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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Angus (Forfarshire) => Topic started by: jeffreyjoecarroll on Friday 20 February 09 02:55 GMT (UK)
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I am seeking information about the families of Peter Hardie (1847-1885), married Elizabeth Stewart ARKLAY in 1851. (They went to Australia on board 'Nairnshire' in 1878).
Peter was the son of Peter HARDIE (?-1898) and Catherine WHYTE (1827-1875). They married in Angus in 1849.
Elizabeth was the daughter of David ARKLAY (?-?) and Margaret STEWART (?-?). They married in Angus in 1848. David's parents were possibly David ARKLAY & Mary HUNTER.
I have collected this information from LDS & ScotlandsPeople but am hoping someone may be able to expand on the family background.
Any information appreciated.
Jeff Carroll
Sydney, Australia
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hi jeff :)
welcome to rootschat
bit confused here ???
peter hardie 1847 - 1885 was married 1851 ?
IGI has peter hardy married to catherine white 20th may 1849 airlie angus
also peter hardie married elisabeth arklay 1st august 1873 dundee angus
also david arkley married margaret stewart 10th december 1848 forfar angus
might need some proof here before going any further :-\
yours
ev
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Thanks EV,
Apologies, there was a typo in my post. 1851 was meant to reflect the birth of Elizabeth Stewart Arklay. They did indeed marry in 1873, at Elizabeth's home. The certificate shows a Christen Hardie was a witness...possibly Peter Snr's sister??.
Based on information handed down through the family, all the details are correct for what is shown in LDS & ScotlandsPeople. The only conjecture I have included was the possibility of David ARKLAY & Mary HUNTER being the parents of David jnr. Information on hand suggests most of these families were involved in the weaving trade. Information available in the 1841 census backs this up.
Spellings for Hardie, Arklay & Whyte vary is all the documentation we currently hold.
Not sure what you mean by 'proof required before going further'?
Again thanks for your time on IGI. I would love to find some background information on any of the families.
Best regards,
Jeff
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Hi Jeff, I was born Gwendoline Ellen Arklay and live in Goolwa SA. My father was William Harley Arklay who had an uncle, David Arklay who lived in WA. I believe he was married to Marjorie Arklay. I have a relative in WA who has quite extensive information on the family history. She may contact you with further information. My brother's name is William Stewart Arklay and I see there is a Stewart in your family history.
Regards, Gwen.
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hi jeff :)
1881
52 ure st liff & benvie forfarshire(angus)
david arklay 52 jute weaver born forfar forfarshire
margaret arklay 55 wife b. inchture perthshire
john arklay 21 son sawyer b. dundee forfarshire
stewart arklay 12 son grocers shopboy b. dundee forfarshire
jane abbot 7 g.daug. dundee forfarshire
scotlandspeople has -
margaret arklay(other surname stewart) death 1900 st andrew dundee angus
born c1826
david arklay death 1904 lochee(now part of dundee) angus born c1829
also wondering if peter hardie remarried after the death of catherine whyte
1881
charlestown liff & benvie forfarshire
peter hardie 51 ploughman b. ruthven forfarshire
margaret T hardie 44 wife b. arbroath forfarshire
helen hardie 10 daug. b. liff forfarshire(from 1st marriage ?)
elizabeth hardie 3 daug. b. auchterhouse perthshire
william hardie 2 son b. lundie perthshire
jessie hardie 1 daug. b. liff perthshire
also
peter hardie australian infantry died 22nd august 1915 son of peter hardie
& elizabeth stewart hardie
born mains angus(forfarshire) 1876 ?
ev
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Dear EV,
Thank you for the information you posted. The 1881 Arklay info certainly fits with birth dates. It's the first time I've come across the name Abbot associated with the Arklays so I must investigate that. The scotlandspeople information is a perfect match and mirrors exactly what we have.
It's an interesting thought that Peter Hardie married after Catherine Whyte died. It's not out of the question by any means. Catherine would have been 44 in 1871 when Helen was born. Again, worth investigation.
You've also got it right with the younger Peter Hardie, b. 26 July 1876. He died at Gallipoli and his 'open' war record - a sad tale, can be viewed at National Archives or Australia site - http://www.naa.gov.au/
Thank you so much for your help. I shall repost any findings I come across in the future.
Jeff
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hi jeff :)
had another look at that possible remarriage for peter hardie(re 1881 census)
scotlandspeople has a marriage for peter hardie and margaret thornton in
1876 lochee angus
now lochee , liff & benvie , lundie , and auchterhouse are located to the west
of dundee and are fairly close to one another
the IGI has helen pearson hardie born 28th of july 1870 dundee angus
parents peter hardie and catherine whyte(helen hardie on 1881 census ?)
IGI also has margaret thornton born 24th june 1838 baptised 1st july 1838
arbroath angus parents john thornton and agnes duncan
ev
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More food for thought EV. It seems likely when all put together. I've previously seen the name Pearson associated with the Hardie family.....somewhere.
Something tells me this is going to be one of those scenarios where the families inter marry on a frequent basis. Thank you for spending the time to investigate this.
I'm hoping Gwen Arklay or a family member make contact again as they may already have put some of the puzzle together.
Best regards,
Jeff
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Hi Jeff, My name is Helen and live in W.A.
My grandfather was David Harley Arklay , born in 1883 in Dundee,--Scotland .. he was the 2nd son of James Taylor Arklay and Marjory Harley. He had an older brother James ?Kay Arklay* and younger sister Annie ? Arklay[married --George Murray--with no living issue]
James Taylor Arklay had one brother Joseph. I have no further information re this gentleman other than I suspect he married Meg and they had one son Jim Arklay [batchelor]
*James Kay married Polly Gieke[? spelling]and had 4 sons
James Taylor
Henry Geike
William Harley
Richard ?
The names you have mentioned do not appear on any of my documents, so I am unable to help unravel the puzzle . .However I will follow the postings closely now.. regards Helen
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Hi Jeff, You are right about David Arklay's parents being James Arklay and Mary Hunter. They are mentioned on his death certificate,April 20,1904. Sharon Dupre
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Thanks Sharon!!!! I had moved on from this branch for a while but was only looking into it again over the Christmas break.......thinking I must try to solve it one way or another for good.
I would be very interested if the certificate lists all David's children & if he married more than once.
Best regards,
Jeff
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David Arklay,born March 24,1828. He was married only once to Margaret Stewart on 10 Dec.1848. They had 6 children. I believe the oldest three and the second youngest emigrated to Australia in the 1870's.Elizabeth Hardie in 1878 and her two siblings David Arklay and Euphemia Abbot,a widow, on the 5 Dec.1877 on the Pericles. Euphemia left behind her 3 year old daughter,Jane Abbot with her parents for at least 14 years .I don't know what happened to Jane Abbot after that.(b.1874).Her father ,David Abbot had drowned while at sea. I believe the son John also emigrated but I don't have that date on hand. Their youngest son Stewart Arklay remained in Dundee for a while at least . His mother died at his house and 3 years later Stewart was a witness to David Arklays death in a nursing home. The other child ,Jane Arklay married David High,a marble and stone cutter and sculptor. She died young at 35 after giving birth to twins in Mar.1892 and her husband died on Feb.26,1899. By the census in 1901,her youngest 4 children were living in an orphanage.Their oldest sister was my great grandmother,Margaret Stewart High. Her daughter ,my grandmother,another Margaret Stewart High b.Feb.3,1898 was living with the Arklays at the age of three on the 1901 census.I have copies of their death certificates.(1901 and 1904) .I have some marriage and birth certificates for John Stewart Arklay in Australia and also for his sister Euphemia Abbot.. It looks like she remarried twice and had more children. Let me know what part of this family you are connected to. By the way ,David Arklay's death cert. says his parents are David Arklay and Mary Hunter but his birth cert.says they are James Arklay and Mary Hunter. Sharon
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Hi Jeff, Jane Arklay High was named Jean Hepburn Arklay on her b.cert and all these names are on her death cert. also. Sharon
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Hi Jeff,I made an error. It was James on the birth certificate and David on the death certificate.Isn't the birth certificate more likely to be correct? Or could there have been two David Arklay's born in the 1820's? There is no list of children that I have seen except on the census. Sharon
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Thanks Sharon. I shall dig out my file and digest what you have written. Shall put it together and come back to you.....give me a couple of days as I am away from home just at present.
I would think the birth cert would be correct....people can & do go by different names however and it may turn out that it is the same chap on the death certificate - I've come across this countless times and sometimes it is ok and sometimes it's a differnt family. It's frustrating at times.
David Arklay & Margarte Stewart are my GGGG grandparents, along with Peter Hardie and Catherine Whyte. Their respective children Elizabeth Stewart Arklay and Peter Hardie (jnr) married in 1873 and came to Australia in 1878.
I shall get back to you!
Jeff
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Hello Gwen,
My name is Robert Walker.
Can it be possible that you are the same Gwen Arklay that I knew in Farnborough when the world was young ?
Robert T. J. Walker
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Hi Robert
I was Gwen Arklay's neighbour in Cove before she moved to Australia. If you get a reply from her, please tell I have photographs of her at an early age with me, Chris Cornwell.
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Hi Jeff
Have just joined Rootschat.com and saw your posts re: Arkley's back in 2009. I don't know if you are still looking into this Family as my GGGrandmother, Euphemia Arkley was Elizabeth Stewart Arkley's (1852-1912 who married Peter Hardie ) sister. She came to Sydney,Australia on the Pericles in 1877. Have not read all the posts so far on Arkley's but if I can share (or gain) anymore information on this family that would be great. PS Their brother David came out on the Pericles as well but I have been unable to find information after his landing.
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i have our family tree, peter hardie death 1915, was my gggrandfather, however we have no information on his father and beyond any help would be appreciated.
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The critical question is did your Peter Hardie die in Scotland?
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peter hardie born 1876, mains forar, scotland.
death 22 august 1915, is my gggrandfather.
I am trying to find information on his parents Peter Hardie 1847-1885 and Elizabeth Stewart HARDIE.(ARKLAY) and yes he died in scotland not sure where.
Any assistance would be appreciated.
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Peter Hardie and Elisabeth Arklay were married in Dundee on 1 August 1873.
If you go to www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk (SP) and invest in 30 credits for £7, you can use one credit to find and five to view and download the marriage certificate. This will tell you the full names of the couple's parents, and is the starting point for finding them in the census and in earlier baptism records.
The SP index lists no death of a Peter Hardie or Hardy in 1915. It does list two in 1916, neither of whom was born in 1876 plus or minus 5 years. There are, in total, deaths of 9 Peter Hardies born in 1876 plus or minus 5 years. You can use the rest of your credits looking at four of these certificates to see which one is yours.
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Howdy,
"peter hardie born 1876, mains forar, scotland.
death 22 august 1915, is my gggrandfather.
I am trying to find information on his parents Peter Hardie 1847-1885 and Elizabeth Stewart HARDIE.(ARKLAY) and yes he died in scotland not sure where".
I feel sure Peter Hardie b. 1876 to Peter & Elizabeth Stewart Hardie (nee Arklay) came to Australia with his parents in 1878. He's listed on Elizabeth's death certificate in 1883. Peter Snr died in a mining accident in Kiama in 1885. Peter jnr died on 28/8/1915 in Gallipoli. His service record is available as I purchased it.
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Hi All,
Elizabeth Hardie (Arkley) was the sister of my G/Grandmother Euphemia Arkley B.1850 who came to Balmain, Australia in 1877.
Elizabeth B.1852 Forfar Scotland. and Peter B. 26 Jul 1847 Auchterhouse, Forfarshire came to Brisbane, Qld as free settlers on 24 Jun 1878 Aboard the ship Nairmshire, with children Margaret aged 4 and Peter aged 1 year.
Elizabeth's Mother was Margaret Stewart born 20 Oct 1824 Perthshire died 29 Nov 1901 Dundee. Her Father was David Arkley born 24 Mar 1828 forfar died 24 Mar 1828 Lochee, Dundee. I can go back further if you want as Arkley is my line of history.
As far as I know Peter's Father was Peter Hardie born Abt. 1826 Scotland and died 1898 his Mother was Catherine Whyte born 22 Oct 1827 Airlie, Angus died 1875 Scotland they married 20 May 1849 Airlie, Angus.
I have nothing more on the Hardie side except daughter Margaret Hardie 1873-1951 married William Evans 1875-1929 and had 2 children and they lived in Balmain NSW though she died in Wyong.
Hope this helps
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My be a long shot (I'm a Hardie) but my line traces back to Glasgow then to Northern Ireland. The surname adapted from Hargy / Hargey to Hardie when they moved to Scotland.
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Hi all, I have just joined this site and very interested in Hardie, Stewart Arklay Family. My Great Grandmother was Euphemia Abbot from Forfashire. The spelling of her surname we have was Arkley. She resided in Balmain following her marriage to my Great Grandfather who was a Civil War Veteran. Any information regarding Euphemia would be greatly appreciated. I believe she left a child, possibly named Jane, in Forfashire when she came to Australia.
Looking forward to your replies,
Cheers,
Gayle
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Hi all, I have just joined this site and very interested in Hardie, Stewart Arklay Family. My Great Grandmother was Euphemia Abbot from Forfashire. The spelling of her surname we have was Arkley. She resided in Balmain following her marriage to my Great Grandfather who was a Civil War Veteran. Any information regarding Euphemia would be greatly appreciated. I believe she left a child, possibly named Jane, in Forfashire when she came to Australia.
Just for clarification, was Arkley her maiden name and Abbot her married surname? When did she go to Australia and when did she marry? And which Civil War are you referring to?
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Hi All,
Yes Arkley was her maiden name and Abbot was her married name. She arrived in Australia approx. 1877 and married again almost a year later, in August 1878, to Pliny William Wise, my GGrandfather. She was the widow of a crew member of the whaling ship “Eric” out of Dundee, Scotland, David Abbott, who had drowned in Baffin’s Bay, Greenland in 1876. They made their home at Balmain, Australia and raised five children; David Arkley born in 1879, Elizabeth Hardy born in 1881, Helen Stewart born in 1884, Pliny William born in 1887 and George born in 1889. In 1903 Wise applied for a military pension, but unfortunately died before he could take advantage of it. Pliny William Wise died on April 2, 1904 of “phthisis”, before receiving his first pension check. His wife however, received a widow’s pension until her death in February 1926. Pliny William Wise was buried in the Old Presbyterian Section, Field of Mars Cemetery in Ryde, New South Wales. My GGrandfather was born in Rhode Island and of African/American heritage. He enlisted in the civil war in 1862 for 1 year. Civil War Veterans in Australia (Google), his information is listed there.
Cheers,
Gayle
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Euphemia Arkley married David Abbott in Dundee in 1871.
Go to www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk, buy a few credits at modest cost, and use 6 of them to view the marriage certificate. This will tell you the date and place of the marriage, the couple's ages, occupations and places of residence, and the full names of both their parents including their mothers' maiden surnames.
This information will help you to find and view the 1871 census, which will tell you where they were born. The index lists a 21-year-old Euphemia Arklay in Dundee in 1871 who is probably yours, and 25-year-old David Abbot in the Merchant Navy return.
Their daughter Jane was born in Dundee on 8 February 1874, but I have not found her in the index to the 1881 census, or in the deaths indexes.
Note that Forfarshire is a name formerly used to refer to the County of Angus.
Phthisis is usually what these days would be called tuberculosis.
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Thank you so much for the information you have provided. I will certainly follow it up. Very interesting regarding their daughter Jane. Family members told me my GGrandmother Euphemia always intended to send for her however it never happened. This may have been a cost factor or perhaps she could not locate her.
Once again thank you for the info.
Cheers,
Gayle
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I think you will probably find that Euphemia's parents were David Arklay and Margaret Stewart, but that you will not find her birth or baptism record.
I have got Jane in the 1881 census. At 52 Ure Street, parish of Liff and Benvie*, were David Arklay, 52, Jute weaver, born Forfar, Angus; Margaret Arklay, 55, born Inchture, Perthshire; John Arklay, son, 21, born Dundee; Stewart Arklay, 15, grocer's shop boy, born Dundee; Jane Abbot, granddaughter, 7, born Dundee.
*Liff and Benvie is the neighbouring parish to the parish of Dundee. The city of Dundee had spread out to cover quite a lot of the parish of Liff and Benvie by 1881.
The index shows Margaret Arklay, 64, and Jane Abbot, 17, both at the same address in Dundee in 1891. In 1901 Margaret Arklay, 75, and Jane Abbot, 26, are both in Dundee, but not at the same address. Neither is there in 1911.
A David Arklay, 75, died in Lochee (another neighbouring parish largely taken into the city) in 1904 and Margaret Arklay or Stewart, 75, died in Dundee in 1901. Their death certificates should tell you the names of their parents, including mothers' maiden surnames.
Jane may have married or emigrated. There is a possible death of a Jane Abbot, or Welsh, 66, in Glasgow in 1942, but I think this is Jane Welsh, wife of Peter Abbot.
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Hi All, Unfortunately I have not accessed this site for a number of years. Arklay, Stewart and Hardie are all names associated with my Great Grandmother, Euphemia Abbot (Arklay) who lived in Forfashire Scotland before she came to Australia and married my Great Grandfather, Pliny Wise and they resided in Balmain NSW.
Any info on Euphemia or Pliny would be greatly appreciated.
Kind Regards
Gayle Wise
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Unfortunately I have not accessed this site for a number of years
Hi Gayle, If I knew which was your other profile I can help you connect with your other profile.
Regards
Sarah
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Thank you. My profile was JazzyG
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Hi Gayle,
Your other profile only had 3 posts on this topic, you may as well just carry on with this profile ;)
Regards
Sarah