Joseph Newbury, Married after Banns, Source Citation: Dorset History Centre, Dorset Parish Registers, PE/FOR(SG).

Bertie Dabinett is the uncle of my 4th cousin

[Newberrychaser]

Thank you for the responses, I have been looking a little deeper into this and discovered the following on:

http://www.oxforddnb.com/auth/login.jsp?url=%2Fsubscribed%2F
Abetot, Urse d' (c.1040–1108), administrator, derived his name from St Jean d'Abbetot, near Tancarville (Seine Inférieure) where he was probably born. He appears in Domesday Book as a tenant-in-chief in the counties of Hereford, Gloucester, Warwick, and Worcester, and as a subtenant in Dorset, Oxfordshire, and Wiltshire. He is styled ‘Urso de Wirecestre’ from his position as sheriff of Worcestershire, an office which he held from shortly after the Norman conquest. William of Malmesbury, describing him as vicecomes Wigorniae a rege constitutus (‘appointed sheriff of Worcester by the king’) , tells the story of his encroaching on the cemetery of Worcester Cathedral priory to make the ditch around his castle, and being sternly rebuked by Archbishop Ealdred (d. 1069): ‘Hattest thu Urs, haue thu Godes kurs’ (De gestis pontificum, 253). Urse earned a reputation in Worcestershire as a predator on monastic lands, especially those of the monks of Worcester: in one case he seized a manor as a marriage portion for his daughter, and Evesham Abbey, too, suffered at his hands. However, he was a benefactor of Great Malvern Priory, which, during a fourteenth-century lawsuit, claimed him as its founder. On the revolt of the earl of Hereford in 1075 he joined Bishop Wulfstan of Worcester and Abbot Æthelwig of Evesham in defeating the earl's forces.

In the reign of William II, d'Abetot was a prominent official in the royal administration. He remained sheriff of Worcestershire for life, and died in the course of 1108, when he was succeeded in his lands and office by his son Roger, who was banished c.1110 after killing an officer of Henry I. Roger d'Abetot was in turn succeeded as sheriff of Worcestershire by Osbert d'Abetot, who held office until a date between 1113 and 1116. Osbert was probably a brother of Urse and the ancestor of the d'Abetots who were prominent in Worcestershire in the twelfth and thirteenth centuries, and who gave their name to the places Croome d'Abitot and Redmarley d'Abitot. Urse's daughter was probably named Emmeline; Dugdale identified her from a register of the dean and chapter of Worcester—presumably register II (now lost), since she is not named either in register I or in the rental of 1240. She married Walter (I) de Beauchamp (d. c.1133), who acquired the estates of Urse. The cognizance of the bear, borne by their descendants, the Beauchamp earls of Warwick, signified descent from Urse (ursus, Latin ‘the bear’). Urse was also survived by a widow, Alice. His brother, Robert Dispenser (surnamed from his office in the royal household), had died about 1097, and some, at least, of his estates were acquired by Urse, but were subsequently divided between the Beauchamp and Marmion families, suggesting that Robert was survived by a daughter, married to Robert Marmion.

J. H. Round, rev. Emma Mason
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I have looked into the wills of Christopher Dabinott and his brother in my research.  There doesn't seem to be anything there that gives more information about the origins of their name.  I am aware of the marriages to Thomas Newberry by the Dabinott women. 

This all relates back through the Bore Badge of Richard III  see http://www.r3.org/rnt1991/deadlyboar.html  where the Neuburghs, Despenser and d'Abetot familes were allied in some way around 1066.

[Linda63]

Hi there,

It's been a while since I've been on here.  I gave the family tree a rest for about 18months as I'd got very stuck.

So here I am again with fresh eyes, ready to crack on with the tree.

The last time I was here there was some uncertainty about the parents of Arabella Ansel, my 6th Great Grandmother.  Has anyone made any progress?

I think I have discovered her parents to be Thomas Ansell (b Ickleford c1694-1728) and Elizabeth Richardson (b Arlesey c1694-).

Can anyone confirm this?

[bedfordshire boy]

There's a baptism in Ickleford on 16 Jan 1715 of an Arabella Ansel, daughter of Thomas and Elizabeth, which fits with a 1733 marriage. I'm not sure there's ever been uncertainty about Arabella, just about her husband. And with him it's not so much uncertainty as simply that no-one has a clue where he was from!

David

[Linda63]

Thanks for confirming that.

I have Arabella's husband as Joseph Newberay b. Arlesey, Beds c1714,  Is that correct?

As I said, I've come back to this after about 18 months so I'm picking over notes, trying to make sense of where I got to last time.  So your help is much appreciated.   

[bedfordshire boy]

See reply #18 in this thread. There's no evidence at all that he was born in Arlesey, and as the family is referred to as Newberry alias Monk in early baptisms there's a chance he may have been a Monk, but I've not found such a connection. I have a horrible feeling that the Newberry line is likely to be stuck with Joseph born say 1712.

[bedfordshire boy]

I now have uncertainty about Arabella, or more specifically, about her parents. The marriage you quote shows on the IGI, extracted, as taking place in Sep 1714 in Holwell, which fits very nicely. However the Allen Marriage Index on the HALS site shows it taking place on 3 Sep 1719, which doesn't fit at all (Thomas of Ickleford). I would want to check the parish register to see which of these years is correct. The IGI I hope!