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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Herefordshire => Topic started by: cimbrio on Thursday 30 October 08 16:13 GMT (UK)

Title: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Thursday 30 October 08 16:13 GMT (UK)
I'm looking for anyone related to, or who possesses any information about the family of Edward Allen, born around 1803 in Colwall, Herefordshire. He was probably the son of Thomas Allen and his wife Sarah (surname unknown); possible siblings: Thomas (1802), William (1805), Mary Ann (1807), Joseph (1809), Anna Maria (1812) and perhaps Sarah (1814).

Edward married Ann (née Lewis) in 1867 (I think in Colwall) and had the following children:
Ann (1838-1843), John (1842), William Henry (1846), and Clara (1849). All from Colwall.

John married Jane Davied (from Colwall?), and according to the family Bible had:
Annie Marie (1868), Ada Mary "Dot" (1869), Ellen Jane (1870), Rose Fanny (1872-1955), William John  (1876-1960), Maria Annie (1876-1877) and Thomas (1878).

William John married Elizabeth Morris, from Leominster; parents fo Phyllis, Gerald and Elizabeth, my grandmother.

Can anyone provide me with any help? Anyone related?

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Thanks!

Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: The snooper on Tuesday 18 November 08 15:07 GMT (UK)
Cimbrio,

You have (in your second para) Edward Allen and Ann Lewis marrying in 1867 well after the birth of their children. Are you sure this is correct as I have a marriage between them  on the 26 March 1838 in Withington parish. This would make sense given the dates for the children. Incidentally it looks like both of them had been married before

If you think this marriage is correct I will look for birth dates of their kids,

The Snooper
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Tuesday 18 November 08 17:13 GMT (UK)
Hi The Snooner!

Yes, my mistake, indeed Edward must have married Ann in or around 1838 since thie first child was born in the second quarter of 1838 (so Ann must have been pregnant at the time of the marriage if indeed the dates we have are correct). I had no idea they were married before, any idea who to, and if they had any issue? I'm all ears! Thanks so very much! Their children's birthdates (and absolutely anything else you may be able to provide about them) will be immesnsely appreciated!

Thanks!

::)  Cimbrio

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Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: The snooper on Tuesday 18 November 08 19:21 GMT (UK)
Hi,

My source is an index rather than complete details so not a replacement for getting the official certificates.

For Edward and Ann it just says WDR against Edward and WD father name against Ann.

There is a marriage in West Malvern between John ALLEN and Jane DAVIS listed for 16th July 1867 which could be yours I think and then William J ALLEN marries Elizabeth MORRIS in Colwall St James on 18 Oct 1910.

I have searched in vain for any children for Ann and Edward and can find none - this does not mean they did not happen it is just that my index is NOT complete. The same goes for children of John ALLEN and Jane  and William and Elizabeth I'm afraid.


Cheers

The Snooper

Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Wednesday 19 November 08 09:34 GMT (UK)
Very interesting The Snooper!

Do you suppose that Lewis was Ann's married or birth surname? No reference to any parents, is there?

By the way, indeed the other two marriages you mention are those of my great-grandparents and my grandfather's parents, but is Jane's surname Davis or Davies? I had Davies but it might be wrong.

Is there any mention whatsoever as to their place of birth, or name of parents?

These certificates, can they be acquired anywhere? IS there a fee involved? What if I wanted to go up my family tree, searchging for Edward's ancestors, where could I go or ask?

Regards,

Cimbrio
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 19 November 08 16:54 GMT (UK)
don't know if you have this already christening record
name; edward allen
date; 25th sept 1803
place; colwall,hereford
parents; thomas/sarah
ext.rec.IGI

there is also a submitted record that gives the parents as thomas allen and sarah jones.
will see if i can find the marriage.
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 19 November 08 17:17 GMT (UK)
there are these christenings attributed to thomas/sarah
name thomas allen
7th march 1802
william alle
about 20th june 1805
marian allen
26th dec 1807.
joseph allen
19th nov 1809.
then there are also these possibly part of the same family.
sarah allen
7th july 1814
margaret allen
about 12th oct 1817
henry allen
23rd may 1819.
robert allen
9th sept 1821.
all are ext rec IGI

found a submitted entry for the marriage
do not know how reliable it is
thomas allen birth about 1776 married sarah jones
at colwall on 29th may 1801

Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Wednesday 19 November 08 17:40 GMT (UK)
Thanks wozzle!

I am quite impressed!

I recently checked online (I can't remember which source, but it was easy to find - christenings, marriages and burials in Colwall in certain spans of time) and some of the dates and children you mention were indeed on there; however, I don't think the latter children are issue of the same couple because they live in a different place (maybe you can check for yourself). I did find a Thomas Allen christened in 1760 and was under the impression he was Edward's father, but the marriage date of 1801 would prove me wrong. Can it be assured that Edward was the son of Thomas Allen and Sarah Jones? He was the only Edward christened in 1803/1804 in Colwall, and he was certainly the son of A Thomas Allen and Sarah...

Thanks for all your help!
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 19 November 08 18:01 GMT (UK)
all of the children including the later ones were christened in the same place all were children of a thomas and sarah allen
maybe the later ones were the children of a different thomas and sarah allen
i cannot say for certain
all i know is that they are all down on the IGI with the same batch number in colwall,lancs
maybe SKS with a better knowledge of the IGI or with access to colwall parish registers would know.
mick.
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Wednesday 19 November 08 18:19 GMT (UK)
This is the link that I wrote about above. Here you can see that there were a few couples surnamed Allen in the early 1800's who were procreating and christening their children. One of these couples is Thomas and Sarah Allen, and although there is no mention on their "abode" for the first few children, there is such a note for Margaret Allen, for example (Oct 12 1817) whose parents (Thomas and Sarah) do not live in Colwall but in Evendine... Did they move, or is it a different couple altogether? Rather lost here...
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: The snooper on Wednesday 19 November 08 19:10 GMT (UK)
Hi Cimbrio,

Tis me again.

The source I have for the info I have given you is only an index and there is no other information.

The entry for the Edward and Ann it just says WDR against Edward and WD father name against Ann. -This means that Ann's maiden name (or fathers name - the same thing) was Lewis.

Yes you can get the certificates for these events (after 1837) which will give you more information. The basic fee is 7 UK pounds per certificate and it can be done on line.

If you are interested in getting some send me a Personal Message and I will talk you through the procedures.

Cheers


The Snooper
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: netti on Thursday 20 November 08 13:25 GMT (UK)
Just a bit of local knowledge here - Evendine is a road in Colwall so giving an address there would still mean they were of the same village.

I have several instances of my own where sometimes the address is just the village and other times they are more specific - does not necessarily mean a different family.

netti
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: Doffy on Sunday 02 August 09 18:52 BST (UK)
Hi
Edward born 1803  and Ann had
Ann bapt 14.4.1838
John bapt 14.8.1842
William Henry bapt 16.3.1845
Clara bapt 8.4.1849

Robert Allen  born 1821  aged 38 widower.. publican, Colwall.father Thomas Allen, Farmer....  married  Judith Bond, widow, Colwall... father Thomas Knight Cook, Farmer

Joseph Allen born 1809, Labourer, married Hannah Lewis, servant, no parents listed.
children
 Anne bapt 31.3.1844.St James the Great Colwall
Joseph Herbert bapt 24.6.1850 St James the Great,Colwall

Sarah born 1844, married George Hooper, Carpenter..father George Hopper, Carpenter
children
Hannah bapt 21.6.1846
William bapt18.1849
George Thomas Henry bapt 18.6.1854 all at St James

There is an entry  George Ernest bapt 19.8.1877 parents George Henry and Sarah Elizabeth Hooper

Henry Allen was awitness at my gg granfather wedding Henry Willoughby and Sarah Smith in 1845
William J Allen and Elizabeth
poss children
Phyllis E J Dec 1911 ref 6a 757 Ledbury
Gerald W mar 1914 ref 6a 765 Ledbury

Yes Evendine  or Evendine Lane  is Colwall. comes from the village

All the best Dorothy
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Sunday 16 August 09 14:19 BST (UK)
Hi Dorothy!

Sorry it's taken me a while to get back to you. Thanks ever so much for the photos and all that information, I just checked what I had and I was able to fill in a few gaps. Amazing to see, by the way, that one of my relatives was a witness at the wedding of your ancestors! By the way, you are right, Gerald and Phyllis were my great-aunt and great-uncle, brother and sister of my late grandmother. I didn't know about two of the Hooper children, I'll see if I can find anything else on then. Do you mind re-sending the christening date of William Hooper, it just says 18.1849, I think the month must be missing. I'll see if I can find something myself. Though it's fairly unreliable, I have been able to trace the Allen family back several generations more... And I would LOVE to find out more on Robert, who married a woman many years older than he was.

Best regards from Spain

Cimbrio
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: Doffy on Monday 17 August 09 22:26 BST (UK)
Hi Crimbrio
I am sorry but I made a mistake . George and Sarah only had 1 child George Thomas Henry Hooper bapt 18 Jun 1854. I looked on the Bishops Transcripts and there was another George and ? Hopper had the other 2 children. When I doubled checked the Parish Registers it was George and Anne Hooper. That Will teach me to double check.
But George H T was their child.

He married 8 Jul 1876. St James the Great. Colwall
"George Henry Thomas Hooper, 22, bachelor,occupation Artizan, address Plumstead. Father George Hooper Artizan
Sarah Elizabeth Jones,23, Spinster, address Colwall,  farther Thomas Jones, Farmer

Witness Joseph George Gale, Ellen Williams, G Hooper and Sarah Hooper.
"Old Occupations" ... Artizan ... One who is employed in any of the industrial arts; a mechanic, handicraftsman, artificer.

They had 3 children that I can find :-
George Ernest bapt 19 Aug 1877 parents GHT & Sarah Hooper, Colwall. Carpenter
Frank bapt  23 Mar 1879 parents ( it says Henry and Sarah Elizabeth Hooper), Colwall, Tradesman
Frederick bapt 10 or 16 Jan 1881. parents  George Thomas Henry and Elizabeth Hooper, Colwall, Carpenter

Sarah was bapt 7 July 1814 parents Thomas and Sarah Allen.

I was in Colwall last Thursday, God it is beautiful on a sunny day.
A bit rough in the winter, no CH, washing machines and tumble dryers.
They must have had legs like mountain goats.
Any way I took some photos I will post them for you when I put them on the computer.

I have info about Robert and Judith I will post it to you tomorrow.
Have had enough now, hard day at work.
All the best Doffy
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Monday 17 August 09 22:58 BST (UK)
Hello Doffy!

Thanks a lot, I've checked my info and corrected the previous mistakes, thanks anyway!

All I know about Robert is that he married once before marrying a woman much older than he. Her name was Judith Bond (née Cooke). He was born in 1821, and she in 1798; she lived until 1893, and he till 1900. I don't know why they would have married, but all I can think of is material. But who knows. I'd like to know who his first wife was, and whether he had any children (I can only guess his second marriage was childless).

There is also another sister, Margaret, who died shortly after marrying a man called Thomas Croft. I don't know what she died of, but perhaps it may have been childbirth. If so, I don't know what the child's name was, if it ever did exist.

I was in Colwall a couple of years ago (my dad's grandparents are buried there). Very nice place, would love to go back and do a better search of the gravestones.

I actually think all the Allens in Colwall are related; I've studied my line's ancestors and completed collateral lines, and it seems they were all cousins. I wonder if we still have relatives over there, since it's such a small place...

Best regards!

Cimbrio
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Saturday 13 February 10 09:57 GMT (UK)
Hello all :)

Trying to find out more about my great-grandfather's brother and sisters.

According to the family bible, John Allen and Jane (née Davis), from Colwall, Herefordshire, had several children; there is some confusion as to names and dates, which sometimes don't fully coincide with the census entries. I hope someone can help me to find out which is the right piece of information.

As I don't live in the UK I can't check the facts personally.

Thanks very much for your help:

Annie Marie ALLEN, b. April 27th 1868 Colwall; she apparently died young.
Ada Mary ALLEN, b. August 23rd 1869 Colwall
Ellen Jane ALLEN, b. December 6th 1870 Colwall
Rose Fanny ALLEN, b. September 27th 1872 Hockley (Warwickshire); why she was born there I have no idea...
William John ALLEN, b.August 8th 1876 Colwall (my great-grandfather).
Maria Annie ALLEN, b. August 8th 1876 (above's twin), she died in March 1877.
Thomas ALLEN, b.September 23rd 1878.
Eva Ann ALLEN, b. December 1879 (this I'm not sure about as I don't think I got this from the family bible, so worth checking).

The 1881 census however says that John and Jane (name wrongly assumed to be June) are living with five children:

 Ada ALLEN      Daur  11 Colwall, Hereford, England      Scholar      
 Ellin J. ALLEN      Daur  10  Colwall, Hereford, England      Scholar      
 Rose F. ALLEN  Daur 8      Aston, Warwick, England      Scholar      
 William J. ALLEN  Son  4    Colwall, Hereford, England      Scholar      
 Tom ALLEN      Son  3  Colwall, Hereford, England      Scholar 

So it would imply that Ada was born roughly in 1870, Ellin/Ellen in 1871, Rose in 1873, William in 1877 and Tom in 1878, which more or less coincides with what the Bible says.

However, I can only find the death entry for the twin Maria Annie (as Annie Maria) in MAR 1877 aged 0 years, but no trace of Eva or the elder sister. Perhpas I'm wrong in assuming the eldest daughter died, and she was living elsewhere in 1881... Anyway, it's a bit confusing but if there's any way of checking the 1871 census and the 1891 census, or any other source to find out what happened to these children, I'd be very grateful.

And no birth entry of Ellen Jane in 1870, only Eva Ann ???
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Saturday 13 February 10 10:19 GMT (UK)
More news:

I don't think Eva Ann existed, or rather, she did, but she was called Ellen Jane (that's what the family bible and the 1881 census says).

I've found a 1881 census entry for Annie M. Allen from Colwall, aged 12 (so she would have been born around 1869, which fits), living with her grandfather John MAISEY (?); can anyone check if that's the right surname please? I know the children's maternal grandfather was John Davies, perhpas his surname was wrongly transcribed; and his age would fit...
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Saturday 13 February 10 11:38 GMT (UK)
i hav not read all your postings on this topic
but here is the 1871 census
do not know whether it clarifies anything
1871
RG10/2681/94/22
john maisey age 60. b. coddington,herefordshire. occ. grocer. head
maria maisey age 56. b. kempsey,worcs. wife
anne allen age 2. b. colwall,herefordshire
living at;victoria house,colwall,herefordshire
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Saturday 13 February 10 16:56 GMT (UK)
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~pinks/herefordshire/colwall/Marriages_1754-1933.htm

Maria Davis, widow of John Davis, married John Maisey, that's why she brought up her eldest granddaughter.

Thanks very much for your help!
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Monday 14 June 10 22:31 BST (UK)
Hello all,

me again!

I was wondering if anyone can help me find out what became of Clara Allen, my great-great-grandfather's youngest sister. I know she was christened in April 1840 in Colwall, Herefordshire. I can't find her marriage or death in Herefordshire, which could suggest (I suppose) she emigrated. I don't know if she is on later censuses (1851, 1861 and so on). I'd be grateful if anyone can give me any proof of what became of her, if she died or married. Thanks very much!
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Tuesday 15 June 10 17:50 BST (UK)
had a look cannot see a birth reg in herefordshire between 1837-1841 for her
the nearest one i can see was a birth in 1849 of clara allen regd in ledbury which is the reg dist for colwall
she is on the 1851 census daughter of edward and ann allen in colwall,herefordshire
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Tuesday 15 June 10 17:55 BST (UK)
Hello Wozzle,

sorry, my mistake, I meant to type 1849, not 1840.

So she's alive in 1851; is she still alive in 1861 and after, do you know? I can't find her in 1881 on Familysearch though, nor a death or marriage in the county of Herefordshire of a Clara Allen, that's why I presume she may have changed county or emigrated. But this is all conjecture, I really can't find anything about her yet.

Thanks for your help :)
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Tuesday 15 June 10 18:41 BST (UK)
still with parents in 1861
RG9/1808/44/24
with her widowed father in 1871 though age down as 32 not 22
RG10/2681/86/6
there is a marriage in 1871 in worcester of a clara allen and edward tyler
the couple are on 1881 clara is born in colwall 1851 so possibly yours
RG11/2483/66/36
if you want the full entries then i will post them here
(but it will have to be tomorrow have to go to work now)
unless SKS posts them for you
mick
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Tuesday 15 June 10 19:11 BST (UK)
Thanks Wozzle!

It looks like it is her; I think Colwall is on the edge of the Herefordhsire and Worcestershire border, perhaps that's why I couldn't find her.

I think Anne Allen, Clara's mother, passed away in the Sep. quarter of 1867, so that would fit with the fact that Edward was a widower in 1871, and that his daughter was living there. Why the age is 32 and not 22 is a mystery but then again ages got muddled up often. I imagine a marriage certificate would confirm if the one who got married in 1871 was indeed the daughter of Edward's. If you have any further information I'd be grateful if you could display it (after you've got back to work naturally!). Thanks a lot for your help, first news I've got about Clara ever!

Greetings,

cimbrio
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Tuesday 15 June 10 20:55 BST (UK)
I've found more things on Clara's family.

I've found she married Edward Devereux/Devoreux Tyler on September 24th 1871 in Worcester. He was the son of Samuel Tyler, of Worcester, and Sarah Susanna Tyler née Devereux, of Hanley. Samuel was a taylor, Sarah Susanna a laundress.

Edward was christened in January 1850, and he passed away in 1897. I haven't found Clara's death yet. Their three daughters accounted for are Florence E(leanor?) born around 1872, Dorcas Emily, born in 1875, and Ethel Clara, born in 1879. I don't know what became of them, and if there were any more children. I know Edward had at least four siblings called Tabitha, Lewis, Dorcas and Ruth (rather odd names, a couple of them!).

I have a small mystery about Clara's mother, Anne. Anne and Edward Allen married in Withington Herefordshire in December 1838; she was a widow, and I've jotted down that her father was called Thomas Williams; her first husband's name was something Lewis, as she was Anne Lewis when she married. But that's all. I have a few mysteries to solve about her. Firstly, if she came from Colwall, Withington or other. Second, who was her mother, and where did Anne's parents come from. And I'd love to know if Anne had any children by her first husband, XXX Lewis. If you can fathom any of these points at all I'd be very thankful!
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 13:42 BST (UK)
dorcas and ethel are on the 1901 census
RG13/2366/12/16
dorcas.e.tyler age 23. b. portishead,somerset. occ. fancy box maker. head(unm)
ethel.c.tyler age 21. b. ditto. occ. fancy box maker. sister(unm)
living at;10,dowry square,holy trinity,bristol,gloucs(occupying 3 rooms in the building)
reg.dist; bristol
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 13:50 BST (UK)
think this could be marriage of ethel
name; ethel.c.tyler
y.o.r. 1911
qtr; apr/may/jun
dist; bristol
vol; 6a
page; 183
possible spouse,henry.j.breach,william.t.sims

having had a look at births with mothers maiden name tyler
there is this
ethel.d.sims
y.o.r. 1912
qtr; oct/nov/dec
dist; bristol
vol; 6a
page; 22
mothers maiden name; tyler
so it would seem to imply that she married william.t.sims
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 14:05 BST (UK)
possible sighting of clara in 1901
RG13/2365/57/3
william hunt age 35. b. buxton,derby. occ. schoolmaster. head
mary age 36. b. manchester. wife
harry age 11. b. cheshire. son
annie age 1mnth. b. clifton. daughter(sick)
clara tyler age 49. b. colwall. occ. monthly nurse. lodger(wid)
living at;3,clifton --- terrace,clifton,bristol,gloucs
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 14:12 BST (UK)
here is clara in 1891 with a child you do not have
1891
RG12/1967/32/26
edward deveraux tyler age 41. b. malvern. occ. groom(coachman). head
clara 41. b. colwall. wife
ethel clara age 16. b. portishead. daughter
dorcus emily age 15. b. ditto. daughter
gertrude annie age ?. b. ditto. daughter(on the image age is 12 but crossed out and 3 inserted)
living at;10,dowry square,holy trinity,bristol,gloucs

had a look at 1881 census of clara and gertrude does not appear on it so probably age is 3 not 12
having said that i cannot see a birth that would fit.
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 14:28 BST (UK)
clara is still around in 1911 still in bristol aged 61
cannot post any more details about 1911 census(not allowed to due to copyright)
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 14:38 BST (UK)
this is possibly claras death
name; clara tyler
y.o.r. 1915
qtr; jan/feb/mar
dist; bristol
vol; 6a
page; 29
age at death; 65
est. birth year; 1850
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 14:50 BST (UK)
here is clara in 1891 with a child you do not have
1891
RG12/1967/32/26
edward deveraux tyler age 41. b. malvern. occ. groom(coachman). head
clara 41. b. colwall. wife
ethel clara age 16. b. portishead. daughter
dorcus emily age 15. b. ditto. daughter
gertrude annie age ?. b. ditto. daughter(on the image age is 12 but crossed out and 3 inserted)
living at;10,dowry square,holy trinity,bristol,gloucs

had a look at 1881 census of clara and gertrude does not appear on it so probably age is 3 not 12
having said that i cannot see a birth that would fit.
think dorcus is on the 1911 census under name emily tyler born portishead age down as 34 in 1911
also ethel clara tyler is there as well aged 31 born portishead
which throws a query up on the marriage posted for her to william sims
the marr was regd in apr/may/jun
so need to find the date the 1911 census was taken
maybe SKS could help with that
mick
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Wednesday 16 June 10 14:51 BST (UK)
will leave it there for now
if there is any of the other names in these posts that you would like me to look for just let us know
mick
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Wednesday 16 June 10 18:42 BST (UK)
Mick, thanks a lot, you've been brilliant.

All the facts you mentioned match what I found so far. I didn't know about the birth of Gertrud Annie; she seems to have been born in 1887 in Barton Regis (I think it's where her father Edward Devereux Tyler died), and it looks like she died aged 12 in 1900 in Bristol, which explains why she's not on the census in 1901, and it wound certainly point out her age in 1891 around 3, not 12 as you noted.

I'd say the 1911 census was taken when Ethel Clara was still single; she probably married soon afterward. I've noticed she and her sister were living in the same house as the rest of their family ten years previously, and Dorcas probably stayed there till her death in 1919 (she was a spinster). The death date for Clara Allen Tyler seems also quite deffinitive. I liked the detail of her being a nurse!

As for the eldest daughter, Florence, I found she married, but the only births of children with matching surname were born quite a long time after the marriage took place.

I wonder if I have living descendants on this side!

Thank you Mick!
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Thursday 17 June 10 15:20 BST (UK)
regarding living descendants
will p.m. you
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Saturday 26 June 10 11:36 BST (UK)
Hello all again!

I'm trying to fathom another mystery.

My great-great-grandfather's parents were Edward Allen (Colwall 1803-Colwall 1889) and Ann. Edward and Ann married in Withington, Herefordshire, in 1838. Her name at the time was Ann Lewis, she was a widow and her father on the certificate is Thomas Williams, so she must have been married before.

I think she must have been born c. 1808; I have an idea she came from Colwall but why then would she marry in Withington? I'd like to find out who her mother was and any more information about her ancestors.

Would anyone be so kind as to try and find out anything more about her? When she died for instance, her mother's name and so on?

Regards! :)
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Saturday 26 June 10 13:33 BST (UK)
possible
age is about right and right dist
she appears on 1861 census with husband but is not on 1871 census
deathg index
name; ann allen
y.o.r. 1867
qtr; jul/aug/sept
dist; ledbury
vol; 6a
page; 245
age at death; 58
est birth year; 1809
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Saturday 26 June 10 13:45 BST (UK)
Good to hear from you again Wozzle!

Thanks for the date, I have an idea I had it jotted down somewhere or another, but now I've included it on the tree.

Do the census entries reveal whether she's from Colwall or Withington? I wonder if those two locations are near one another...

Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: wozzle on Saturday 26 June 10 14:20 BST (UK)
1851 states born in colwall aged 43
1861 states born in colwall aged 53
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Saturday 26 June 10 14:54 BST (UK)
Thank you Wozzle. That would confirm it I suppose. I'm having a go at another branch of the family, finding out quite a lot of information. In September hopefully I'll go to England and I'll try to search for records...

Thanks!
Title: Re: Allen family (Colwall)
Post by: cimbrio on Monday 21 November 16 08:06 GMT (UK)
Cimbrio,
You have (in your second para) Edward Allen and Ann Lewis marrying in 1867 well after the birth of their children. Are you sure this is correct as I have a marriage between them  on the 26 March 1838 in Withington parish. This would make sense given the dates for the children. Incidentally it looks like both of them had been married before
If you think this marriage is correct I will look for birth dates of their kids,
The Snooper

Just a correction to the above: turns out the marriage above is wrong - Edward Allen and his wife Ann did not marry in Withington, but in Claines (Worcestershire). Not yet sure why they married there as no immediate connections to the place other than Edward's sister marrying there in 1838. Edward and Ann Rodway married in 1835 - this much is confirmed by their children's birth certificates which gives mother's maiden name as Rodway, not Williams/Lewis. Mystery solved. :)