RootsChat.Com
England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Herefordshire => Topic started by: ~Rachel~ on Wednesday 11 March 09 11:33 GMT (UK)
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Hello,
I have found someone who is possibly an ancestor on the 1901 census.
She is living at the "The Convent of Sisters of Charity & Refuge" in Bartestree, Herefordshire.
I was just wondering if anyone knows anything about the place, especially why young women would end up there?
I'm guessing it'd be for the poor or unmarried mothers but anyone with any local info would be much appreciated!
Thanks :)
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The convent is now partly flats and partly a hospice (where they do wonderful work, incidentally!):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bartestree
The design, by Pugin was reputed to be a practice for the Houses of Parliament - it's still an impressive building!
I would suggest a visit to the Hereford Record Office might give you some clues - Parish Overseers records or similar. Was the girl in question Catholic? Can you find any corresponding birth recorded?
Kind regards, Arranroots ;)
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Oh dear! Found this in the National Archives site:
HO 45/23592 1928-1932 BURIALS: Illegal burials at Bartestree Convent Hereford : prosecution of Mother Superior following several warningsThis file looks at the action taken against Bartestree Convent, Hereford, after several burials were conducted without following the correct procedures.
Worth Googling for other information ...
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Genuki is always a good place to start
http://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/HEF/Bartestree/Kelly1913.html
..............the objects of the institution, which is conducted by ladies, are the reformation of fallen women and the preservation of those who are in danger of falling into bad courses: the establishment is supported partly by the revenues of the foundation and partly by the labour of the inmates in laundry work and the manufacture of underclothing:.............
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Hiya, thanks for the replies!
There are 11 Fitzgerald births registered in Hereford over a 10 yr period so it's possible one of them may have been her child, I'll do some investigating! Also, 20 years later she adopted a baby girl from the area - maybe to make amends for one she had to give up??
The place sounds pretty grim though - inmates, laundry and illegal burials... :o
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Hi Rachel, I have just come across your question. Many children were evacuated to the convent during the wars and sadly some were never collected. The convent was a wonderful place and all the old ladies I knew were very happy to be there. They spent their whole lives ther. The laundry was hard work but fun. i have never heard of ilegal burials that certainly didn't happen when I was there in the late 60's. I see also that you are interested in the fanily name Harper which is my married surname!
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Hello
new to this site but found it as I was trying to find the address for bartestree convent for my CV I was placed in the convent in 1977 until 1980/81 by social services I would love to be able to contact anyone who would like to chat x as for tbe ladys who worked the laundry they sere beautiful people as a young girl in the convent we used to help the nuns look after the ladys who were then in there 60/70/& 80's after the laundry clossed down the nuns took in peace work one of the things the ladys did were Chicken bags and we used to do them with the ladys we had to put stickers onto the plastic bags which had the price and weight of what would go in the bags.
Could chat all day would love to discuss this more if any one was intrested. Thank you for reading Rainey
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Hi Rainey,
How wonderful to hear from someone else who was at Bartestree! I actually came back to visit in 1977/78. For me it was the best thing that ever happened to me. Were Mother Magdalen, Mother Immacultate and Sister Bernadette still there. It was still laundry work when I was there but I had heard that the ladies did bags for Sun Valley Poultry. Do keep in touch. So many memories and so many questions. Francella
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Oh am so excited to get a reply yes all 3 nuns were there and sister Francis and Scottish sister Cristina sister magdeoln was mother superior x x I have to go out so will respond better later x x
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Hi, So glad to hear from you Rainey. I had forgotten about Sister Francis. The other Nun must have been after I left. Mother Magdalen was Mother Superior when I was there too. When I knew her she used to dye her fringe red! I also once picked up Mother Immaculate and swung her round and her veil came off but she forgave me. I worked in the laundry, first on the big rollers doing sheets and pillow cases, then got promoted to shirts! Eventuall I got a job in Hereford whilst still at the Convent. My favourite old lady was called Imelda but I think she probably passed away before your time. I also remember Cora who worked in the kitchens. There were 2 dogs Popsie and Curie I think. When I first went I was very angry and determined to be a pain. Mother Magdalen gave me the job of walking the dogs to calm me down and it worked. When I left I shared a flat with another girl from there. I would love to hear from anyone else who was there.
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Hi Francella
Just found this site. I was at Bartestree Convent from 1966 - 1967 when Mother Magdalen was running the girls' side. Also worked in the laundry until I had my appendix out then took over the cooking and when fully recovered went to the farm bit to help Sister Monica (I think) with the chickens.
Still return to Hereford as often as possible but sad to see the convent turned into "apartments".
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Hi Marcia, How lovely to hear from you. I think I must have just missed you! I went in 1968, best thing that ever happened to me. Mother Immaculate must have been there and maybe Mother Madgela before she died. There must have been some girlds there that we both knew. I remember a Shirley who left just after I arrived, Jackie whose name was really Ann, another Anne, Mary and I am sure many more. Do keep in touch if you want as we remember more! Francella
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Hi Francella
The girls I remember being there when I left in July 1967 were Pat (who was really Lynne), Karen (from Cornwall), Jane (Birmingham), Sandra (Worcester), Carol and Maria. There must have been others but senility is kicking in. I remember Imelda, Gabby, Gerry and Mary from the old ladies although I think Mary was the youngest by several years and was probably about 40, ancient of course when one is 17. Mother Immaculate was lovely and I believe became Reverend Mother at some point. Was Mother Therese still there when you were? for some reason I never liked her. Went back for weekends a couple of times early in '68. Had some wonderful times there - happy memories.
Marci
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Hi Marcie,
None of those names ring a bell but I will try to think of more. Did Miss Griffiths give country dancing lessons then, how embarrasing was that. Were you allowed to go to dances at Creden Hill. I think Mother Theresa was there but never had much to do with her. Sister Bernadette was nice. Imelda (Skinny as I called her ) was my favourite and she came out for a day with my Mum and I in a car!! I too went back for visits. I was there when the men landed on the moon. I will try to think of other girls, there must have been some overlap. Maxine possibly? Cora was in the kitchen and the two dogs were Popsie and Curie I think.
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Does anyone who lived at Bartestree convent on August 1st 1975 remember the Minibus accident where 1 nun and a girl died. I am Theresa who lived at the convent in Northfield Birmingham. who was involved in that accident, when I came out of hospital I stayed the night at Bartestree convent before being moved to Waterlooville convent near Portsmouth the next day.I just about remember how kind those girls were to me.
I had just paid Bartestree a visit after 40 years and oh how everything has changed, the Nun's have gone and been gone for sometime as Waterlooville is in the middle of the same transformation, my wonderful Nun's have gone.
I would dearly love to hear from any one from barestree at that time or anyone who remembers the accident. Next year on August the 1st it will be 40 years since the accident and I never got a chance to say thank you to the ambulance crews and fire crews who attended the accident they saved my life that day. Never saw their faces
I know I might not get a reply but its worth a long short. Thank you for reading this anyway
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Hi Theresa, I was at Bartestree 1969 -1971. I wonder when you were there. Didn't know about the crash. Which of the Nuns were killed. I loved being there, best thing that ever happened to me!
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Hi Francella, oh it's really good to hear from you didn't think I would get a reply from anyone. I was there in 1975 round about the 7th or 8th of August 1975 for one night only but had payed a visit to Bartestree convent one sunday afternoon with the Nun's and rest of the girls.
I was living in the convent at Northfield in Birmingham before the accident, I can't spell the Nun's name who was in charge of us so please for give my spelling on her name. Sister Rosesio was in charge of us girls and Sister Enda was her assistant. There was only six of us girls with the Nun's at the time but the night before the accident two had run away for what ever reason, so that just left four of us girls setting of to Hollyhead to catch the ferry to go to Ireland via Hereford with our two lovely Nun's. The other three girls name's were Sharon' Audrey and Mary, Mary had only been with us for two weeks and Sharon was like a big sister to me.
On the afternoon of the 1st of August 1975 we left Northfield, Sister Enda was drving and Sister Rosesio was sitting in the front seat, I was asleep laying on the three seater seat behind the driver seat, Mary was sitting in the single seat near the side door and Sharon and Audrey were sitting in the back two seater seat by the back doors of the mini bus. I remember it was such a hot day too, the next bit of the story is only what I have been told as I said earlier I was asleep.
Sister Enda passed out over the while driving somewhere along the Hereford road to Hollyhead, I was told that the Mini bus came off the road and just round over a few times crushing the mini bus into a sardine can. Mary was killed out right and Sister Rosesio die on the way to Hereford General. Sharon and Audrey suffered cuts and brusie's along with Sister Enda and I was unconscious for six days.
When I came round, after a couple of days I was discharge fro hospital into he care of Sister Prepetua and Sister Josiephine and was taken to Bartestree convent for the night before being moved to waterlooville convent the next day where I spent another three wonderful years of my life.
To this day I am still in contact with Sister Charlotte, like you Francella it too was the best thing that ever happen to me. I have been lucky enough to have all the Nun's in my life as over the years I have got to know them all from different convents, they have become my family. I went back to work for them for five years before moving to Cornwall.
I do hope to hear from you or anyone from the convents again
Theresa x
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Hello. My name is Nicola Goodwin and I am doing some research into Bartestree Convent in the 1940s through to the 1970s. I would love to hear from anybody who lived or stayed there during that time. I can be contacted at nicola.goodwin@bbc.co.uk Best Wishes, Nicola
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I visited Bartestree Convent before all the posters here in 1961/62. I had a girlfriend there at that time and was allowed to visit for tea, initially for tea on a Saturday and then when I moved away on Sunday afternoons as well. The sister in charge of the girls at that time was Sister Mary Magdalene seems like she might have been promoted in later years, do nuns get promoted?
I was a Boy Entrant at the nearby RAF camp and when I graduated my girlfriend and I eventually drifted apart. Sadly whilst investigating my past on the web I discovered she had died many years ago at an early age which I was very sad to discover.
If anybody spots this site who was around at this time, please contact me.
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Yes, I suppose that Nuns do get promoted.
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Hi, I have just discovered this chat site and I am thrilled to have found it. I too was at Bartestree Convent in the mid to late 60s. My name was Linda Watson, but I was called Pat ( My middle name) because there was already a Linda when I arrived.......Linda McDonald. The girls I remember were Diane, Marcia, Margaret, Jane, Karen, Mercie? but at the moment I cant remember any others.
You may be suprised to know that I am still in touch with Mother Magdalen and have been for years now, in fact myself and my husband are taking her to Bartestree Convent tomorrow ( 6th Sept) to visit another nun, Regina (who I dont know). Mother now lives in *(place removed), I live near Portsmouth. Shes now 90's and in good health and is still such a lovely person, I too cant believe my luck at being sent to the Convent I owe her so much. In fact when I was 17 I was no longer a ward of court and was sent home. only to run away again back to the Convent. Mother was distraught as she could not accept me back, and after a few days found me a place in a working girls hostel in Leominster, she took me there in the car with some of the girls and we all cried when they left me there. I only stayed a few weeks and my parents came and took me back home.
I remember Miss Griffiths and the dance classes, if we had danced well we were allowed to go to the pictures in the town that week!. If we were old enough we were allowed 3 cigarettes a day that were eaked out after mealtimes by Mother, we used to beg the other girls who had jobs in the town for more as they were allowed to buy extras. The laundry we worked in was so hot in the summer and the nylon overalls certainly didn't help, my first job outside the convent was for a green grocer in the town called Powells. Sunday were the days we would look forward to as our boyfriends were allowed to come for tea, and when it was time for them to go Mother would give us 10 minutes downstairs to say goodbye, we all thought they were the best 10 minutes!!
I really hope someone will reply to me and we could go down memory lane together.......after all, they were some of the best years of our lives!!
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Linda that is totally amazing! My name is Dave Hill and I was a boy entrant at RAF Hereford in 1961/62. For most of this time I dated a girl called Peta Armitage she did change her surname she used to Armstrong Jones in 1961. I was originally allowed to go for tea on a Saturday, after I was posted away I visited Peta staying in a B & B in Hereford. Because of this I was allowed then to go to Bartestree on Sunday afternoon as well. Sister Mary as she was, was a wonderful woman, I am not religious but I have never forgotten her! Very sadly I have discovered my ex died in 1989 from cancer aged 43, not sure if Sister Mary would remember her. She will not remember me but please give her my best wishes and tell what a smashing person a young 16/17 year old thought she was!
Regards
Dave
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Hi Dave, thank you so much for your post, it was wonderful to hear from someone who had quite a connection with the convent and knowing Mother. Peta was unfortunately just before my time, it must have been a shock to you though of hearing of her passing. I too had a boyfriend who was in the RAF, he was posted to Aden, I only remember his first name, which was Jeff. Being so young then we just drifted apart and I never saw him again after his posting.
As I mentioned in my post I'm seeing Mother tomorrow, I will certainly tell her of Peta and yourself, and believe me she will remember you.........her memory is still very clear, I will give her your best regards.
I dont know if your familiar with why the nuns had to leave the convent. Apparently the bank foreclosed on the convent and although they fought hard to keep it they couldn't find a backer, even though the story hit the nationals. Someone came foward and said they would donate a million pounds, but sadly it never materialized. At this time, Mother was already Mother Superior so all the worry and stress fell on her and by her own admission , she went grey overnight. All the nuns were eventually dispersed along with all the old ladies who lived and worked there.Very sad for all of them, most had been there since the war and were now to be parted.
Mother was sent to Waterlooville Hants which is where I met up with her again about 25 years ago.
I will let you know what she has to say about Peta and yourself after seeing her tomorrow.
Kind regards,
Lynn.
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Thank you Linda. I have made contact with PETA's daughters, I am sure they would be delighted if Mother remembered her. I did not know all that information about the convent! I have a couple of stories I remember about Mother Mary, I am on holiday and using my tablet when I get home on my PC l will tell you about them.
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Lynn
Where have you gone? I have been waiting with baited breath to see if Mother had remembered my old flame Peta but you have vanished!
Hope to hear from you soon!
Dave
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Hi Dave, so sorry I didn't get back to you, but the very next day my brother and his wife arrived from Falmouth and stayed with us until yesterday. Never-the-less, the day spent with Mother was lovely. She was visiting a friend, Regina (who I thought was a nun, but in fact was a very good friend of Mothers) and lived a five minute drive from the Convent.
Mike and I went into town for the day and when we collected her we drove to the Convent and walked around remembering all sorts of memories.
You'll be very pleased to hear that she certainly does remember Peta, she had heard of her passing, but didn't know from what. She also knew of the two daughters, and wait for it.........she remembered you! She also told me that if you ever wanted to contact her she would love to receive a letter from you, which I think would be a lovely connection for the girls.
Her address is; Sister Magdalen C,
**Address removed by Moderator
I'm sure she can fill any gaps that you may have. Oh, by the way, I got her age wrong! I mentioned that I told you she was now 93, she soon corrected me.......she's 91.
Hope your holiday went well, and sorry again about the delay in getting back to you. Just a thought, it may be worth asking Mother if she has any photos of Peta. She gave me a couple a few years ago of myself and the girls who were with me at the time, it was great to receive them, I was only about 15/16 and I didn't have any photo's of myself of that age.
Hopefully you'll let me know the outcome of contacting Mother.
All the very best, Lynn.
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Lyn
Just a quick reply as I am still on holiday this week. I am astounded at her memory I can only remember one other girl. Thank you for your reply I will drop her a line when I get home and give you my memories of her as well. Would be interesting if she had a photo of Peta I struggle to recall her face, her daughter's would be thrilled I am sure! I will keep in touch and let you know.
Dave
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Lynn
I have sent you a personal message with my memories of Sister Mary Magdalene, if you do not get it please let me know, although it says it was sent successfully.
Dave
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Lynn, just to let you know I have received a letter from Sister Mary Magdalene C and have sent you another personal message.
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I am fascinated about the stories of the convent in Bartestree.
I knew Sister Immaculate, as she then was, as she was in hospital with my mother. To cut a VERY long story short I kept in touch with her for decades. I last knew of her in Birmingham.
As a youngster I regularly visited Bartestree convent to see her and the other sisters. I remember helping to feed the chickens and always went to see the ladies in the home and meet some of the younger ladies too! I was in awe of the convent! It was huge and I used to ask how they knew their way around! I was about 7 years old when I first visited so in the mid 60s.
I also remember visiting a convent in Lancashire.
Sister Immaculate became Sister Maura.
I remember Sister Magdalen. I first met her when she was visiting the hospital where my mother was and later seeing her at the convent. My sister and I were also taken ill and my mother was told that Sister Magdalen was praying for us.
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Hi Ledlad
Nice to hear from you and your memories of Bartestree. As you will have read on this thread I was visiting Bartestree a few years before you, the last time I visited was in January 1963. You will also have seen from correspondence that Lynn and I exchanged that Sister Mary Magdalen is still alive. I am quite worried about Lynn she seems to have disappeared and is not answering my personal messages to her, I hope she is OK.
You will also have seen that I have written to Sister Mary who replied to me three weeks ago, I have now sent her another letter. She remembered my old girlfriend and myself from all those years ago and sent me an old leaflet to look at about Bartestree which included photos of my ex. Given that it was when I was a teenager when we were together you may not be surprised to hear seeing her photo was a very bittersweet moment for me, you see the photo will have been taken when we were going out together. It was so long ago but seeing her happy and smiling made me happy and sad at the same time given that she passed away 27 years ago.!
Now Ledlad this will be of interest to you, one of the nun's pictured in the leaflet is a Sister Maura! I have copies of this leaflet on my PC so if you would like me to send you a copy I am more than happy to do so. In addition if you let me have your name and anything else you think relevant I will pass this on to Sister Mary when I am next in contact. I did promise that I would send her a Christmas card so at the latest I can send her your details then. By the way Sister Mary was in charge of the girls when I visited, she later became Mother Superior. If you do not know I guess she will know if Sister Maura is still alive and if so where she is.
I am sending you a personal message in which you can let me have your name etc and if you would like a copy of the leaflet let me have your e-mail address and I will send it to you. You can of course do this here but it will be safer in a personal message.
Look forward to hearing from you.
Dave
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Lynn
I have sent you an urgent personal message.
Dave
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Hi, Im trying to find out any details of an aunt of mine who was brought up at Bartestree convent as a child and later went onto to work there in the laundry till the convent closed. Her name was Lilly Cummings she is 94 years old now , any one remmeber her ?
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Nance
I may be able to find out something for you can you pm me and let me know what you are trying to discover, I assume you are trying to remind your Aunt of her time there. If you do not know how to pm me just say so in reply to this message and I will pm you from which you should be able to reply. I would not put any details here as this an open forum which anybody can read. If you read earlier posts you will see that I went out with a girl from Bartestree in 61/62, your Aunt may have been there then but I would not have known her. I can only use normal post in trying to find answers for you so it will take a little time.
Dave
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uote author=Cornish Dave link=topic=367405.msg6134177#msg6134177 date=1483213389]
Nance
I may be able to find out something for you can you pm me and let me know what you are trying to discover, I assume you are trying to remind your Aunt of her time there. If you do not know how to pm me just say so in reply to this message and I will pm you from which you should be able to reply. I would not put any details here as this an open forum which anybody can read. If you read earlier posts you will see that I went out with a girl from Bartestree in 61/62, your Aunt may have been there then but I would not have known her. I can only use normal post in trying to find answers for you so it will take a little time.
Thank you for replying, to be honest Im not sure what I want to know . My aunt died this week and i was going to previously try and find out details from her about her life at Bartestree convent I hadnt seen her in a lot of years but I never made it in time to see her before she died. Mostly i wanted to know if she had a happy life at the convent .
Dave
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Have sent you a pm Nance, I will see what I can find out for you.
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Sent you another pm today Nance.
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Hi Dave
Im struggling to find your reply
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Nance, weird! I said that I had heard from Sister Mary but she would not tell me anything about your Aunt. She did say that she was not there as a child and would have been at least 18 when she arrived. She seemed to be aware that your Aunt had passed away and said she was going to try and attend the funeral which she said was today? She may have that wrong but I suggested if that was the case perhaps you would be able to speak to her. Sorry I could not find anything out for you, Sister Mary did tell me stories about my old girl friend but perhaps that was because I was also there at the same time and I told her about my memories. Is the funeral today?
Dave
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Nance Clarke
I have sent you an e-mail please let me know if you do not receive it.
Dave Hill
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Haven't been on here for ages and now I find Linda Watson. Hi Lin, haven't seen you for over 40 years but not forgotten. Great to hear you are in touch with Mother Magdalen, please give her my regards. I live not too far from Hereford so often go over and always think of the convent and the good times we had there. If you fancy getting in touch I can be found on Facebook, am now Marcinee Neal although the Neal part of my life departed too many years ago to think about.
Would love to hear from you.
Marcinee
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Marci
I was in touch with Lin last year when she put me in touch with Sister Mary. You will see my connection with Bartestree by looking at earlier posts. Lin stopped replying to any of my messages, Sister Mary told me she had stopped using this site but I am not sure why. Possibly it was something I said but I have no idea what, if so she may reply to you. I have exchanged a few letters with Sister Mary she does not use e-mail as far as I know but in her 90's now), she was still working at Easter when I got a card from her.
Dave
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Dave
Thanks for that. Would it be possible for you to let Sister Mary/Mother Magdalen know I was asking after her and have very fond memories of her and Bartestree Convent.
Many thanks
Marci
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I can certainly do that for you, would you like her to mention you to Lyn I know they are in regular contact? If you would like to write to Sister Mary I can ask her if it is OK for me to give you her address? What was your surname back then? I also have a booklet about Bartestree that Sister Mary sent me, it is before your time as it contains a photo of my old girlfriend but you may be interested in seeing it.
I think I found you on facebook if you live in Wales and your last entry was a sad one about your dog. If so and you would like the booklet let me know and I will send you a friends request so that we can exchange e-mail addresses and I can forward it to you. If you just want me to pass on your regards that is fine of course, let me know.
Dave
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Dave
Should be very grateful if you would do all of those things. My surname then was Morrison.
Would love to see the booklet. I do live in Wales but don't think I have a sad entry about my dog although he hasn't been too well lately, however is on the mend now. Please feel free to send a friend request and I will respond as soon as.
Marci
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Dear Dave,
We received contact on behalf of the lady you are discussing, you had revealed far too much detail about her (age, address etc) which we were asked to remove which we did.
You are both able to use the PM function if you wish to discuss information about living folk.
Regards
Sarah
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Sarah
Rather confused other than age I have disclosed nothing and my post does not appear to have changed? In any event feel free to remove whatever somebody was unhappy with but I am at a loss to see what I have said that was not here before other than possibly age. Indeed it was me who had things removed in the past.
Dave
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Hello Rainey
I was in there as well about 1978/79 till 1980
I remember the place like yesterday :) :)
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Shelly, as you will have seen if you have read the thread I have Sister Mary Magdalens address. I you wish to get in contact with her please let me know.
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Hello Dave
Yes I would like to have her address thank you be nice to write to her
Thank you
Michelle
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Michelle
I have sent you a personal message with Sister Mary's address. I hope you will receive it ok as I cannot put the address on an open forum.
Dave
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Hi Dave
Yes thank you I got I shall write to her
93 years of age bless her,
I understand about you not putting address up on here
Thank you
Michelle
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Hi all.
I am searching for information regarding my late Aunt, Margaret Birch. She attended the convent circa 1970-1980 from when she was 8-18.
She was my closest relative and I know nothing of her childhood!
I hope someone remembers her. I have searched the posts but found nothing.
Thanks for reading.
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So good to read about Bartestree. I also discovered my late great great aunt there on the 1901 census. Gertrude Salmon. I don’t know the circumstances of how she came to be there, certainly the family were in poverty from 1891 when her father died. I do know she became pregnant whilst at the convent, delivered of a baby boy at the Hereford workhouse in 1909 and moved to an RC mother and baby home in London. Any information about the convent late 1800s, early 1900s appreciated