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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: daval57 on Friday 18 January 08 10:47 GMT (UK)

Title: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Friday 18 January 08 10:47 GMT (UK)
I'll visit them all.
Some of you know that I've been to Cathcart Old Parish a couple of times.
I'll go again anytime you want me to look.

However, thanks to Rita, I've realised the error of my ways!
There is another Cathcart cemetery. Despite the fact that I have lived here for close to 40 years, I missed it.  How dumb do I feel?  :-[

Gimme those names again ....... I'll have a proper look.

Dorman - for Linda
Edgar - for Robeena
Bollocks to Anne - oops - sorry Anne - ( Pollocks - for Anne)   ;D ;D ;D
Millers - Anne was that you too? - we got them, didn't we?
I've got Bryson written down - who wanted that?
Gray - for Rita

Oh, aye - Forrest - that's mine!


Sighthill still awaits me - that's another visit, another day.

Dave

 

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: apanderson on Friday 18 January 08 17:34 GMT (UK)
No Dave the Knave, no Millers for me!

;D   ;D   ;D 

Anne
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: waiteohman on Friday 18 January 08 17:36 GMT (UK)
Millers was me Dave  :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 17:22 GMT (UK)
I visited Cathcart cemetery today.
A huge cemetery.  I only managed to go round section 2F (top right of image below).

I'll add details shortly.

I'll certainly need to revisit more than a few times.   
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 18:01 GMT (UK)
Fintrygirl (Rita) asked me to have a look for her Gray relations.  She was able to give the the section number (2F) and plot number.  That is the reason I went to this area first.  While looking I kept my eyes open for the other names in the list.
Don't be disheartened if you don't get a mention today - I'll definitely be going back.  This particular section of the cemetery seems to be graves all from around the 1930s or thereabouts.  There are much older parts to the cemetery and it is also still in use.

Rita, despite walking around the entire section twice, I could not find the specific Gray lair.  A number of stones have fallen and are face down - I'm hoping it is not one of them.

I did find 1 Gray stone but whether it relates to your family, I don't know.  Photo attached

 
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 18:08 GMT (UK)
Anne - found a couple of Pollocks.
I've got higher resolution photos if you can't read these.


Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 18:08 GMT (UK)
Pollock 2 close up
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 18:31 GMT (UK)
Robeena - 1 Edgar

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 18:46 GMT (UK)
For Alan (Alwef)
Not sure if this is one of your's Alan, just thought you might be interested in the Meek and Forrest connection.

Not easy to read this one

IN LOVING MEMORY
OF
OUR DEAR PARENTS
WILLIAM MEEK FORREST
DIED 27 JAN 1953
AND HIS WIFE EDITH COPLESTON
DIED 6 APRIL 1929
ALSO THEIR DAUGHTER
ELSIE FORREST
DIED 17 MARCH 1997
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 19:00 GMT (UK)
That's the lot for today I'm afraid.
The hunt goes on.

I'll indulge myself now by posting a couple or few of random photos I took today in the cemetery.

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 19:04 GMT (UK)
Random monuments
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 12 February 08 19:07 GMT (UK)
more random stuff
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: BURBANK58 on Monday 12 May 08 10:06 BST (UK)
Hello
I'm trying to locate the unmarked grave of Margaret "Madge" Metcalfe Jefferson, who died in 1908. She was the mother of comedian Arthur Stanley Jefferson, better known as Stan Laurel. I'd appreciate any help I can get. I can
be e - mailed at (*)
Thank you
Bob

(*) Moderator Comment: e-mail removed in accordance with RootsChat policy,
to avoid spamming and other abuses.
Please use the Personal Message (PM) system for exchanging personal data.

New members must make at least three postings before being allowed to use the PM facility.
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Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Monday 12 May 08 12:49 BST (UK)
Hi Burbank58.

At the moment I wouldn't know where to start.  Interesting though.  I know that Stan went to school a few hundred metres from where I live.  The school was closed for years and demolished a couple of years ago.  It was on the site of the new Victoria Hospital.

If the grave is unmarked, do you have any other information on where it is located.  Also, if the grave is unmarked, what do you hope to gain?

Can I just add, I suggest you modify your post and remove your email address.      It is always possible for us to contact you by replying to your posts or by Personal Message.

Dave   
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Monday 12 May 08 12:54 BST (UK)
Just found this link.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/hollowhorn/156522146/

Perhaps you could contact the person that posted the photo.  If we can locate it, I'd be happy to take more photos.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Monday 12 May 08 13:02 BST (UK)
Dave,

If you ever come across Annie Gunn died 1947, I know she was definitely in Cathcart cemetery, wife of William Donald Gunn, police constable died 1913, not sure if he is there but am surmising that may be the case as Annie didn't live anywhere near Cathcart when she died..

dinna fash yerself, IF, you ever come across it it would be great.

Liked your photograhs of the cemetery.

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Monday 12 May 08 13:22 BST (UK)
Wini,
If you can locate the plot number I'll gladly take a wander along and take photos.
Cathcart is a massive cemetery and the chances of me 'coming across' her grave are remote.
Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: BURBANK58 on Monday 12 May 08 17:16 BST (UK)
Thank you for your help. I'm a big Laurel and Hardy. Both of Laurel's parents were entertainers and I was just curious about his mother's grave.
I would remove my e-mail address, but I don't know how.
Take care
Bob
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Monday 12 May 08 17:29 BST (UK)
Bob,
to remove your email, enter the thread and scroll down to the post with your email in it.  Click on "modify" at the top right of the post, change your post and then click "save" at the bottom of the post.

It's really just to try and beat spammers.

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Tuesday 13 May 08 05:48 BST (UK)
Thanks Dave,
I will see if I can get a plot number.

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 24 July 08 19:27 BST (UK)
Hello, I've just discovered this forum. 

Without wanting to step on anyone's toes, I'm also local to the Cathcart area and familiar with Cathcart Cemetery.  As daval says though , it is a huge cemetery so I thought you might appreciate a hand!  Also it's one of the most ill kept I've come across.  Many of the stones are face down, overgrown or in generally poor condition, particularly in the Cathcart section.  The Linn section (the more modern bit) is much better though.  If you have a section and grave reference I can also take pics since I'm there often walking the dog.

My dad is currently photographing the war graves (I believe apanderson is a member of the Scottish war graves forum too?) and as he goes he has started taking ex-pat graves for just this purpose.  I thought I'd post a list of those he has so far.  None of the names posted above are there yet, but it is a work in progress.  If you want pics let me know.

AUSTRALIA:

BENNIE, William Todd (d. 1888, Sydney)
COUGHTRIE, James (d. 1966 husband of GOVAN, Elizabeth)
CRAIG, Joseph Jackson (1903-1931, interred S. Australia)
FRASER, John (d. 1935, Perth)
GOVAN, Elizabeth (d. 1929, Newcastle.  Wife of COUGHTRIE, James)
HARRINGTON, Cecil Paxton (d. 1889, Albany)
LOCKHART, Blair (killed in AUstralia 1943)
MURRAY, James (d. 1934, Sydney, parents James Murray + Agnes Boyle)
NIVEN, John (late of Melbourne, died in Rothesay, Scotland 1900)
OLIVER, Cecil Archibald (served in Aust. Exp. Force d. Flanders 1917.  Also see OLIVER under Canada)


NEW ZEALAND:

ALLAN, James (d. 1908, Dunedin)
DUNCAN, Dr. John P. (d. 1955 also see DUNCAN under Canada)
FYFE, John Stalker (d. 1904, Auckland)
KERR, John (d. 1927, Hunterville)
MCLACHLAN, Charles Alexander (d. 1909, Hamilton)
TOD, Alfred Saxton (d. 1955, Timaru, cremated Christchurch) + wife YATES, Margaret
YATES, Margaret (d. Christchurch) + husband TOD, Alfred Saxton


CANADA:

BURGESS, James (d. 1933, Toronto)
CHRISTIE, David (d. 1952 married to Ethel Glover)
DUNCAN, Erskine + Wilfred E. P (d. 1939, Toronto. Also see DUNCAN under New Zealand)
FARWELL, Charles Bowers (b. Sherbrooke, Quebec 1868, d. Glasgow 1906)
GOODALL, William (d. 1932, Toronto. Husband of Agnes Mclaren)
HENDRY, Annie (d. 1921, Montreal)
LE SAGE, Helen Marie (married name NEWLANDS. d. 1933, Montreal)
MACKAY, Abigail (married name MCGOUN. b. 1861, Toronto, d. 1927, London)
MADDOCK, William (WW1 casualty, Newfoundlander)
MILLAR, William (d. 1913, Saskatoon [sic])
MITCHELL, Arrol (d. 1964)
MORTON, Archie + Davie (d. 1938. Presumably children, parents John + Helen Robertson)
OLIVER, Helen E. (d. 1962, Toronto.  Also see OLIVER under Australia)
SMITH, Alexander Davie (d. 1910)
THORNE, Mary (married to Alexander Neil FLEMING d. 1995)
WHYTE, Mary Stuart (d. 1906, Winnipeg, age 2, parents Alexander S. + Christina Rae)


U.S.A.

ARCHIBALD, Ada (married name MCFARLANE, d. 1998 Scottsdale, Arizona)
BARRIE, William (d. 1939, interred Oakland, California, parents Allan Barrie + Mary McLuckie )
CRAIK, James Michie (d. 1869, Wisconsin)
MCFARLANE, James Stewart (d. 2001, Santa Clara, California, husband of ARCHIBALD, Ada)
NAISMITH, Thomas (d. 1938, Longbeach, California)
SHIRRIFFS, William (d. 1965, Austin, Texas)
WATT, John (d. 1912, New Orleans)
WHELAN, Margaret (married to John Whelan d. 1957, interred Washington Mem. Park, Paramus, New Jersey)
YOUNG, Robert (d. 1920, Denver)


SOUTH AFRICA

COWAN, David (d. 1907, Cape Town)
FORBES, Charles (d. 1924.  mother Elspeth Tillery Forbes)
HARRINGTON, Edward M. (d. 1897, Johannesburg)
HARVEY, John (d. 1867, Payta, age 27.  Parents Robert + Margaret Finlay)
KERR, Myrtle Dorothy (d. 1901, age 2.  Parents Alex. + Maggie Kerr of Naauwpoort, Cape Colony)
STEWART, Donald Campbell (d. 1903, Johannesburg)






Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: apanderson on Thursday 24 July 08 20:19 BST (UK)
Hi damnonii,

Yes, it's me - here and on the Scottish War Graves Project- I pop up everywhere!

Is you dad Jim McG....... by any chance? (I had a wee sneaky peek to see who was doing Cathcart  ;) ) Tell him I said hello!!

Once Dave catches up with this thread I'm sure he'll be quite happy that someone else is joining in.

Anne

P.S. Welcome to Rootschat

P.P.S. I never did find any Houstons in New Monkland

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 24 July 08 20:49 BST (UK)
Hi Anne, thanks for your welcome.  Yes I'm a McG born and bred, been touring war memorials ever since I can remember (and inevitably I became a history student, got into genealogy and got roped into all the war stuff  ;D lol)
Thank you for having a go at looking for the Houstons, Dad said you had no luck.  Sent a letter to the Cemeteries department  but who knows how long that will take. Ah well, we'll get it eventually. 
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: apanderson on Thursday 24 July 08 21:47 BST (UK)
You'll probably have a long wait!

There are workers at New Monkland Monday - Friday so if you could manage over then, they're usually really helpful.

If that's not possible, send me what info you have by PM and I can pop over sometime during the week. I've been there that often that the guys know me so they'll know what to expect when they see me coming (and probably run in the opposite direction). I'm joking of course, I've always found them to be a really nice bunch.

I traipsed the length and breadth of New Monkland when I was doing the war graves but I could easily have overlooked a Houston stone.

Anne
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Friday 25 July 08 02:30 BST (UK)
Hi damnonii.

Thanks for the offer - It IS a huge cemetery.

Your avatar - is it this at a different time of year?

 
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Friday 25 July 08 14:00 BST (UK)
Indeed it is she, taken spring last year I think.  Cemeteries are great for photos aren't they?
Got some more here if you're interested: http://good-times.webshots.com/album/562712337TrqXCB
a bit amateur though, lol. 


p.s. could I get an update on who you've got and who you're still looking for for people, and I can keep my eyes peeled too? 

Cheers, Lora. 
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Friday 25 July 08 20:57 BST (UK)
todays dog walk got -

EDGAR, Douglas Hamilton (1898-1970) + wife Catherine (1902-1986)

POLLOCK, George Hill (1858-1936) + wife Jemima Simpson Lochhead (1859-1935)
also John Pollock McPhin J.P. (d. 1940)
and Mary Pollock (d. 1943), wife of David Lyons White

I'd be very surprised if I managed to get a right one, but you never know.

enough for today, I'm off to fry my brain watching big brother  :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: apanderson on Friday 25 July 08 21:13 BST (UK)
Hi Lora,

I've just noticed from your signature you've got Kinniburghs.

Where were they from? I have a friend who also has Kinniburghs and anytime I come across a stone, I take photos for her.  From memory, I've know I've got photos of stones from New Monkland, Old Monkland, Auld Aisle (Kirkintilloch) and Tollcross but I'd need to check to actually give you a list.

Interested?

Anne
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: FintryGirl on Saturday 02 August 08 15:18 BST (UK)
Hi Dave or Anyone Else who visits the Cathcart Cemetery,



I'm trying again,  looking for my ancestors gravestone you didn't have any luck the day you originally went for me, but with Anne's suggestions etc. you said you might be back to Cathcart Cemetery some day.. Just wondering when you do keep me in mind, Here is the information again


Section 2F   Lair644

INTERMENTS
30 April 1926 William B Gray 41 years (I think it should read Walter Bruce)
07 Jan 1937 Phyllis Gray 43 years
03 Feb 1941 Janet L Gray 26 years 

Thanks from Canada
Rita
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Saturday 02 August 08 23:08 BST (UK)
Hi Rita

I will have another look next time I'm there.  I'll see if I can find some numbers on the graves so at least I can say if the stone is face down.

Lora

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Saturday 02 August 08 23:36 BST (UK)
Lora,
last time I was there I went right round 2F and couldn't find the stone.
At that time I was looking for the name, unaware that some stones are numbered (Anne put me right there but I've not been back since).
Hope you find it.  You obviously go more often than me.

What type of dog do you have?  I said hello to a couple of folk walking dogs when I was there - it'd be funny if one was you ;D

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Sunday 03 August 08 12:02 BST (UK)
Hi Rita

Got some good news and bad news

The good news...

(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/GRAYWalterclose.jpg)

The plaque reads:

A token of respect
and esteem
to the memory of
Walter Gray
who died ??th of April 192?
_________

from
the Coalmen of
Govanhill


The bad news....

I found some numbers and I'm almost certain the space behind Walter's plaque is lair 644 (i.e. the plaque may have originally been in that position or placed at the back of an original stone), whether there was another plaque there which has disintegrated or there was never a family stone at all I don't know.

(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/GrayW.jpg)

pm me your email address and I'll send you the photos. 

I'm not surprised you didn't find it Dave! Not only is the stone very hard to read (I think I was there at the right time, it had just rained and then the sun came out highlighting the writing a bit) but it took me a while to work out the numbering, apparently 2F is split down the middle so there's 2 columns of numbering. 

I have a golden retriever, she's probably most likely to be seen lying down in the middle of the grass staring bemusedly at me rather than actually doing any walking herself. She's getting on a bit.  Nevertheless I'm dreading when she goes because then I'll just be that crazy lady (and her dad) who wanders round the graveyard.  I'll keep an eye out for you (although I will be looking for a gentleman with a large beard  ;D not that I'm much like maw 'cadam though lol)

btw I decided to have a look at Cathcart Old churchyard the other day since I've never been in and I never even knew there was a covenanter's grave there.  Unfortunately all the gates were locked and I had no option but to go over the broken wall.  Have they closed it off permanently? Or are the gates open sometimes?  I never got time to have a proper look and I'd like to go back.

Lora.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 07 August 08 19:33 BST (UK)
That was brilliant finding that Lora.  Well done.   Rita is well pleased.  I had a PM from her.

I'll watch out for the retriever the next time I'm at Cathcart and will say hello to the old dog (the one lying down  ;D ;D ;D).

As for Old Parish, I've never seen the gates open since I was a teenager.  Like you, I climb the wall.  The broken bit off Carmunnock Road has been fenced off.  There is another bit round the back, near the covenanters grave which can still be scaled but it's not easy and I've had a few disapproving looks from the residents (of the local houses, not the graveyard).  I contacted Neil Galbraith, the minister, about access but the church has nothing to do with the graveyard any longer - run and 'maintained' by the Council now.

I've got another thread going you may want to look at, a couple of photos on there too.....   
http://www.rootschat.com/links/040o/

Look forward to bumping into you sometime. 

Dave.







Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 07 August 08 23:56 BST (UK)
I miss beardy  ;D

I love the old pic you've got of the church on the other thread, in the days when Buckfast was still a medicinal tonic  ;D. 
I was shocked to see them actually 'maintaining' big Cathcart recently, but it seems to involve shoring up some graves next to the entrances to make a good impression then b******** off (scuze the language).  We'll see though. 

I just realised, should this thread be linked to in the Renfrewshire forum since Cathcart Cemetery is technically in East Ren? I would guess that in practice there's probably more burials from the Lanarkshire side of the border, since East Ren is covered by Eastwood Cemetery too, but there's definitely some Giffnock folk and others.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Friday 08 August 08 02:20 BST (UK)
I reckon by now Lora that most folk that look at the posts here will be looking at the Renfrewshire
 posts too. And vice versa. 

I tend to watch all the Scottish threads.

Anyone searching for Cathcart should come across the various posts we've made but it would do no
harm to mention them in
Renfrewshire as well.  Really valid comment.

My concern is that we end up with duplication - I've made that mistake a few times.

If you do think it's worthwhile posting it on Renfs., it would be worth cross-referring it and
asking folk to post responses on our main thread ... here.

Beardy may return........

added a wee bit later.....

amazing whit a shave and a wee bit make up does!
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Friday 08 August 08 02:53 BST (UK)
PPS
Comments about avatars are lost after the moment!
Good fun at the time though. ;D
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: apanderson on Friday 08 August 08 10:28 BST (UK)
Jings Dave,

Lora is going to be looking for a 'beardy' ever time she goes graveyarding!

I think you'll need do the 'wearing a red carnation, kiss me quick hat and hovering about in Section X' trick if she's to recognise you!!

Graveyards are certainly busy places these days with folk like us contstantly wandering around in them.

Anne  ;D
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Friday 08 August 08 21:00 BST (UK)
I think you're right Dave, it would just be a technicality putting it on the Renfrewshire forum and will probably lead to confusion, although I did mean just to link it here, not try and start a new thread.  People will hopefully search, and you say you'll spot if anyone posts about Cathcart anyway.  

Lora is going to be looking for a 'beardy' ever time she goes graveyarding!

I think you'll need do the 'wearing a red carnation, kiss me quick hat and hovering about in Section X' trick if she's to recognise you!!

while I'm sure he'd look very fetching, I think the polis might get there before I do ;D

How about a mutual code.  The crow flies North tonight...






Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Tuesday 02 December 08 07:36 GMT (UK)
Hi Dave,
after quite a while I have managed to get Lair numbers for the grave I was looking for in Cathcart Cemetery. If you are still photographing there some time I would really appreciate it. Maybe this is a summer job, it is probably too cold  just now.
Anyway,
Lair No. 1401 section 2E
It apparently says
In Loving memeory of Annie Gunn and her children
John, Peter and Catherine beloved wife of Hugh Munro
also her son Willian John Gunn a beloved husband and father and Grandfather
Died 6th June 1994

The other one is Lair No. 1373 section N it it are
Samuel Gunn age 2
Jessie Gunn age 2
Doanld Gunn age 15
William Donald Gunn age 41
Agnes McDonald
Dolina McPhee age 19
Samuel McPhee age 44.
Not sure if there is a headstone there or not, probably not and I have no idea who Agnes McDonald was, will have to do some more checking. It is a name I haven't come across before.

Thanks again

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Tuesday 02 December 08 20:28 GMT (UK)
Hi Winni

I'm glad you got the details.  I've been keeping the Gunn's in mind but never spotted them. 

If there was a stone in N there's good chance it's lying flat, N is a mess.  2E is in the modern section so I don't think there will be any problems.   

I can take photos for you, probably at the weekend.  It's been quite nice weather actually (despite the cold and ice)

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Tuesday 02 December 08 22:24 GMT (UK)
Lora,
I was just wondering if the one in the N could maybe be a paupers grave. I  just wondered because of this Agnes McDonald who I am still trying to track down.
Thanks again but please have a look when the weather isn't too bleak.Wouldn't want you to catch cold.  ;D  ;D

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Wednesday 03 December 08 00:04 GMT (UK)
In my g-grandparent's grave there are 2 unrelated burials and it turns out they were neighbours.  Apparently selling lair space was a common way of supplementing income.  Of course it would help if you had Agnes's date of burial then you could find her death cert. thankfully I was given that so it made it easy.

I think the Gunn's probably owned the lair.  If it was a pauper's grave I think there would be more unrelated burials, and all from around the same time if they just filled it up as the space was needed.  I don't think they would hold it for other family members since the family didn't own it.


Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Wednesday 03 December 08 09:19 GMT (UK)
I was hoping you had given me a way of soving the problem with Agnes. I have tried the 1901 Census
but no McDonalds.
The McPhees in that lair Dolina and Samuel are the brother and sister of Annie Gunn in the other lair, she died in 1947, the older lair is from the early 1900's
Will keep looking.

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Wednesday 03 December 08 17:33 GMT (UK)
Wini,
What are the dates of death of the others in lair 1373?

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Wednesday 03 December 08 19:25 GMT (UK)
Hi Wini

I should have said we walk our dog there anyway so deciding whether to brave the cold or not isn't an option lol. 
I took a wander round section N this afternoon, not expecting to find a stone, but there is! It was erected by the police to William Donald. Unfortunately  this means it doesn't give any clues as to Agnes McDonald's identity and of course the others in the lair aren't commemorated either which I find quite sad. 

The light was low and I only had my mobile camera as well as the stone being pretty hard to read, but considering the pics aren't too bad so I'll post them anyway.  I'll take the good camera next time, and do it in the morning. 

As far as I can make out the inscription reads:
In Memory of
Constable William Gunn
Glasgow City Police
Died 8th October 1913
Aged 40 years

A token of esteem
by the members of the
Queen's Park Division

(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/rootschat/ConstableWilliamGunn.jpg)
(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/rootschat/inscriptiontop.jpg)
(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/rootschat/inscriptionbottom.jpg)

Will make my way over to 2E as well of course at some point. 

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Thursday 04 December 08 04:02 GMT (UK)
Dave
In Lair 1373
Samuel age 2 died 1903
Jessie                      1907
Donald                     1919
William Donald          1913
Dolina McPhie/McPhee  1904
Samuel McPhoe/McPhee  1931
Agnes McDoanald  Haven't a clue

Lori
Thanks for the photo much appreciated Looks like the Lair was in the family before the Police put up the headstone for William Donald, who was from Durness, another hioghland policemand who got TB.

Was   that area closed beofre 1947 when Annie Gunn died? You would have thought she would have wanted to be buried beside her husband. Mind you I remember her, my grandmother and she was pretty senile and had reverted to speaking Gaelic as she was originally from Skye.
Thanks again for the photo.
I will send my email by PM if you happen to get a better photograph.

wini

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 05:01 GMT (UK)
Hi Wini.
No luck. 
Bear in mind it's nearly 5am where I am so brain not at it's best

I've been having a play, trying to find Agnes McDonald.  You've obviously
been looking for a while but I thought, beginners luck etc....

Nothing obvious.

I did find a marriage in 1921 Agnes McDonald c1901 to a Peter McLaren Gunn c1903
(thought I'd cracked it when I saw Peter Gunn, Williams son's name)
However, Peter's parents Robert William Gunn and Helen Mason.

Also found death in 1920 of a Agnes McPhee c1886 wife of John McDonald
Agnes' parents Alexander McPhee and Magdeline Blackwood.

Nothing obvious to link either of these to your family.

Am I correct in saying William's parents were John and
 Bessie Gunn and Annie's parents Peter McPhee and Jessie MacKinnon?

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 05:17 GMT (UK)
Also found another death.

1898 Agnes McPhee c1848 wife of John McDonald
Agnes' parents Duncan and Jane McPhee

Clutching at straws but you never know.
Concentrating on Agnes' where there is a relationship between McDonalds and McPhees or Gunns.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Thursday 04 December 08 07:12 GMT (UK)
Dave,
You have the parents correct.
Annie's parents Peter McPhie and Janet/Jessie MacKinnon both from Kilmuir,Skye.
Williams were John Gunn and Bessie Gunn M. s. Gunn both from Durness
You have just given me a thought  which I will check. John Gunn had a first wife Isobel Ross and without checking I think one of his childen was Peter. I haven't done much with that early marriage sp perhaps there  may be a connection with that one. They were all in Durness
Agnes isn't a name in the Gunns or McPhies / McPhees

Yep in the 1851 Census for Laid , Isobel is dead and John is at home with
Mary 15
PETER 13
Thomas 10
Margaret 6
Dolona  4
John 3
Margaret Ross , Isobels sister.
Not sure  where that is getting me but will investigate a bit further when I am not supposed to be getting dinner organised.

Thanks wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 07:21 GMT (UK)
From my earlier searches, I've got a lot of the indices for Agnes McDonalds _ I'll see if I can see any Ross connections.

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 08:13 GMT (UK)
I'm confusing myself now.  Ross is too remote. 
I'll need to get all my scraps of paper together and have a rethink.
We're way off topic here but I'm enjoying it.  Frustrating though.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 04 December 08 08:37 GMT (UK)
Was   that area closed beofre 1947 when Annie Gunn died? You would have thought she would have wanted to be buried beside her husband. Mind you I remember her, my grandmother and she was pretty senile and had reverted to speaking Gaelic as she was originally from Skye.
Thanks again for the photo.
I will send my email by PM if you happen to get a better photograph.

Hi Wini.  I was wondering that too.  I'm not sure of the regulations about number of burials.  In my g-grandparents grave there are 4 burials and we were told that was the limit then.  I'm not sure if that restriction applied everywhere or was discretionary.  1373 I think must be a double lair and assuming there could be 4 in each it means there was a space left for Annie.  I don't know what info you received about the lairs but I was given a database entry which marked the grave as 'full' maybe you could check if it says that.  

I hope you get somewhere with Agnes.  If only she had a rare middle name!  If I had time just now I would join the hunt but must get going I'm afraid.

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 08:46 GMT (UK)
Yeeha!
Think I'm getting close.
Sat back and tried to figure out how a McDonald would come into the Gunn family.
It really has to be a female Gunn marrying a McDonald.
Searched SP for all marriages female Gunn to McDonald in Scotland.  37 of them. ....1 DOLINA
1896 St George, Edinburgh - Dolina Gunn bc1872 m Robert McDonald bc1869
Dolina's parents William Gunn and Catherine MacKay.

I'm betting Agnes is their child.

Maybe you know where William and Catherine fit in?

Thank goodness for unusual names in some families - Dolina jumped out like a sore thumb.

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 08:59 GMT (UK)
OK - 1901 census
Dolina b1872 Skerray, Sutherland living with hubby Robert in St Paul, Edinburgh.
No children.

So, if I'm right and Agnes is their child, she's born after 1901.

Oh for the 1911 census!

Back to SP.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 10:12 GMT (UK)
Wini,
I think I've taken this line of enquiry as far as I can without using too many more credits.

The last search I did makes a lot of assumptions and it still leaves too
many to choose from (for me anyway).

William died East Kilbride
Samuel died Hutchesontown
Donald died Bridgeton.

On that basis, I  searched for Agnes McDonald deaths in Lanark.
Mother's maiden name Gunn or unknown (rules out the ones where
mother's maiden name is not Gunn)
Birth date 1906 +/- 5 (assumes she was born within 15 years of parents
 marriage but after 1901 census)
Searched between 1901 and 1965 (I chose 1965 to get max 25
results for the credit although in all probability she died before 1947 when Annie died)

Ruling out those with "other surnames", ie married, that leaves 14.
A surprising number of them died in infancy.

There are a couple that I'd like to try, maybe you will.

1909 died in infancy Hutchesontown
Nope - that was my banker!
1903 died in infancy Holytown (A bit far away but name is Agnes Donald McDonald) Nope
There are a couple in Bridgeton / Dennistoun Not these either

Off course, all this is very dependent on my original assumption that Agnes is the child of Dolina and Robert.

Food for thought.

I really hope I haven't confused you and you follow my logic (if you can call it that!  ;D


Apologies to everyone else for sidetracking the thread.

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Thursday 04 December 08 10:15 GMT (UK)
Thanks for all that Dave,
Please don't spend any more credits on this. You have given me a bit to think about.

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 04 December 08 10:23 GMT (UK)
A pleasure Wini, I really enjoyed the challenge.  I couldn't sleep last night in any case so it gave me something to do.
Still not tired!
Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Friday 05 December 08 23:39 GMT (UK)
Hi wini.
No success I'm afraid.
It was none of the more obvious one's.

It also donned on me that Agnes could have been born AND died between 1896 and 1901 when the census was taken so I had a look at 2 others in the Bridgeton/Hutchestown area.  Nothing.

I feel we are close.

I keep thinking about it.  If I come up with anything else, I'll let you know.

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Saturday 06 December 08 12:51 GMT (UK)
Hi wini.  I've emailed you all of the photos.  Let me know you get them ok.  This is your grandmother's in 2E


Lora  :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Saturday 06 December 08 23:13 GMT (UK)
Lora,

Thank you very, very much for your trouble.
Hope you enjoyed your walk. I will pm my email address as they didn't come  through as emails.

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Sunday 07 December 08 00:51 GMT (UK)
nae bother, you're very welcome  ;D
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sigalarm on Wednesday 28 January 09 22:03 GMT (UK)
This is a very interesting thread.  I have been very interested in trying to locate the grave of my great-great grandfather, the Reverend Adam Cunningham Henderson and his wife Jane.  He was the minister of the Free Church in Busby up until about 1907, and he passed away in 1909.  Last time we were in Glasgow, we visited several cemeteries but have had no luck finding him. 

Could anyone spare some suggestions on how to find if he is buried in Cathcart?

Thank you very much in advance!

Bruce Henderson
San Diego, CA
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Wednesday 28 January 09 23:18 GMT (UK)
It's certainly possible, I've passed quite a few ministers on my travels (they usually have the most description on their graves, you get some great character references).  What was his address when he died? It might help say if he's in the Cathcart parish or not.  Busby is a bit of a grey area to me, I'm not sure what it actually comes under.

What burial grounds did you try?  I think Carmunnock has a kirkyard although I don't think there's any in Busby or Clarkston? but I might be wrong there.  The other major cemetery to try would be Eastwood. 

Your best bet might be to contact the local historian Amanda Robb based in Giffnock Library.  She has access to a number of resources in there, and will be able to point you in the right direction.  Makes me bitter I don't actually have any East Ren ancestors myself lol.

Amanda Robb
Reference & Local History Librarian,
Giffnock Library,
Giffnock
East Renfrewshire

0141 577 4976
Amanda.Robb@eastrenfrewshire.gov.uk


If that fails you could ask if someone might be willing to look for an obituary in the newspaper.  I think for a minister there's more likely to be details of where his funeral was taking place included. 

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sigalarm on Thursday 29 January 09 00:01 GMT (UK)
Thanks for the reply.  We have been in touch with Amanda Robb, who put us in touch with Ann McVicar, who seems to have written a book about the history of Busby and that whole area.  She had many facts about the good reverend, but no idea where he was buried. 

The obituary was very brief, and did not cite where he was laid to rest, just that there were two memorial services for him.  The first one down by Kelvingrove, where he died (after he retired from the Busby church) and the second at the Busby East Church (Free Church) which was held second.

We checked Eaglesham and Mearns as well as the Glasgow Necropolis (just in case) with no luck.  I even checked the old family plots in Caithness when I visited there a week after.

Ann McVicar mentioned to us that he might be in Cathcart, but this we were out of time and could not locate it.

Any ideas who might be able to tell me if he (and his wife) are there?

Thanks

Bruce H
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 29 January 09 00:18 GMT (UK)
lol you certainly have done the rounds then.  He could be almost anywhere in East Renfrewshire or Glasgow. 

This is the info provided on the Ancestral Scotland site for getting burial records in East Renfrewshire.  The council's own site is pretty sketchy and all it really tells you is to go to Barrhead Library to search which obviously isn't feasible for you just now.  It might be easiest to send Amanda Robb a quick email and ask her who is best to contact.

East Renfrewshire - including Neilston, Newton Mearns and Eaglesham
Sport & Leisure Division
East Renfrewshire Council
Rhuallan House
1 Montgomery Drive
Giffnock
G46 6PY
Tel: +44 141 577 3913
Fax: +44 141 577 3919
Email: sandra-donnelly@eastrenfrewshire.gov.uk

Copies of extracts are not provided but all the relevant information is made available by telephone or letter. Reasonably precise information (name, date, cemetery etc.) is required, otherwise a search fee of £38 is payable.

Also this is the address to write to for Glasgow records.  It took us two months to get a reply though, and that was with precise details.

Cemeteries & Crematoria  Registrar
20 Trongate
Glasgow
G1 5ES

Phone:0141 287 3961
E-mail: les@glasgow.gov.uk

Meantime will keep my eyes peeled in Cathcart for you when I'm there, I have a mental image of where a few ministers graves are, though Busby doesn't ring any bells.

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sigalarm on Thursday 29 January 09 00:38 GMT (UK)
Thank you so much for the contact information, and for keeping an eye out.  Adam Cunningham Henderson was born December 1841 and died December (or November) 1909.  He was born in Dunbeath Caithness and he could be listed as from Busby, East Kilbride or Kelvin Grove at death.

Bruce Henderson
San Diego, CA
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sigalarm on Friday 30 January 09 15:29 GMT (UK)
I have come up with some more data thanks to a helpful soul at the East Renfrewshire council.  It seems that Adam and several members of his family are buried in Cathcart, Section F, Lair 471.

Bruce
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Friday 30 January 09 15:59 GMT (UK)
Thats excellent! I wish all cemetery departments were so helpful and so quick. 

I can get pics for you, maybe tomorrow morning if it's nicer weather than it is at the moment.  I must warn you though that Section F is for the most part a jungle and I might need a machete if it's visible at all.  But then again being a minister presumably his grave is fairly substantial so could be easier to spot. We'll see.  Will let you know.

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sigalarm on Friday 30 January 09 16:13 GMT (UK)
You are very kind for making the attempt Lora, I really appreciate it.

Bruce
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Saturday 31 January 09 11:46 GMT (UK)
Hi Bruce, I'm sad to say that after all that there isn't a headstone  :(

The sandstone grave on the left is numbered as 470 so there's no doubt where the lair is. 
There is a stone lying flat further to the left of it as you'll see in the photo but I think this is F.469 which has been displaced by the tree. 

If you pm me (click on the wee scroll under my avatar on the left) and send me your email address I can send photos of the plot and a map of where it is if you ever get to visit. 

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: SteveBUK on Monday 13 April 09 00:16 BST (UK)
Hi Lora

Is there any chance you will be returning in the near future? I am looking for a stone commemorating Annie Harper (d 1910) and John Dickie, which according to a certificate in possession of a relative is "Compartment N Lair no. 605" purchased in Feb 1910.

It would be wonderful if it was there

Steve
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Monday 13 April 09 11:31 BST (UK)
Hi Steve, here you go.  I will pm you my email address so you can send me yours and I will send full copies.  I don't think you can send a pm yet because you're a new member.   Lora  :)

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Monday 13 April 09 21:52 BST (UK)
Hi Steve, hope you don't mind me asking, I was just wondering if you know what the 2 dates on the stone mean?  I've never seen anything worded like that before.  Annie died 1st Jan 1910, and the lair was purchased in February.  What does the August 1941 date refer to?  Was her body moved to or from Buenos Aires?   ???
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: SteveBUK on Monday 13 April 09 22:42 BST (UK)
Lora

I suspect only Annie Harper is buried in the grave. Annie was her daughter, she died following a riding accident in Buenos Aires, where she had lived since 1930, and was buried in the Chacarita Cemetery there - she was only 36. John Dickie was her husband, he died in London, but I do not know for sure what happened to his body.

Kind regards

Steve
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: SteveBUK on Monday 13 April 09 22:45 BST (UK)
I should have said Annie died in Buenos Aires in 1941 and John in London in 1948 and Anne Harper in Glasgow in 1910

Steve
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Monday 13 April 09 23:34 BST (UK)
I see now, the wording confused me and because mother and daughter were both Annie, silly me.  It's very sad they both died fairly young.   :-[
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: ozirose on Thursday 23 April 09 04:43 BST (UK)
Hi Lora

If you go walking through Cathcart again could you please see if you can find the headstone of my great grandfather, Albany Peat Barr.  He is buried in Section Q, Lair 945, along with his wife Janet A. Barr.
Also his daughter Elanor Peat Barr in Lair 946. And any other Barrs who may be buried nearby?

Our family moved to Australia a long time ago and I have just started our Family History.

Thanks so much

Rosie
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wini on Thursday 23 April 09 06:03 BST (UK)
Hi Lora,
You deserve a medal for all the walking you have done for us Cathcart Cemetery people.
You must have the fittest dog on Glasgow. :) :) :)

wini
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 23 April 09 08:38 BST (UK)
Hi Lora

If you go walking through Cathcart again could you please see if you can find the headstone of my great grandfather, Albany Peat Barr.  He is buried in Section Q, Lair 945, along with his wife Janet A. Barr.
Also his daughter Elanor Peat Barr in Lair 946. And any other Barrs who may be buried nearby?

Our family moved to Australia a long time ago and I have just started our Family History.

Thanks so much

Rosie

Hello Rosie, I will have a look next time I'm there.  The name seems familiar. I have this Barr on my computer in Section Q.784-5 just now.  It's not letting me post the attachment for some reason but it's John and Mary Barr, son William Hewat (KIA 1917) and granddaughter Moira Neill.  There might be more on Dads computer I'll check later, have to get going just now. 

Hi Lora,
You deserve a medal for all the walking you have done for us Cathcart Cemetery people.
You must have the fittest dog on Glasgow. :) :) :)

wini

Haha that did make me laugh!  She used to be fit, but age and a love of food has gotten the better of her.  She just ambles and has a lie down while the mad humans take pictures.  :D
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 23 April 09 19:06 BST (UK)
Here are the pics Rosie.  I didn't see any other Barrs in the immediate vicinity - is there anyone in particular you're looking for? I will pm you and arrange sending full size copies.  Lora :)

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: ozirose on Friday 24 April 09 01:08 BST (UK)
Thanks so much, Lora, for your time and trouble.
I am very impressed with the pics!

Rosie
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Friday 24 April 09 23:32 BST (UK)
Hello Rosie, you're welcome.  I sent you a pm with my email address if you want to get in touch I can send you full size pics and a wee map so if you ever visit you know where you're going :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sjm21560 on Thursday 10 September 09 11:35 BST (UK)
Hi Dave, I'm a new recruit to RootsChat so have just picked up on one of the first posts on this thread which mentions the surname "Miller". My grandfather, George McDonald Miller, who died 21st May 1938, was buried in Cathcart Cemetery. You haven't come across his stone by any chance?

Regards
Stewart
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Thursday 10 September 09 20:49 BST (UK)
Hi Stewart, welcome to Rootschat

I've checked through what photos we have and we've not got him, although that only means the stone doesn't have a war death or an ex-pat and isn't crumbling sandstone.  East Renfrewshire council are seemingly very helpful with getting lair numbers for people.  This is the contact details I've got for them, which helped a previous poster.

East Renfrewshire
Sport & Leisure Division
East Renfrewshire Council
Rhuallan House
1 Montgomery Drive
Giffnock
G46 6PY
Tel: +44 141 577 3913
Fax: +44 141 577 3919
Email: sandra-donnelly@eastrenfrewshire.gov.uk

There is a chance I'll come across it but Miller is quite a common name and Cathcart is quite a big cemetery so it would involve a lot of luck.  Will still keep my eyes peeled though. :D

eta -

Lora, not Dave (Daval) sorry  ;D I latched on on page 2 of the thread  ;)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sjm21560 on Thursday 10 September 09 21:37 BST (UK)
Many thanks Dave, Much appreciated.
Stewart
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 15 September 09 00:42 BST (UK)
Lora,
Jings Crivvens Help Ma Boab!

You do all the work, I get the credit.  No fair!!!   :(


May I ask a favour though please?

I've been contacted by a lass, Cindy, frae Canada.
She is looking for a lair of Millicent Sloan. Lair is 2B, 1319

Any chance you could take yer wee dug a stroll up that way?

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 15 September 09 01:23 BST (UK)
Joking aside,
I would like to emphasise that damnonii (Lora) has put in a heck of a lot of effort in trying to get results for folk in Cathcart.
Yes Lora, yer walkin the dug, but yer makin that extra effort.
Thanks.
Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sjm21560 on Tuesday 15 September 09 09:46 BST (UK)
Dear Lora, many apologies for mis-reading the posts and crediting Dave!  :-[

I vaguely remember my father taking me to the cemetery to visit the grave when I was about 2 or 3 as we lived in Simshill at the time. I've written to Rhuallan House so hopefully they will be able to provide the lair reference.

Apologies once again
Stewart
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 15 September 09 11:29 BST (UK)
Stewart,
First time I've ever come across anyone on this site (or just about in Glasgow) that lived in Simshill.
Where and when?
I lived in Elmore Avenue from '68 until '85.
Ma wee maw still lives there.
I'm living in Langside now.
Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Billy Anderson on Tuesday 15 September 09 12:15 BST (UK)
Dave,
Langside!
I lived in Dundrennan road before moving to OZ,
will send you a PM,
Billy.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 15 September 09 12:19 BST (UK)
Billy, yer jesting.
I'm in Dundrennan now!!
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Tuesday 15 September 09 20:20 BST (UK)
Lora,
Jings Crivvens Help Ma Boab!

You do all the work, I get the credit.  No fair!!!   :(


May I ask a favour though please?

I've been contacted by a lass, Cindy, frae Canada.
She is looking for a lair of Millicent Sloan. Lair is 2B, 1319

Any chance you could take yer wee dug a stroll up that way?

Dave

Joking aside,
I would like to emphasise that damnonii (Lora) has put in a heck of a lot of effort in trying to get results for folk in Cathcart.
Yes Lora, yer walkin the dug, but yer makin that extra effort.
Thanks.
Dave

aw shucks Dave, thanks  ;D

Had a look around 2B this evening for Millicent Sloan - No stone I'm afraid but got pics anyway, will email you them to pass on. :) 

Dear Lora, many apologies for mis-reading the posts and crediting Dave!  :-[

I vaguely remember my father taking me to the cemetery to visit the grave when I was about 2 or 3 as we lived in Simshill at the time. I've written to Rhuallan House so hopefully they will be able to provide the lair reference.

Apologies once again
Stewart

You're forgiven ;) 
Nah don't worry about it, it's too long a thread now to expect people to read through all our ramblings.  Hope you get a reply from East Ren quickly. 

I very much doubt it if you were that young but if you have any memories of where you went when you visited let me know!  ;D
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: robeena on Friday 04 December 09 03:02 GMT (UK)

Back on the trail of my Edgars. Can anyone tell me in what years the Old Cathcart Cemetery was used?  Looking for Jane Edgar nee Smith died between 1851 and 1855 and James Edgar (her husband) died 1874 in Cathcart. I very much doubt if they had a headstone but who and where would details of the burial be, East Renfrewshire Council or elsewhere?  Have a trip coming up in May and if I know where to look might have a go at it.  Thanks
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: andrew shanks on Sunday 06 December 09 18:04 GMT (UK)
My gt grand aunt Catherine McFarlane Shanks b4 May 1876 was living at Kilmailing Terrace, Cathcart at the time of the 1881 census - and that is the last that we can find of her anywhere.

I would be interested to know whether she is residing in Cathcart cemetery, so if anyone finds her there I would be very grateful to hear from them.

 :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Sunday 06 December 09 18:52 GMT (UK)
There may have been a Kilmailing Terrace in 1881 but there isn't one now.  There is a Kilmailing Road.  It is just feasible that part of what is now called Kilmailing Rd, was the \terrace.
I pass it regularly.
At the very top of Kilmailing Rd is the remains of Cathcart Old Parish Church and the graveyard.  Not easily accessible as I think I've possibly mentioned earlier in this thread.
Bonus is, it is not a huge graveyard.  I've been round every gravestone in it in the course of an afternoon.
Something has come up today that might prevent me going searching for you but equally, depending on how things turn out, I might just feel like going tomorrow.

No promises at this stage.

Dave


Others reading this thread might be interested to know that I spent several hours in Cathcart cemetery (the big one!) on Friday looking for a particular grave - I found it!
Couldn't believe it as the section the family is buried in is probably the most overgrown in the entire cemetery.....brambles, ivy, moss, wet leaves and ice...none of it defeated me.  LOL
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 08 December 09 10:36 GMT (UK)
OK folks - you've got an hour to add names that I should look for.
Wall climbing coming up!

It's OLD Cathcart cemetery I'm going to this morning.

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 08 December 09 10:48 GMT (UK)
PS - no need to repost if you've asked already - I have a list. LOL

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: cathy1075 on Wednesday 06 January 10 21:10 GMT (UK)
Hi Dave,

     I was wondering the next time you are at the Cathcart Cemetery you could keep your eyes open for any Urie's or Main's buried there?

Thanks

Cathy
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Wednesday 06 January 10 22:36 GMT (UK)
Will do.
I'm pretty sure last time I was in Cathcart I saw some Urie graves - my pal is called Urie so it jumped out at me.  I was searching around section F.
That was in the Cathcart Cemetery which, as has been said before, is massive.
Unless you are very lucky, finding a grave by chance is slim, really need Section and lair details.

Old Cathcart is much smaller and searchable in an hour or so.  Pity it's under 6 inches of snow just now.

I'm looking after my mother just now and I can't get out much, even if the snow melts.

I've got a list - Main / Urie added but if you can find lair details - all the better.

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: cathy1075 on Thursday 07 January 10 00:59 GMT (UK)
Thanks Dave, I tried emailing East Renfrewshire Council a few time but haven't heard back from them.  I will see what I can do to get the section and liar numbers.  I know that the weather here hasn't been all that great too.  I hope all is well with your mother.
Thanks again.

Cathy
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: azmara on Sunday 11 April 10 10:40 BST (UK)
Hello. ;)
 Is your walking in Cathcart cemetery still happening??
I'm searching for my gggrandmother
Margaret GUNN b 1807 d 21/6/1888
Buried in Cathcart cemetery

I'm sorry I don't know the gravesite number so just if by chance you see her I would love to know.
Many thanks
Mila  (NZ)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: dipsys dad on Friday 16 April 10 19:17 BST (UK)
Elmore Avenue, eh? My granny lived there for years. We lived across the road in Carna Drive from the 60's until I saw saw sense and cleared off in the 70's.
There's none of the family left in Glasgow now, with me being in Forfar and the rest in Australia.
Best wishes,
John C.

Away the Loons!
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Friday 16 April 10 19:27 BST (UK)
Remote chance we knew each other?  I was 11 in '68 when we moved there.  Carna was a bit doon the road but I knew a few folk.
Glad you had the sense to stay in Scotland :D

Depending on your age, we possibly knew each other.

I went to Simshill primary for 6 months around '68.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: dipsys dad on Saturday 17 April 10 12:40 BST (UK)
Hi again! By 1968, I was at King's Park, but I was at Simshill before that under the great Miss Adams. I was pretty well known under the name of Nippy. That name, however, is long dead and buried and I don't want to resurrect it, so consider this the last mention of it! I was also an officer in the 95th. BB (Junior Section), and was on the committee at the Cathcart Kirk youth club in the church hall.
Enough of the cv here, though! If it rings any bells you can let me know.
Cheers, John C.

Loons for promotion!
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: southwoodside on Monday 19 April 10 08:07 BST (UK)
Have you come across a monument of two sisters called Brown with a relief portrait of the sisters on the monument ? :-\

 :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Monday 19 April 10 09:17 BST (UK)
@John C.
I was in the 95th and went to the youth club - 1216 club was on a Saturday night if I remember correctly.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: southwoodside on Monday 19 April 10 19:43 BST (UK)
I think you gave me the wrong reply; I was asking about the monument to two sisters called Brown.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Monday 19 April 10 23:37 BST (UK)
@ southwoodside
This is an open thread.
It's been on the 'go' for a long time.
I'm having a bit of banter with John.
Having said that, I'll keep a look out for the Brown sisters. 
What you have to understand is the size of Cathcart cemetery.  If you can find the lair reference, then it will be easier for someone to find the particular stone / lair that you are interested in.
Please have a look back at some of the earlier posts - there is at least one that indicdates how many thousands of people that are buried in Cathcart.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: southwoodside on Tuesday 20 April 10 08:20 BST (UK)
Oh, right. I thought since I was notified...ah, now I see. I used other forums before and they only notified me if the reply was for me personally. Anyway, thanks for this. I am going to contact various sources about lair info. btw the details of the monument are:
Margaret and Annie Brown (1888) with a double relief portrait of the girls. I've recently had a look but, like you say, it's a huge graveyard. It was made by Pittendrigh Macgillivray a renowned sculptor.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: cathy1075 on Tuesday 20 April 10 16:54 BST (UK)

Back on the trail of my Edgars. Can anyone tell me in what years the Old Cathcart Cemetery was used?  Looking for Jane Edgar nee Smith died between 1851 and 1855 and James Edgar (her husband) died 1874 in Cathcart. I very much doubt if they had a headstone but who and where would details of the burial be, East Renfrewshire Council or elsewhere?  Have a trip coming up in May and if I know where to look might have a go at it.  Thanks
Robeena during your trip in may can look for any Urie's buring there?  Don't spend alot of time only if you come across them.  Thanks, Cathy
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: southwoodside on Tuesday 20 April 10 18:18 BST (UK)
@Cathy1075, there's a Thomas Urie in Cathcart cemetary, died 1880. See www.findagrave.com. Just remembered the name somehow. A photo too.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: cathy1075 on Tuesday 20 April 10 18:39 BST (UK)
Hi, I added Thomas Urie on Findagrave but thank you.  I also added 2 Mary's and James.  Someone sent me the poictures.  I'm also looking for any Main's or Mutries.  I know there are a lot more Urie's in Cathcart (could be the old churchyard) but I'm sure some of them are very hard to read.

Thanks again,

Cathy
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Friday 23 April 10 08:38 BST (UK)
wow I've missed a lot!  Sorry I've not been on in a while, and for some reason I've stopped getting email notifications of updates to the thread so I didn't realise.

Ok firstly @southwoodside - here you go!

I don't have a picture of the names, which are on the side of the monument, just the relief.  I'll get better pictures and the side of it for you.  My dad is very interested in McGillivary and has quite a lot of information on him if you're interested. 

(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/forums/PittendreighMcGillivray.jpg)
(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/forums/PMGravestonefull.jpg)


@cathy1075-  Hi  ;D  I'm the person from findagrave who gave you the Urie graves.  I haven't spotted any more but I haven't been there as often as I used to.


@azmara I'll keep an eye out next time I'm there but you would be better trying to contact the council I think.  I have pictures of the following Gunn's just in case they're any relation:
James B. C and sons George Grey and John McMuldroch Gunn
Margaret Gunn wife of George Mark, d.1913
Constable William Gunn and wife Annie which a person asked for earlier in this thread.

@robeena - the big cemetery opened in 1877 so your Edgar's would be in the Old churchyard if anywhere

@Coonwarra name rings a bell but checked my hard drive and I don't have it, will note it down with the others :)


Sorry that ended up a bit of a rushed post, will come back to it later, promise! :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: southwoodside on Friday 23 April 10 20:13 BST (UK)
@damnonii:

Superb. Any rough idea in what part of the cemetary it stands ? I only recently discovered Macgillivray through the Glasgow Boys exhibition currently on at Kelvingrove Art Gallery. I have a print out from "Glasgow City of Sculpture" website which mentions a number of sites of his work in Glasgow such as in the Necropolis. Glasgow Cathedral and on the City Chambers. I intend to visit all these sites, God willing. I am even going to purchase a decent camera for this and other local history and art subjects.

Glad your father likes him. I might want to know something about Macgillivray and he might be able to help perhaps ?

Anyway, for just now, thanks for your help.






Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Friday 23 April 10 22:12 BST (UK)
hello, I got better photos today and have marked it on the cemetery map for you so if you pm me your email address I'll send you all the info.  I forgot how nice the one in Cathcart is, though very sad.  I thought that the relief was of mother Bessie (died age 27) with daughter Margaret (died age 5).  No Annie is mentioned?  Looking at the dates it seems Bessie died not long after giving birth to Margaret. 

If you walk up from the main gate look out for another nice relief by Kellock Brown on the left of locomotive workers.  And on the Glasgow Boys theme, George Henry is actually buried in Cathcart.  Dad just came across it one day in the process of doing the war graves.  It's a very modest grave which belongs to his mother's family and barely mentions him. 
http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GSmid=46994750&GRid=32517829&
Stupidly we forgot to note down exactly where it is and I couldn't find it last time I tried.  It's in the middle of section 'I' somewhere I think, but because it's such an ordinary grave it doesn't stand out.

My dad has posted a small bio on McGillivray here which includes photos of 2 memorials in the Necropolis (the Allan memorial is very impressive, well worth a visit).  I think he might have some more info in files, I'm not sure.
http://scottishmonuments.s2.bizhat.com/scottishmonuments-ftopic84.html
(The missing photo is Cathcart)

I also have a couple of pictures of clay models from the Scots Magazine which I can send

sorry I'm rambling here, better shut up! 

Here's some more pictures, but as I said pm me your email address and I'll send you them all

(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/forums/inscription2.jpg)
(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/forums/inscription3.jpg)
(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/forums/reliefmotheranddaughter.jpg)
(http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk89/reniannen/forums/relieflowerhalf.jpg)







Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Saturday 08 May 10 13:34 BST (UK)
Good afternoon all. 
It is a particularly sunny day here in Glasgow and I feel the need to escape the confines of my castle!
I've given the servants the day off and am just leaving for a visit to Cathcart Old Parish cemetery.

Armed with camera and a list of all names previously mentioned on the thread, I will attempt to scale the battlements that surround the afore mentioned kirkyard.

In passing it on Tuesday, I noticed that Glasgow Uni Archaelogical Society is carrying out a survey.  Not sure what, if anything, they will be doing by way of recording names on stones but it will be an interesting project to follow.

Quick snap of the poster on the main gate attached.

I'll report back later.

Dave  :)

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Saturday 08 May 10 17:36 BST (UK)
Hi again folks.

Had a very pleasant wander around Old Cathcart for a couple of hours.  No need for me to clamber over any walls today as the archaeologists were in and the gate was open for the first time I can recall since I was but a lad.

Spoke to one of the archaeologists and as part of their survey, they are recording the MIs of every stone where they can.  They have scheduled another 3 weekends to complete the work.  The chap I spoke with was unsure where and when the report will be published, or whether it will be available to the public.  I do have an address for the project leader and I'll contact her soon (if not tonight).
The same chap[ tells me he is at stone 200 or so of about 240 in the churchyard - I only counted about 140???

I've jotted down the names of the legible stones for future reference should anyone else be asking.

Of the names already on the thread, I never found too many.  Some I have attached photos before.
I don't have time just now to go over the thread thoroughly but certain names jumped out at me - whether I've posted pics before or not, I've not checked.

Names I noticed are..... Smith / Miller/ Barr / Pollok / Pollock   

None of the other names mentioned in the thread were obvious so, their stones either dont exist in Cathcart Old Parish or are perhaps in Cathcart or Linn.

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: damnonii on Saturday 08 May 10 18:26 BST (UK)
That's excellent news!  I really hope they do publish it publicly, seems a waste otherwise, and hopefully it might lead to more conservation measures.  I tried to see if they have a website but I couldn't find anything.  Out of interest who's the project leader?  I did 2 years of Archaeology, wonder if I might know them.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: FintryGirl on Sunday 09 May 10 01:21 BST (UK)
Hi Dave,

Just in case no one tells you, you do good work for people and fulfill a lot of slot that are missing in their history, I appreciate that you trudge through those old old graveyards in hopes of finding information for their inquiries.

Take care Rita from Canada
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: CitizenSmith on Tuesday 29 June 10 10:55 BST (UK)
Hi Dave

Like others on this fascinating thread, I have relatives buried in Cathcart Old Parish churchyard. According to an illustration in a book published in 1880, they had a fine monument, like a huge open book, lying flat on the ground, with railings around it. Their surnames were Lee, Smith and Cooper.

Wonder if you've ever seen anything like that during your explorations?

Thanks too for the info about the archaeological survey. I'll be dropping them a line.

Best wishes
Sharon 
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 29 June 10 11:24 BST (UK)
Thanks Rita.  You give me too much credit.  There are others do a lot more trudging than me.

Sharon, I've had a look through the names I noted down after my last visit and don't see Lee or Cooper.  There are a couple of Smith stones but not in groups.
I can't think of a stone such as you describe but will have a look.  Any chance you could post a scan of the illustration? - it might ring a bell with me.

The Churchyard is not as accessible as it was, the gates always being locked and the wall I normally clamber over has been repaired - I might try climbing the gates but with the recent vandalism in Cardonald* I might get a few odd looks!

* http://news.stv.tv/scotland/182171-major-vandalism-at-cardonald-cemetery/
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: CitizenSmith on Tuesday 29 June 10 22:53 BST (UK)
Hi Dave

Many thanks. Here's a scan of the illustration. It seems to have been drawn in 1874 and then - as I said - published in 1880.

A contact on another list said he remembers having the Cooper headstone pointed out to him when he was a child in the 1950s/1960s. The open book monument was described as being next to it - but perhaps both have suffered from weather and vandals since then. 

Appreciate your help - thanks again.

Best wishes
Sharon
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 29 June 10 23:07 BST (UK)
That looks amazing.  I'm certain it's no longer there, I have no doubt I would have photographed something as impressive and remember it.

I wonder if it was moved somewhere else?   

Hmmm!  where to research it  ???

Dave

Added - there are a few small areas that are incredibly overgrown with Ivy but I don't even recall a mound as big as this appears to be.  It's a smallish cemetery.  Will check it out (if I can get in).
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: CitizenSmith on Wednesday 30 June 10 08:10 BST (UK)
Hi Dave

Many thanks for your help.

I've sent a mail to the archaeologists/monument transcribers you met and will let you know if I hear from them.

Best wishes
Sharon
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: jrt on Wednesday 30 June 10 08:27 BST (UK)
hi i dont want to ask anything  ;Di just wanted to say how much ive enjoyed reading this thread

                   thanks
                                jrt
 
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Wednesday 30 June 10 08:56 BST (UK)
Look forward to hearing how you get on Sharon - I've been meaning to contact them but have been too lazy.

jrt - join in any time.  Glad you're enjoying it.

I'm off out NOW to visit Ramshorn in Glasgow, then off to a little known graveyard behind Glasgow Cathedral.

Must rush - I have to get ready, catch a bus and be in the centre of Glasgow in just over half an hour!!!

Someone call ahead and get them to dig a hole now - This rushing is killing me!

 ;D

Dave
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: mhomac on Saturday 03 July 10 20:19 BST (UK)
Hi Dave,
Is there any chance you've seen the name McNay on your travels round Cathcart? I have two......Jessie McLennan and Jane Shankland both married McNay men.
I have Title Deeds to the Cemetery, for both ladies, but they only quote Lair numbers, no section mentioned.
I know its a long shot but worth asking. If you have nothing, any ideas of how I could find the sections the lairs are in?
Thanks.
Morag
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Saturday 03 July 10 20:35 BST (UK)
Hi Morag,
It's not a name that springs to mind, certainly not one that I have written down of the legible stones in the Cathcart Old Parish cemetery.
I haven't got McLennan / Shankland in the Old Parish either.

Are you aware of which cemetery it is - Old or new?  Date would be a clue and I believe dates have been discussed earlier in the thread.

You could try contacting the following to ascertain whether they have records.

Cemeteries & Crematoria  Registrar
20 Trongate
Glasgow
G1 5ES

Phone:0141 287 3961
E-mail: les[at][/blue]glasgow.gov.uk (Replace [at] with @)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: mhomac on Saturday 03 July 10 21:19 BST (UK)
Thanks. I will give them a call on Monday and try to get more information. What I have is rather patchy so they might help fill out the bones, so to speak. ;D
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Saturday 03 July 10 21:50 BST (UK)
Good luck. 
Really hope they can help out.  My concern would be how much they might charge for a search but I reckon because you've got the deeds, that'll be a great starting point for them.

Let us know result please.

D


PS - what date are you talking about because I think that would help narrow down which sections are unlikely.



PPS - I'm such a numpty at times, should have thought of this before.  In future, when I visit Cathcart (new), I'll print of the map and try and date the individual sections.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: mhomac on Monday 05 July 10 10:40 BST (UK)
Morning Dave,
Called Glasgow who told me Cathcart came under East Renfrewshire. Very nice lady gave me answers to my questons.
Jessie McNay nee McLennan might have a gravestone in Section 2B (Linn Section) lair #230.
Janet Mcnay nee Shankland might have a gravestone in Section 2A (Linn Section) Lair #616

If you are in that area sometime, could you have a look please. Much appreciated.
Morag
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Br1gau on Monday 05 July 10 16:57 BST (UK)
Hi,

This looks a great Cathcart resource!!
I'm looking for the grave of William Love 1680 - 1737, Minister of Cathcart 1710 - 1737.

As I remember from seeing a reference to it ages ago, the grave is in a row with other Cathcart ministers, fairly near to the church itself, Cathcart Old Cemetery.  There were also children from his marriage to Mary Lees.

Has anyone seen my Love?

brigau
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: azmara on Sunday 28 November 10 00:32 GMT (UK)
Hello...Are you still researching Cathcart??????  If so could you please watch out for my ggrandmother....Her name is Margaret MACKAY ms. GUNN .buried 25/6/1888
I have been in touch with the council and they tell me she is in Section 1, Lair #1579 if that is of any help??
I must say I LOVE the word 'lair'...It is such a wonderful word for this ... :D
many thanks...
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: CitizenSmith on Wednesday 01 December 10 08:47 GMT (UK)
Hi Dave

I've received a very helpful reply from the archaeologists who were surveying the monuments in Cathcart Old Churchyard earlier this year.

One of my family monuments - the stone on the left in the illustration - does still exist and is in good condition. The Project Director kindly sent me a full transcription of the inscription plus two photos of the monument.

Thanks again for the lead.

Best wishes
Sharon

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Headley on Tuesday 25 January 11 05:40 GMT (UK)
Hi Dave,

I have recently had my great grandparents confirmed buried in the Linn section of Cathcart cemetery. I am writing from New Zealand and wondered if your offer to try and find particular graves made earlier in your posting is still an option.

My grandparents were George Knowles Mitchell & Euphemia Strang Mitchell and were buried in 1936 & 1920 respectively.

If there was a headstone I would be most grateful to have a photo of it. The location of the lair is section 2A lair no 1800.

If you are still able help out I would really appreciate it.

Many thanks.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Tuesday 25 January 11 06:12 GMT (UK)
Headley,
Welcome to Rootschat.

It's brilliant that you have the lair details - will make it so much easier to find.

Having said that, I've not been 'body snatching' for ages - possibly a year or more.  I DO keep a track of all the names posted here and, given a chance, I'll have a look.

I suspect tho', someone else that is involved in this thread will find and photograph
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Headley on Tuesday 25 January 11 06:51 GMT (UK)
Hi Dave,

Thanks for your speedy response. I appreciate any help you or anyone else can give.

Cheers.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: azmara on Tuesday 25 January 11 19:26 GMT (UK)
Hello .Mila here from NZ again
...If anyone IS looking in Cathcart cemetery,I too have found out my ggrandmothers grave site...
Margaret MACKAY (GUNN)  Section 1 , Lair #1579.
I also would be grateful if anyone can find anything for me.
Regards, Mila :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: vvbg on Friday 11 February 11 13:57 GMT (UK)
Hi Dave,
You haven't come across a Maryann Sturgeon (nee Fagan) on your travels around Cathcart Cemetery by any chance?
She was my great grandmother who died on 10. Jan. 1955 aged 81, but i don't have the lair no.etc.

Cheers,
Marie
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: seek on Friday 15 July 11 05:02 BST (UK)
Hello
I am researching the Crerar, McDonald, Alexander, Scade & Hill. Just wondering if any of these names are in the Cathcart cementary & how can i obtain a list & photograph of their headstones as i am not a local.
Thankyou
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: nkbauer on Saturday 21 January 12 18:56 GMT (UK)
Hello,
I'm wondering if there is someone who visits Cathcart cemetery who wouldn't mind looking for the gravestones of three relatives. A fellow rootchatter has suggested that the graves are likely in the Linn section because of the dates of death. As I live in Canada I am unable to do a personal search and would appreciate any help in the matter. I have contacted someone at the East Renfrewshire office to try to find on the section and lair numbers of the graves.

The three relatives are:

my great grandmother, Catherine ALLAN MS Clark, b. 1844-d. 28 Nov 1916

my great aunt, Janet CAMERON MS Allan, b. 1889- d. 11Dec 1918

my great grandfather, William ALLAN, b. 1841. His death was between 1894 and 1901. I can't find his date of death on SP

The family resided on Minard Rd in Glasgow according to the 1901 and 1911 censuses. I have the information for the two women's deaths from memorial cards sent to my grandmother.

Kind regards, Nan
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wildrosecanuck on Thursday 12 April 12 16:59 BST (UK)
My great-grandmother, Mrs. Janet Bryson Kennedy Cockburn, was apparently buried in August 1919 in Cathcart Cemetery, in section M, (row 1?), lair 162.  Her son, my grandfather, Thomas Kennedy Cockburn, may have been buried nearby in April 1961.  As I live in Canada, I would very much appreciate it if somebody could confirm Janet's burial.  Ideally, it would be great to see a photo of her headstone as well as that of her son Tom.

Janet was president of the Central Branch chapter the British Women's Temperance Association in Glasgow as well as the movement for women's suffrage.  She apparently was a member of delegation that went to meet with P.M. Lloyd George in London.

Thanks in advance!
Bruce
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: mhomac on Thursday 12 April 12 20:15 BST (UK)
Hi again Dave
I'm wondering if by any chance you have managed to find any gravestones or markers for my two relatives. Their details are as follows;

Jessie McNay nee McLennan might have a gravestone in Section 2B (Linn Section) lair #230.
Janet Mcnay nee Shankland might have a gravestone in Section 2A (Linn Section) Lair #616

If you are in that area sometime, could you have a look please? I would really like to know if there's anything in that section for them.
Many thanks
Morag
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Moren on Wednesday 13 March 13 16:40 GMT (UK)
If anyone is visiting in the future I wonder would they be kind enough to photograph a grave for me.

It is section 2F lair 1023  the names are

Margaret Gilchrist nee Bell 13/04/1928

Thomas Hedderwick died   04/08/1937

Agnes Hedderwick nee Gilchrist died 11/10/1965
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: olduser1 on Wednesday 12 June 13 13:28 BST (UK)
Anyone visiting Cathcart Cemetery willing to photograph this Lair for me?

Section N Lair no. 55 

Date of Burial     Name                                        Age

31 OCT 1898     Elizabeth Davidson or Eadie        59

28 MAR 1902    Henry Eadie                              56

Thank you

Title: Surnames
Post by: Poppy62 on Wednesday 12 June 13 16:54 BST (UK)
Hi Waitohman

I noticed while browsing that you have Moore's and Clark/e's in your surname history.

I also research the same names.

James Clarke married to Mary Moore in Clydebank, both were born in Ireland.

Rosie :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Scott_M on Thursday 29 August 13 23:12 BST (UK)
Hi guys, I have just picked up certificates of a few ancestors for the Cathcart Cemetery providing Lair details.
Is there a map that can be found to see where the Lair numbers may be situated?
Where would I get this if so?

Grateful for any help

Thanks
Scott Morland
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Thursday 29 August 13 23:34 BST (UK)
Huge cemetery.  Not easy to locate graves but this might assist.

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Scott_M on Thursday 29 August 13 23:47 BST (UK)
Daval, Thank u very much
It may help.
I am actually over in Scotland from NZ at the moment. Returning back in a few weeks.
I have been down at the Cemetery and it is massive. Shame on so many Memorial stones having been what looks like vandalized. Many toppled over and many gone. the map definitely helps me and although no lair numbers u have narrowed things down for me.
R, 2E, I      are the areas I am now able to look at from your map.
Thank u again
Scott Morland
NZ
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: daval57 on Friday 30 August 13 00:06 BST (UK)
The main thing is locating the section.
Usually - if not eroded, on the base of each stone the lair number is marked.  Once you find a stone that has a lair number on it, check the stones on either side to see which direction they are running - then search accordingly.

Good luck and wear decent walking shoes (distance and weather are a big consideration!  ;) )
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Scott_M on Friday 30 August 13 00:14 BST (UK)
Great advice.. Thank you again
Scott
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 12:11 GMT (UK)
Hi, I used to be damnonii (I ended up hating that name, no offence to the tribe!).  I'm really sorry I let this lapse and for leaving you in the lurch Dave.  Hope you can forgive me. 

I haven't been a regular visitor to Cathcart for a while, as some know it was tied to dog walking and helping my dad photograph the war graves, both of which have stopped now.  But my January health kick has brought me back to old haunts.  Last weekend I revisited this thread and couldn't believe how long it had been and how many I'd missed! 

I don't know if some of you might have got photographs from daval or another source now, but I made a list and I've photographed them all anyway.  Will post them below.  Although bear with me as I re-learn the forum  :-\

Let me know if anyone has any others they'd like photographed.  It helps to get me out the door if I have a mission!

Lora
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:04 GMT (UK)
For mhomac

here are photos of Thomas and Janet McNay's stone 2A.616.  Will post the other one below as I'm limited to the size of photos I can attach. 

Transcription, as the writing is difficult to read on the photo:

In Loving Memory of
Thomas McNay
Who died 28th December 1911
Aged 52 years

Also his son Thomas
Who died in South Africa
23rd August 1901 aged 22 years

His daughter Annie
who died at Port Glasgow
18th April 1890 Aged 6 years

His wife
Janet Shankland
Who died 6th April 1944
Aged 82 years



I actually already had a photo of this because it looks like their son was a Boer war casualty.



Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:10 GMT (UK)
for mhomac (2)

here's 2B.230.  Unfortunately the stone is broken and someone has planted a tree near it which has taken over.  It looks to me though like none of the writing is missing and the stone only commemorates Jessie's husband William. 

Transcription:

In
Loving memory
of
My dear husband
William John McNay
Died 10th March 1932
Aged 44 years
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: mhomac on Sunday 26 January 14 13:13 GMT (UK)
Thanks so much. Will send a pm now.
Morag
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:15 GMT (UK)
For Headley

Here's photos of the Mitchell's stone at 2A.1800

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:18 GMT (UK)
For Moren

Here's a photo of the plaque to Margaret.  There's no other stone I'm afraid.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:25 GMT (UK)
For azmara

Here it is, finally - I'm sorry!  Glad you got the lair number, there's no way I would have found this just looking as it was buried under leaves and mud. 

Transcription:

In loving memory of
Margaret Gunn
Widow of the late
Hugh Mackay, Tain
Died 21st June 1888
Aged 82 years

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:34 GMT (UK)
For wildrosecanuck

Bad news, sorry. There's no stone on the lair  :(   I'm certain I'm in the right place as the number is legible on the stone at M.159 so there's not a lot of room for error.

It's a very bad section where most of the graves have toppled but the only possible I could see was the white tablet lying face down which you can see to the left of the tree.  Managed to pull this up and it wasn't hers.  If you get the lair for her son Thomas I can have a look for that. By 1961 he may be in the new cemetery.  It's possible she's mentioned on his stone?
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:37 GMT (UK)
For olduser1

An easy one, thank you ;D  The stone is on the main path near the main gate on Netherlee Road. 

Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Sunday 26 January 14 13:42 GMT (UK)
Right, that's everybody for now I hope.  I will come back to this later and PM people individually now I can.  I can send full resolution pics and maps by email.

Lora :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Moren on Sunday 26 January 14 13:46 GMT (UK)
Thank you so much.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: wildrosecanuck on Sunday 26 January 14 19:39 GMT (UK)
Thanks, Lora, for checking for Janet's headstone in Cathcart!  The cemetery does seem to be a bit of a mess in that section.  I may be in Glasgow this summer, and perhaps I'll try to track down the tombs of Janet and her son Thomas and Thomas' wife Catherine.

regards,
Bruce Cockburn (of Edmonton, Canada)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: olduser1 on Monday 27 January 14 09:02 GMT (UK)
Lora, Thanks for taking the time to photograph the Eadie grave, the photos you took were spot -on.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: mhomac on Monday 27 January 14 09:50 GMT (UK)
Thanks Lora for fabulous pictures and directions. Much appreciated.
Morag.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: apanderson on Monday 27 January 14 12:23 GMT (UK)
Not looking for anything - I just thought I'd say welcome back Lora!

You've been missed.

Anne  :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Yvonne19 on Sunday 02 February 14 15:46 GMT (UK)
Good afternoon,

Please could someone see if there is a headstone for Margaret (Maggie) Ditchburn Graham Shaw.  17.12.1903 - 20.08.1907.  She died of measles.  Her parents are buried in Kirkcaldy, but on their headstsone it states Maggie was buried in Cathcart.

Many thanks,   Yvonne
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Saturday 08 February 14 15:01 GMT (UK)
Hi Yvonne, sorry for the delay, I thought I used to be notified of replies, but I'm not (yes it was stupid of me not to check!)  Cathcart cemetery is huge so the chances of coming across her grave accidentally are quite slim.  Your best bet would be to contact East Renfrewshire council, who, going by earlier posts in this thread, are very helpful at giving out lair details.  Their burial enquiries phone no is: 0141 577 3913 from here:
http://www.eastrenfrewshire.gov.uk/index.aspx?articleid=1718
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Yvonne19 on Saturday 08 February 14 15:51 GMT (UK)
Thanks for your reply.  I will give them a ring and see what they come up with.

Yvonne
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Yvonne19 on Wednesday 26 February 14 16:08 GMT (UK)
Hello,  the lady at the burial records was VERY helpful.  The lair details are Section M, Lair 280.  However she couldn't tell me if there is a headstone, but there are 4 people in the lair.  In addition to Margaret Ditchburn Graham Shaw there is Richard Masson d 07.03.1892, Emma Masson d 02.05.1891 and John Harvey d 10.12.1919.  Two of these people I know are Maggie's extended family - the other was completely new to me and has given me another line of research!

Yvonne 19
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Wednesday 26 February 14 18:02 GMT (UK)
That's great. I'll go and take a look at the weekend, weather permitting. 

It doesn't seem to have been that uncommon, having other people buried in the lair who weren't close family.  We discovered a neighbour in a family plot, so it could be that John Harvey isn't related at all!
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Monday 03 March 14 21:48 GMT (UK)
Hi, sorry internet problems meant I gave up trying to load anything yesterday.  I found the lair but I'm afraid there's no headstone.  I did search the area round about in case there was a tablet that had been displaced or broken and I didn't see anything.

I've attached a pic anyway.  The stone lying down is 279, for once it's clearly marked, and 280 is to the right.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Yvonne19 on Sunday 09 March 14 09:39 GMT (UK)
Sorry for delay in replying, but I didn't receive a message from Rootschat and I try to only check once a week.

Thanks for taking the trouble to take and photo and post it.  I'm very grateful.

Yvonne
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: sbutler on Thursday 10 July 14 07:59 BST (UK)
Had a very pleasant wander around Old Cathcart for a couple of hours.  No need for me to clamber over any walls today as the archaeologists were in and the gate was open for the first time I can recall since I was but a lad.

Spoke to one of the archaeologists and as part of their survey, they are recording the MIs of every stone where they can.  They have scheduled another 3 weekends to complete the work.  The chap I spoke with was unsure where and when the report will be published, or whether it will be available to the public.  I do have an address for the project leader and I'll contact her soon (if not tonight).
The same chap[ tells me he is at stone 200 or so of about 240 in the churchyard - I only counted about 140???

I've jotted down the names of the legible stones for future reference should anyone else be asking.

I was wondering if in your notes for the Cathcart Old Parish cemetery you had any Ewings. In particular, I'm after these two:


We couldn't find burial records for them, but they lived in New Cathcart, and given the year it seems like the Old Parish cemetery is the most likely place. I tried contacting the email address what was on the Glasgow University survey sign, but looks like it's no longer active  :(
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: olduser1 on Wednesday 16 July 14 11:10 BST (UK)
PM sent
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: dipsys dad on Monday 01 June 15 21:19 BST (UK)
As a teenager in the early 70's, we used the kirkyard as our meeting place, and, looking at the place on Saturday after a 30 odd year absence, I am shocked. A great many markers have simply disappeared, and others are so defaced it is a disgrace. However, in the 70's, there was a survey of the place by the local history group. It was very amateurish but it did uncover quite a few flat stones in the old section which are completely covered by turf. These were recorded and covered up again. To answer another question, I remember one being uncovered in fantastic condition, dedicated to the Urie family, with two or three souls underneath it. I do recall a great many of the names of people buried there who are no longer marked, so if anybody needs help, I'll try.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: AsH62 on Monday 06 June 16 12:08 BST (UK)
Hi. I found out today where my great grandparents are buried after 5 years of searching. It's in the Linn Section of Cathcart Cemetery. lair 2B 2001. They are James and Agnes Masterton and they died in 1952 and 1954.

I immediately went on the internet and found this thread and am hoping that it is still active. I can't get to Scotland for at least another year and was hoping that there may be someone going to the cemetery who would be willing to see if there is a headstone for my great grandparents. I know it's a long shot but if it is possible it would be fantastic. I can't believe I am this close after years of searching.

Thanks Alison
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Monday 06 June 16 23:09 BST (UK)
Hi,  I'll have a look for you and get photos if there's a stone  :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: AsH62 on Tuesday 07 June 16 10:18 BST (UK)
Good morning Timrousbeastie

Thank you so much, that is really kind of you.

Alison
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Tuesday 07 June 16 20:33 BST (UK)
PM sent with photos :)
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: AsH62 on Tuesday 07 June 16 22:07 BST (UK)
Hi Lora
I don't know what to say, to be honest when I saw the photos they made me a bit tearful - thank you so much. It's wonderful having the pictures and it was so kind of you to do this.
Thanks from both me and dad, I am going to see him tomorrow and I will take the pictures to show him.
Alison
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: AsH62 on Tuesday 07 June 16 22:10 BST (UK)
I should have asked, is it OK for me to use the photos on my Ancestry tree and my Family History blog if I credit you?
A
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: timrousbeastie on Tuesday 07 June 16 23:49 BST (UK)
You're welcome, I'm glad I could get them for you.  And yes of course you can use them on your tree!
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: AsH62 on Thursday 09 June 16 00:31 BST (UK)
Thank you
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Orontes57 on Sunday 01 August 21 00:54 BST (UK)
Hi, sorry internet problems meant I gave up trying to load anything yesterday.  I found the lair but I'm afraid there's no headstone.  I did search the area round about in case there was a tablet that had been displaced or broken and I didn't see anything.

I've attached a pic anyway.  The stone lying down is 279, for once it's clearly marked, and 280 is to the right.



Hi Everyone, it has been some time since I wrote to Rootschat wwith alot of help given and received.  I am now interested in the OLd Cemetery Cathcart.  I have seen an entry in a series of Books of Monuments of Renfrewshire. Not quite the title Page 9, Vol One. I am very interested in the entries for the Smith family in th cemetery, as our elusive John McARthurs mother was a Margaret Smith and we have yet to find her. There is a Margaret Smith that fits the age we need for John McArthur mother. We haven't found anything in Scotland for John but have his marriage certificate.  No birth or where has surfaced but he was in Cathcart,Renfrewshire at the time of his marriage held at Cambuslang 2 Dec 1856. These entries interest me and hop there is more info. No 73. James Smith died or buried 5 Jul 1854 aged 89. His wife Margaret Mior 13 Jan 1835 aged 70. dau, Margaret 9 Oct 1856 aged 55, it then says s Jas, Superintendant of Police, Glasgow.  Our John McArthur, used to be a Sunday School President at patersonia, Tasmania where died and is buried in the churchyard in Tasmania and he was a lay preacher.  This makes me wonder if James Smith was a Church Minister (I know there was a Rev James Smith in CAthcart, but no details) and they brought him up. Johns Marr Cert says his father was Duncan McArthur amd mther Margaret Smith, but no marriage for his parents. John would have been living in Cathcart at the time of this Margarets death and burial, then he had marriage banns at Cathcart, but married in Cambulang then he and Isabella Stevenson, his wife left for Tasmania on the Broomielaw on the 20th Dec 1856. He has left no details in any document. His wife Isabella left a illegitimate dau, that a nice lady on Rootschat helped me with and we have since  located famiy of that daughter on the mainland Australia. Stevenson family as well. No McArthur DNA has emerged in Familytreedna, MyHeritage or Ancestry.com to date. What happened to the son James the Superintendant of Police at Glasgow as his family may help.  Thanks for any clues.
Title: Re: Cathcart, Cathcart Old Parish and Linn
Post by: Orontes57 on Sunday 01 August 21 00:57 BST (UK)
James Smith wife ws Margaret Muir,