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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Yorkshire (East Riding & York) => Topic started by: dennis dominator on Wednesday 09 January 08 20:21 GMT (UK)

Title: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: dennis dominator on Wednesday 09 January 08 20:21 GMT (UK)
Hi All,

Just out of a matter of interest, could anyone tell me if the above address was in the past a public house.

The reason i ask is whilst out for a walk around Hull's old town i came upon this building and the outside of the building suggests it was a pub and a quite large one at that. It looks like it has been empty for a good number of years now but could still be in use for something[maybe storage] as all the windows are still there although no sign if life was seen but it is not boarded up.

Kind Regards,
D.D
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Nick1 on Wednesday 09 January 08 20:42 GMT (UK)
Hi there, Have found this   6 Dagger Lane in 1892 Ward as a Victualer Society Tavern

Hope this helps
nick
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: dennis dominator on Wednesday 09 January 08 20:49 GMT (UK)
Hi Nick1

Yeh that does help as i said it looks like it was a big pub and looks like now it has maybe been split in two as the number 4 sign was in one of the windows of the building with number 4 dagger lane handwritten  so it's original address would have most probably been 6 Dagger lane.

Thanks for that Nick1

Kind Regards,
 d.d
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Nick1 on Wednesday 09 January 08 20:53 GMT (UK)
Glad to help d.d.

Nick
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Rena on Wednesday 09 January 08 21:15 GMT (UK)
Hi there,
as an ex Hullensian I can't remember Dagger Lane so I was curious enough to look on GENUKI at the Hull trade section in 1834 and who was occupying the lane in 1892.   I'd heard there were over 400 pubs in Hull at one time and from the looks of it, the old timers could have been right  ;D    I can't see anyone living at No.4 - this number seems to have been allocated for a little cul ce sac (Providence Court)

http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/ERY/Hull/Hull34Dry.html

Hull Trades and Professions by Alphabetical Street (1892)

HULL in Pigot's Directory of 1834
Ratcliffe's Hospital, Dagger lane
3 Dagger lane, Elias Eliza, Stay Makers
Gleadow Robert Ward, Brewers & Maltsters, 6 Dagger la

To London, Nottingham, Birmingham, Lincoln, Cambridge, and all parts of the South, Deacon, Nicholson & Co.'s Waggons (by way of New Holland) --- John Catterson, agent, Dagger lane, and Wilson and Watton's Waggons --- George Ashton and Charles Marshall, agents, both every Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday.
To York, Leeds, & Manchester, Ann Wilson's waggons, from Dagger lane, every Tuesday & Friday


http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/YKS/Misc/Transcriptions/ERY/Hull1892StreetsD.html

Hull Trades and Professions by Alphabetical Street (1892)
Dagger lane (Posterngate to Mytongate) 

Ratcliffe's Hospital, Dagger lane
3 Dagger lane, Elias Eliza, Stay Makers
4 here is Providence court (see under Street Names beginning with P)
 6 Ward Robt., victualer, Society Tavern
 7 Linsley Thomas & Co., beer merchants
 9 Saul Saml., victualer, Plumbers' Arms
9½ Bogg Charles Harrison, shopkeeper
10 Stewart Wm. Thos., bird dealer
11 and 12 Shaw John & Son, provision merchants
13 Bogg John, coal dealer
     Linsley Thos. & Co., warehouse
21 Winter Mrs. Sophia, shopkeeper
22 Boy and Barrel
     Winn G. & T., bakers
27 Kaplan Mendal, tailor
here is Page's square
     Gilyotts Wm. & Co.'s warehouse
29 Reynolds James, shopkeeper
     Linsley Thos. & Co.'s warehouse
     Mason S. B., spirit bond
     Linsley Thos. & Co., bottling stores
--
Cheers,
Rena
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: rootchat01 on Monday 08 September 08 19:41 BST (UK)
Hello,

I am a new the family search thing so was casting around vaguely for The Society Tavern, 6 Dagger Lane because I have a close ancestor about whom I know nothing except that in 1881 and 1891 census he was the publican at the Society Tavern. Name of Fessel. No 'previous' whatsoever and only vague  'subsequent'  although there are others of that name in Sculcoates.
Now at least I know the place did exist. Thanks.

LH
Essex
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Rena on Monday 08 September 08 21:18 BST (UK)
Hi there,
I had a look on the historical directories site and entered "Fessel" in the keyword section.    Unfortunately only 2 Hull directories showed in the results and both of these were covered by the 1881 and 1891 census.   Henry Fessel would have had trade from the Warehouses and barges sailing on the River Hull and the shipyard business from the River Humber.

http://www.historicaldirectories.org/hd/

From the website www.familysearch.org  the surname Fessel appears to originate on mainland Europe with the exception of one baptism in England during the 1600's.

The following Yorkshire free bmd website shows Johann Heinrich Christian Fessel married Dorothea Sophia Linnert in 1856.  Possibly he worked his way up from the bottom before he got his own ale licence.   It looks like you will have to be very imaginative in your thinking/spelling to find him in an earlier census.   

http://www.yorkshirebmd.org.uk/

A short sail down the River Humber is the port of Grimsby and I've noticed that my family moved between the two ports, probably following work.

good luck,
Rena
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Rena on Monday 08 September 08 21:56 BST (UK)
Hi LH,
You will find publican Henry was born in Saxony and has the surname spelling of "Fissell" in the 1871 Hull census.

He's also in the Hull 1861 census with the trade of master tailor.

I'll P.M. you

Cheers,
Rena

 
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: North Country Boy on Saturday 13 September 08 11:30 BST (UK)

The article below is taken from the book Hull and East Yorkshire Breweries (1997)

Thomas Ward expanded the Dagger Lane Brewery in 1782 which had probably been established earlier. Thomas handed the business over to his son, John, in 1795 and the following year Thomas died. When John died in 1814 his sisters, An and mary, inherited the brewery. Mary married Robert Gledow, shipbuilder, in 1796. Their son, Robert Ward Gledhow took over the brewery when his father died in 1826. R. W. Gledhow took W. T. Dibb into parternership in 1846. The brewery closed then, Gledhow, Dibb and Co built a new brewery in Silvester Street in 1868 (which became Hull Brewery)

Also, in the book a History of hull Brewery 1782-1985 (1990) states that although the brewery has long since been demolished, the brick arched cellars underneath the present development could have formed part of the brewery. Alos featured in the book is a map of the area, showing the brwery on the corner of Posterngate and Dagger Lane.

Ian
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: North Country Boy on Saturday 13 September 08 11:37 BST (UK)
The book Hull Pubs and Breweries (2004) by Paul Gibson has a picture of a pub called The Reefer situated at 4 Dagger Lane. The pub closed in 1910 with the picture shown taken during the 1940s

Ian
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: moira w on Tuesday 30 September 08 17:28 BST (UK)
 I'm almost sure there was a pub in Dagger Lane about 50years ago.It may have been called the Black Boy

Moira
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Rena on Tuesday 30 September 08 19:51 BST (UK)
I'm almost sure there was a pub in Dagger Lane about 50years ago.It may have been called the Black Boy

Moira

Hi Moira,

Is this the pub you're thinking of in the Land of Green Ginger?  It's the only Black Boy pub that I remember drinking in 50 years ago.
Hull’s oldest pub, dating from 1337, the Black Boy has been
licensed since 1729; it is situated in the High Street area,
close to Hull’s Museums Quarter and William Wilberforce
House. The Black Boy specialises in cask ales and fruit wine

Cheers,
Rena
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: moira w on Wednesday 01 October 08 08:35 BST (UK)
More than likely.It's along time since I worked in Hull.
Moira
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: SteveJW on Saturday 04 October 08 19:47 BST (UK)
1910 OS map shows two public houses
1927 OS map only shows the one at the junction of Prince Street
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: rootchat01 on Sunday 05 October 08 12:06 BST (UK)
What curious correspondence regarding 4 and 6 Dagger Lane this is! One pub then two pubs on what seems to be the same premises. The Society Tavern and the Black Boy. Why I wonder. And it is interesting that the later pub The Black Boy seems to have a more informative record.
The Society Tevern publican was Henry Fessel in census 1891 and evidently a  Ward Robt., victualer int he  1892 trades directory.
And then there is the Reefer at 6 Dagger Lane which evidently closed in 1910!
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Rena on Sunday 05 October 08 14:07 BST (UK)
Ref the Black Boy in the area of High Street, Land of Green Ginger.  I've located the address in the Gazetteer of Yorkshire Vol.11, 1823

Geo. North, publican,  151 High Street, Hull.

Phew, glad we solved that one  ;D

Cheers,
Rena

Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Rena on Sunday 05 October 08 14:09 BST (UK)
sorry - computer is having a hissy fit - Rena
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: dennis dominator on Monday 06 October 08 19:30 BST (UK)
 ye olde black boy is in High st not the land of green ginger which is some 10 minutes walk from High st.

I don't recall 2 ye olde black boys in Hull. Incidentally the address in the Hull yellow pages is 150 High st
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Rena on Monday 06 October 08 22:20 BST (UK)
I musta supped some stuff that night  ::) ;D
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: dennis dominator on Tuesday 07 October 08 19:07 BST (UK)
 ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: schumm on Tuesday 15 September 09 21:07 BST (UK)
 My great grandfather was Henry Fessel who ran the Dagger Lane Tavern.
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Treetotal on Monday 21 September 09 16:48 BST (UK)
What an interesting thread...I must take a trip back down there to have a look...I know the St. Michael's Masonic Lodge is down there and have spent many a good night at the lodge.

This is interesting too:
 

http://www.yorkshirehistory.com/pubs_c_g.htm

http://www.paul-gibson.com/history/dagger-lane.php


Carol
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: dennis dominator on Monday 21 September 09 19:45 BST (UK)
Thanks a lot for them links treetotal very interesting read.

Regards.
D.D
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: faloon on Saturday 10 October 09 15:20 BST (UK)
Hi i was brought up in the old town of Hull No 4 Dagger Lane was Society Pub used by many merchant seaman up to the 1960s  i believe seaman could stay back and drink later then the normal closeing times , in those days  i remeber visiting with my husband  who was a merchant seaman and he would knock on the door a shutter opened  by some one to let you in for a drink after hours the landlord was a Eddie and Molly Mainprize         the building still stands and is used for other purposes, Regardingto  the Black Boy Public House it still is in use in High Street Hull were i assume has allways stood, this  has brought back many memories so i must go back to the Black Boy Pub to find out if it has always been in High street,
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: gray2010 on Sunday 11 July 10 14:54 BST (UK)
I am researching Henry Fessel who is recorded as the Publican at the Society Tavern 6 Dagger Lane in the 1891 Census. If "schumm " or "rootchat01" read this, I would love to from them.
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: bessingby on Friday 16 July 10 11:47 BST (UK)
YATEAT THERE WAS APUB IN DAGGER LANE  SOCIETY AT THE CORNER OF PRINCE ST AND DAGGER LANE.AT THE BACK UP STAIRS WAS A OLD CLUB.IT WAS OPEND WELL INTO THE 40 I USE TO DELIVER BEER THERE.             IHOPE YOUR HAPPY  BILL
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: schumm on Saturday 17 July 10 13:51 BST (UK)
Happy for you to contact me and discuss my great grandfather henry fessel
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: gray2010 on Saturday 17 July 10 16:54 BST (UK)
Hi "Schumm"
Apparently, I cant contact you directly until we have both posted 3 messages. This is my second so thats 2 each. In the meantime I've got a choice of about 10 people who you could be. I'm assuming that your grandfather was Joseph H Schumm but not sure about your grandmother.

Regards

Graham
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: schumm on Saturday 17 July 10 22:27 BST (UK)
hello there

Here goes my third message. My great grandmother was Augusta Fessel daughter of Henry Fessel and my great grandfather was Joseph Henry Schumm. So are you related to the Schumms? Fessels? Or both??
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: gray2010 on Sunday 18 July 10 00:50 BST (UK)
My wife is related to the Schumms through the Weshenfelders. Apart from Henry, his wife and his 2 daughters, I don't know anything about the Fessels. Will send more details in a PM

Regards

Graham
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: bessingby on Sunday 18 July 10 12:17 BST (UK)
TO THE RERSON ASKING ABOUT ST MARYS SCHOOL ITWAS DOWN WILTONSTREET NEXT TO THE CHURCE. WILTON ST RAN FROM HOLDERNES RD TO DANSOM LANE LOG ON TO ST MARYS SCHOOL AND YOU WILL SEE .MESSAGES AND PHOTOES OF THE OLD PUPILS.           BESSINGY
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: John Johnson on Sunday 20 January 19 03:33 GMT (UK)
Hello, I am of relation to the Fessel families.  I too however have little to no knowledge of that family.  My mother’s Uncle was Henry Fessel Bobo.   His mother was Ida Fessel who Married Martin Bobo and they resided in the North Central United States  (Minnesota, Wisconsin  most likely).  My Grand
I would really like to connect with anyone with more info on this family.
My Great Grandmother Was Ida Matilda Fessel
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: John Johnson on Sunday 20 January 19 03:35 GMT (UK)
(http://Ida Matilda Fessel)
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Chrissyan on Monday 22 June 20 16:37 BST (UK)
While doing my tree. I just Googled My 3x Gt Grandfather Henry Fissell who ran the Society Tavern  from information on the 1871 census.  I was very intrigued to find he has his own thread on here from 12 years ago  :)
John Johnson I see your post is much more recent (Jan 2019)  If you still use this site you are welcome to get in touch   :)



Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: barryd on Monday 22 June 20 17:03 BST (UK)
https://www.paul-gibson.com/streets-and-architecture/dagger-lane.php

A very long article on Dagger Lane. Scroll though it and see if there is anything of interest.
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Treetotal on Thursday 09 July 20 17:00 BST (UK)
Nice one Barry...Paul is a good friend of mine and he would be pleased to know that his book is used for reference purposes on here.
Carol
Title: Re: Number 4 Dagger lane Kingston upon Hull
Post by: Chrissyan on Thursday 09 July 20 17:23 BST (UK)
https://www.paul-gibson.com/streets-and-architecture/dagger-lane.php

A very long article on Dagger Lane. Scroll though it and see if there is anything of interest.

Thanks Barry, will do  :) I have no idea how I missed your post. Thank you  :)