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Beginners => Family History Beginners Board => Topic started by: mixyblob on Friday 21 December 07 21:50 GMT (UK)
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Hi,
I have an entry in an 1861 census for a boy aged 7 whose relationship with the head is detailed as a boarder. He is obviously being provided with food and lodgings but has anyone found one to be a family member?
Thanks
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Hmmm :-\ I think I did a census look-up for someone recently where a grandson was described as 'boarder'.
Probably un-usual but possible.
Do you have any other evidence to support the relationships within this particular family?
Suey
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I see this was your first post! - Welcome to Rootschat mixyblob... :D
Suey
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Hello and a warm welcome to Rootschat :)
Yes, I've seen it several times - grandchildren, nieces, nephews, in-laws described as "boarder".
Anna
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Thanks for your replies Anna & Suey.
The young boy was my great great grandfather. Yes there is a strong possibility of a family link but I am having trouble proving it. One of the daugters of the Head of family that census day went on to be his guardian. Not sure what that actually means at the moment !
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Welcome to Rootchat, Mixy
I had a similar case for a 71yr old, described as Boarder, he was living with the family of a younger cousin (as Head)(I had already the connection from a descendant).
What was interesting, is that his wife is also in the same house,but in a differant room, as Head. As the husband died that year, and the wife , the next I can only think that she was not fit enough to care for him.
Only a guess but seems to make sense
Spring
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Hi mixyblob
Welcome to rootschat! :)
I found quite a few "boarders" during my searches. My 4x Gt Grandparents seemed to send their children to a family in Sussex (they lived in Surrey) to board with an unrelated family. I still don't know the reasons or why this family. I might find one day the relationship between them!
Another episode i found was my Carlton family who had a 2year old "boarder" She appeared in a 1851 census and then there was no sign of her in 1861. I was wondering at the time if it was a daughter of one of the unmarried daughters but with a different last name i was only clutching at straws. Also the Carlton family didn't appear to have other relatives where they were in Bristol (parents being from Ireland and a big brickwall so don't know if she was a neice etc) so can't make a link for her. Quite young to not be with parents.
Those are some of my examples of this happening, but unfortunately i have not been able to crack any of the relationships, hopefully one day though!
Do you know his parents? Maybe a birth cert might reveal who his parents are and possibly a link!
Good luck with your search!
Cat :)
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I found an ancestor listed on the census as a "lodger" but that was crossed out and replaced with "relative." In fact, the man was the husband of the head of household who had suddenly reappeared after a mysterious 25-year absence during which his wife had listed herself as a widow.
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Hi mixyblob, welcome to Rootschat!
(http://www.smilieshq.com/smilies/sign0016.gif) (http://www.smilieshq.com)
On the census for my gt gt grandparents there was a thirteen year old girl living with them who was listed as Boarder. Her surname was the same as my gt gt grandmother's maiden name, so I was pretty sure she was a relative. After much digging I found that she was the illegitimate daughter of my gt gt grandmother. She married when she was an adult, in the surname of my gt gt grandfather. That one was certainly confusing!
I have found several other Boarders who were related to the family, sometimes quite distantly. It has often paid off for me to follow up these people if I suspect that they are related.
(http://www.smilieshq.com/smilies/happy0062.gif) (http://www.smilieshq.com)
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When completing the census the people are listed as relation to the head if there was no relation boarder may have been given even if they were in fact related to other people in the same household.
In one census i have a 2 year old listed as visitor it turns out she is the niece of the wife (wouldn't she be the husbands niece also?)
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Hi, yes it does happen .
My hubby's G, G Grandfather is listed as boarder in his own daughter's house ( it's his son - in- law who's head of the household)
In my hubby's G G grandfather's case I've just taken it to mean he was probably paying for his keep/ paying his own way in the household.
I also have another one that is listed as boarder and she is the aunt to the head of our household.
I always tend to check out the boarders in the household because sometimes some of them do turn out to be close family members
Boarder supposedly means that they share the dinner table etc with the family, ie they live with the family unit . So I think the term boarder can sometimes technically apply to a family member who is paying their own way.
Whilst a lodger supposedly has separate a room or rooms , meals etc to the family.
Kind Regards
:)
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Hello and welcome to Rootschat! Yes, I have found "boarders" to be family members....it is certainly worth the effort to check out those entries. You never know that that "boarder" could be a vital link for you. Happy hunting! Pat
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My husband`s great granddad was described as a `boarder` on the 1861 & 1871 censuses when he was just a child of 2 & 12 years old respectfully. I found his birth certificate with just his mother`s name on and it transpires that he was illegitimate, conceived during the time between her first and second marriages. He was brought up by an unrelated family who worked on the canals and I presume these would be known to his mother because her first husband had been a lock-keeper prior to his death. I did read somewhere that there were ladies who reared other people`s illegitimate children as boarders and they were called `boarding women` Unfortunately I cannot now find that article because I would have liked to copy it for my records and I would like to know if these women were paid for looking after the child, considering that the alternative would have probably been an orphanage or the dreaded workhouse. Has anyone else heard this term `boarding women` and if so where did they find the information please?
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I've had one where he was recorded as boarder - he wasn't biologically related to the head of the house, but he was related to the wife
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Actually just thought once a 'boarder' turned out to be the fiancee of the son (also living in the house) they got married the week after
I agree that boarder often seems to mean that they paid board and lodge
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On a similar vein it was common for people with large families that could not afford to feed some of the children to "board" them with other relatives. Often as unpaid workers - but fed and " boarded".
They would normally be listed as Nephew or niece or similar - but boarder was also common.
cheers
Jack Gee
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My great grandfather is identified as a boarder, in his mother and stepfather's household in the 1871 census.
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Actually just thought once a 'boarder' turned out to be the fiancee of the son (also living in the house) they got married the week after
I agree that boarder often seems to mean that they paid board and lodge
I've got a similar situation on 1891 Census. The boarder later married a niece of his landlady.
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In one census i have a 2 year old listed as visitor it turns out she is the niece of the wife (wouldn't she be the husbands niece also?)
I think it depends how you define niece. The niece you mentioned was presumably the child of one of the wife's siblings, so technically not the niece of the husband. In the same way that my husband's sister in law is married to his brother not mine, so as far as I'm concerned she's not my sister in law. My sister in law is the person who married my brother.
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Hello
'Boarder' or 'Visitor' may be related, or may not be related, to someone in the residence household.
On my Mother's side of my family, I have a 'Visitor' aged 8, in the 1841 Census and her surname is the same as the maiden surname of the Wife of the Head of the household, so likely related.
Orphan
Also seen a 'Boarder' who had been orphaned and living with relatives.
Religion
Also seen a 'Boarder' living in a family linked with the same religion.
Although my family were not Quakers, they had business links with Quakers in the 1830s onward and I have got a later 'Boarder' relative apparently living with a Quaker family.
You may ask what use is the same religion with 'Boarder' and his residence family? However, if one side of your family are untraceable circa 1780 - 1841, it may suggest Nonconformism and these may be vital clues for the family historian, to investigate and probe in greater detail.
Nonconformism is a great nuisance when tracing your family history, because it is my belief that probably as many as 35 to 50% of Nonconformist (NC) Chapel Birth / Baptism records were not kept 18th Century or have not survived.
We can often prove a NC, Independent (later Congregational), Dissenters, Baptist, or Presbyterian (some became Unitarian) Chapels existed, but there are no surviving Birth records.
Works at Same Workplace or Apprenticed to Head or Household Family Member
There sometimes seem to be an occupation link, between the 'Boarder' and a member of the Residence Family.
Mark
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I have one example. Marked as 'lodger' rather than father in 1871 Census aged 92. He was living with a sons family. He died 1871 and had been married to a sister of my gggrandfather.
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Hi and welcome to rootschat ;D
Short answer is yes, the enumerator wrote down what they were told, by the adult of the household, by a child who answered the door, by a neighbour and sometimes just write what they thought they knew without asking anyone.
In one census my great grandfather is written as grandson ( living with his grandparents) two other children were written as visitors and an adult was written as a lodger, after research the two visitors were my great grandfathers full siblings ( great grandfather was using his maternal grandparents surname so his name was different to his siblings) the adult was a sibling to my great great grandmother
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Very interested in this question and am hopping on board to ask another linked query
So my grandmother was a boarder age 1 in a family related to her birth parents by profession in Birkenhead
Boarder does imply payments
Her father was ordered to pay a weekly amount to birth mother
an affiliation order til child would be 13 years old
The single mother left to work was in Manchester 2 years later
Would the father have paid the host family directly
When such orders were made how did the single mothers obtain their payments
Did they have to collect at equivalent of benefits office
Did the named fathers have to take the weekly payments directly
Was there some kind of payment system via post office
Wonder if my grandmother knew payments were made for her....did her father manage to fulfil court ordered maintenance til she was 13
In cases where single mothers married but child stayed in boarding house would payments still be legally binding
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By visitor they may just have meant she's only visiting - ie she's staying tonight (so correctly marked on the census as here) but going home in the morning
I have one on a census as boarder - technically he's not related to the head of the house - but they took in their orphaned niece (his brother's child) and the 'boarder' is the little girl's grandfather (her mother's father)
I'm sure I read somewhere that boarder meant they had meals etc as part of the family, whereas Lodgers rented a room but made own arrangements for food etc
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I have a case in my own tree where son, daughter-in-law and two children are recorded as boarders in the household of the son's parents.
Bev
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England Wales Census 1881
Under the occupants of a house besides the Head and the Wife of the head (property owners?)
There were two other entries entitled “Boarder Head”. In each instance both parties had a wife and one included a son (separate family units?) .
What does the term “Boarder Head” mean, please. Does it mean the “Head” and his wife owned a property containing two extra units occupied separately by “Boarder Heads” or some other explanation? There was nothing on the record to explain the possibility of extra separate dwelling space within the residence. Thanks for any explanations offered. Regards – Dinny.
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My grandmother was a toddler boarding in 1901 but by 1911 she was down as adoptive daughter of head of house so maybe the birth parends had stopped paying. Her mother got married respectably in 1903 and her birth father had court cases to pay in 1906
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I discovered relatives listed as "boarder" and "visitor" on one census --- by tracing them on earlier and later censuses including in different households, in most cases the relationship revealed itself. Happy hunting, and welcome.
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England Wales Census 1881
Under the occupants of a house besides the Head and the Wife of the head (property owners?)
There were two other entries entitled “Boarder Head”. In each instance both parties had a wife and one included a son (separate family units?).
What does the term “Boarder Head” mean, please. Does it mean the “Head” and his wife owned a property containing two extra units occupied separately by “Boarder Heads” or some other explanation? There was nothing on the record to explain the possibility of extra separate dwelling space within the residence. Thanks for any explanations offered. Regards – Dinny.
Hello
Just one small point, the England & Wales Census were originally made of everybody, regardless of whether they owned or rented the property in which they lived. For example, even if it does say "Owner of Houses" or "Owner of 215 acres" against their Occupation, phrases like that do not necessarily mean they owned the property in which they lived at (in the Census).
Many who owned property, have said nothing about it, but given some other Occupation.
The purpose of that Census was not property Ownership or Tenure.
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Now, Boarder Head, above your question, is your answer.
In the property there was the "Head" of his or her house/household, showing as the "Head".
a) Then in the same property, if you had Boarders, the Border/s relationship to the "Border Head" is given.
b) Where there is more than one Boarder, but none of the Boarders were related to each other, this suggests that there should be no "Boarder Head" listed.
ADDED to b): Of course as previously discussed, one or more of the child, juvenile or young person or adult Boarder/s might also be related to the main "Head".
Somewhere, there should be Instructions to Census Enumerators or those responsible.
Mark
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Thank you to all those who have offered help and their thoughts on my question above.
I guess the term "Head" applies to the holder of the lease/tenure and "Boarder Head" could mean the heads of other families living in the property - sort of a sublet situation where the "Boarder Head" is responsible for his or her part of the arrangement.
Thanks again - regards - Dinny.
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I was always intrigued where one inhabitant might be down as "boarder", and the next as "lodger". Now there's another puzzle to unravel, for someone.
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Hello
1881 Census
"GENERAL INSTRUCTION.
This Paper to be filled up by the OCCUPIER or person in charge of the Dwelling. If a house is let or sub-let to separate Families or Lodgers, each OCCUPIER or LODGER must make a return for his portion of the house upon a SEPARATE SCHEDULE."
Words in capitals, are as printed.
The 1881 Census Form Download
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20160110200232/http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/guide-method/census/2011/how-our-census-works/about-censuses/census-history/200-years-of-the-census/census-1801-1901/1881-census-form.pdf
Comments
I have just looked at one "Boarder" in the England & Wales Census and clearly there is no separation from the others or the "Head" and he is on the same Schedule Number (in fact, the Boarder is between family members), so my "Boarder" does not mean any Letting or Sub-letting by the "Head" to the "Boarder" was occurring.
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If Letting was occurring, he/she should be a Lodger or Occupier on a separate Return / Paper and likely have a separate Schedule No. on the Census page (we see today).
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Generally, you cannot determine Ownership, or Tenure, from a Census with any degree of certainty at all.
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The only one you might determine as Letting it seems is a "Lodger" on a separate Return / Paper, with his / her own Schedule number in the Census.
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My Boarder - Long Term Stayer?
"Boarder" in my example, to me, simply means any long term stayers, some of whom were family / relations as previously discussed, as opposed to a shorter term "Visitor" who has come to stay overnight, or perhaps stay a week or two with their family, a friend, or a short stay while on business in the locality.
Mark
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My Russian great grandfather was a boarder age 20 in 1891
above him was a 40 year old woman with same surname.
no indication of how they were related
Later found out it was actually his father before he anglisized his name ..
.the age had been put in box for female...we spent years looking for this mysterious ' woman ' until his fathers original name was found on Russian documents
I always keep notes of lodgers and boarders names ...a few occasions where marriages or babies occur later with connections
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Yes, boarders and lodgers are often further linked.
Thanks for the info. concerning boarders and lodgers, BushInn 1746, although I must say I've never really found evidence that there is separation of either from the main household. As a rule of thumb I'd wondered if most people felt a lodger was a longer term stayer?
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I was always intrigued where one inhabitant might be down as "boarder", and the next as "lodger". Now there's another puzzle to unravel, for someone.
I've always understood that the difference was that a boarder paid for room and meals and a lodger paid for room only.
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I was always intrigued where one inhabitant might be down as "boarder", and the next as "lodger". Now there's another puzzle to unravel, for someone.
I've always understood that the difference was that a boarder paid for room and meals and a lodger paid for room only.
Hello
Yes, the dictionary definition of "Bed and Board" means your 'Sleeping Accomodation and Meals' and my late Grandparents also referred to that as 'Bed and Board'.
Added: Board means meals, if you go to stay at a Hotel or Guest House 'Half Board' means accommodation with Breakfast AND Dinner. 'Full Board' is three meals a day.
ADDED: If you were sent away for the Term to Grammar School, you were quite often called a 'Boarder' and your bed and meals were provded, with the school known as a 'Boarding School' where you slept in a Dormitory. The phrase now I notice is 'Room and Board' if you have your own room to sleep in.
Added: The important thing for us, is that we have found some Boarders; Visitors and Lodgers to be related, not always directly to the Head of that Household, but related to the wider family.
Specimens of the old Householder's Schedules, with instructions to Householders about filling out their Schedule forms, for various Census are here (as pdf downloads) ...
Lodger - 1881 Census Form download "General Instruction."
Suggests a 'Lodger' occupies part of the house on a Let basis ...
http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20160110200232/http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/guide-method/census/2011/how-our-census-works/about-censuses/census-history/census-1801-1901/index.html
Mark