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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Handwriting Deciphering & Recognition => Topic started by: Suzy W on Wednesday 28 April 10 22:46 BST (UK)

Title: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Wednesday 28 April 10 22:46 BST (UK)
Hi all.

My eyes can only make out so much of the old hand writing.   Would love any help with what he stole etc.

http://search.archives.tas.gov.au/ImageViewer/image_viewer.htm?CON33-1-40,305,83,L,80

Also his soon to be wife records.

http://search.archives.tas.gov.au/ImageViewer/image_viewer.htm?CON41-1-19,146,30,L,80

Cheers
Suzy W
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: patrish on Wednesday 28 April 10 23:00 BST (UK)
Looks to me as if William Fleet stole 50 sovereigns and Collins stole shirts
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: kerry1212 on Wednesday 28 April 10 23:08 BST (UK)
the wifes is allowing smoking in dormitory

kerry
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Wednesday 28 April 10 23:35 BST (UK)
50 Sovereigns, no wonder he got 15 years hard labor.   People were sent over to Australia for a piece of bread.  No wonder he was not hung.
Tough time back then.

Suzy W
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Thursday 29 April 10 01:28 BST (UK)
What I can make out with Sibby's conviction so far.
Stealing shirts, three convictions.  Gaol Upost?
Single.  ?? This offence stealing shirts 6 months for ? 3 months for breaking gla? discharged ? for clothes

William's is so hard to read.  What I can make out so far.
House break in, stealing 50 sovereign caught in. 2 years for assault. Single

Suzy W
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: ShaunJ on Thursday 29 April 10 06:55 BST (UK)
There's some info on a William Fleet who married Sibby Collins here http://coad.neuf.fr/names.htm
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: ShaunJ on Thursday 29 April 10 07:09 BST (UK)
Per William Fleet's indent he stole 50 sovereigns 15 shillings and 5d. His father was Wm Dibden "I am a chance child" mother Lucy Fleet - can't read the rest of it ........something about Louisa?

http://search.archives.tas.gov.au/ImageViewer/image_viewer.htm?CON14-1-22,230,35,L,80

Gets a mentuon on this Dibden site - see William (Fleet) Dibden http://www.angelfire.com/ar3/dibden_onename/misc-births.html/
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Thursday 29 April 10 07:54 BST (UK)
Wow SharnJ, you are brilliant.  How on earth could you make out all that writing, I guess lots of experience.
Will keep you on the books.

Kindest of regards
Suzy W 
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: km1971 on Thursday 29 April 10 08:30 BST (UK)
Hi Suzy

He was sentenced to 15 years transportation rather than imprisonment with hard labour. He spent ten months in the hulks before being transported.

Only nine years earlier stealing more than 5 shillings was a capital offence. !843 was the last year the gibbet was used. And housebreaking occured during the hours of daylight. It was burglary after sunset.

I wonder what happened to James Hunsmith (?).

I see that one of his tattoos was of an anchor. This often suggests he was at sea at some stage. You may wish to follow this up.

Ken
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Thursday 29 April 10 08:58 BST (UK)
I wondered about that anchor, and if there would be a sailing link?.  Where to look is the next step.
Seems as if I have to track down his parents Lucy Fleet and William Dibden.  No luck at this stage with birth or marriage for Lucy.  But according to the link SharnJ gave me, it sounds as if they may not of married.
There were eight children between them.  Good to notice the names were indeed carried down to William Fleets children as well.
 He was a naughty young man.  No criminal activities once he married and settled.  If anything the family were strict Catholics for many years.

Kind Regards
Suzy W
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: km1971 on Friday 30 April 10 09:00 BST (UK)
Hi Suzy

Here is a link to researching early records - http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=127 . It seems they start in 1835. But it looks as if you will have to contact Kew.

Ken
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Friday 30 April 10 22:38 BST (UK)
Thanks KM.  Can you imagine my problem with the name "Fleet" and shipping records? 
Will work on what I have at this time, would presume he was a merchant seaman before being a ploughman.
He certainly is an interesting character.
Still no response about his wife Sibby from the Ireland broad :(

All the best.  And Thanks everyone for your great links and help.
Suzy W
Title: Re: convict deatil Sabina/sibby collins
Post by: opelia on Friday 09 February 18 04:50 GMT (UK)
Does anyone know what happened to her. It seems her marriage ended as she was cut to herself in 1853
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: sparrett on Friday 09 February 18 05:20 GMT (UK)
Sibby COLLINS
Transported for stealing Shirts three convictions Gaol report middling. Stated this offence Stealing shirts 6 months for xxxxxx (possibly money) 3 months for breaking glass discharged twice for clothes Single Surgeons Report very good.
Sue
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: sparrett on Friday 09 February 18 05:31 GMT (UK)
More on Sibby COLLINS
Period of probation 6 months
Station of Gang Anson
Class 3rd 13/4/49
Offences and Sentences . Nov 27/49. Allowing smoking in the Dormitory. 1 month's hard labour (Initials) AJB(followed by  abbreviation for approved)21/12/49 xxx Hobart
ToL (Ticket of Leave) 30/3/52
Cert of Freedom 29th June 1853 herself 

Sue
Title: sibby collins
Post by: opelia on Friday 09 February 18 05:56 GMT (UK)
what about after she was cut to herself .  Does anyone know where she went or if she died.  thanks
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: sparrett on Friday 09 February 18 07:31 GMT (UK)
More deciphering from William FLEET's record.

I have filled out abbreviation for clarity.

Transported for housebreaking. Gaol Report Read in Preston before Hulk. Report Good Single Stated this offence. Housebreaking xxx James  Keninishand (possibly ::)) stealing 50 sovereigns 15/5 -caught in gambling houses in Southampton. 2 years for assault Poaching 1 month Trespass and xxx 1 month and 6 weeks. Single
Surgeons Report Good.

Sue

Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: matthewj64 on Friday 09 February 18 08:23 GMT (UK)
According to here -
http://portcygnet.free.fr/names.htm
"FLEET According to the 1851 Census, William Fleet lived at Lymington with his wife and son. William Fleet applied to marry the ex-convict Sabina "Sibby" Collins in 1850. They married in Hobart in 1850. Sabina Collins was tried in Co. Mayo 18 January 1848 and sentenced to 7 years for larceny. Children: William (1850), George (1853, Hobart), Richard (1855, Hobart)."
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: ShaunJ on Friday 09 February 18 09:34 GMT (UK)
Baptism of William Fleet at Bramshaw, Hampshire, 30 April 1820. Mother Lucy Fleet.

See http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=454764.0  for more on the Fleets and Dibdens
Title: Re: sibby collins
Post by: Dundee on Friday 09 February 18 12:34 GMT (UK)
what about after she was cut to herself .  Does anyone know where she went or if she died.  thanks

I am not sure what you are talking about, but perhaps it is the notation on her convict conduct record.

Cert Free 29 Jany 1853 herself.  This means her Certificate of Freedom issued 29 January 1853 and it was claimed by her.



William and Sabina went to New Zealand and further children were born there.  She died in 1901.  Indexes are free to search online.

https://bdmhistoricalrecords.dia.govt.nz/search

Funeral notice

https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/AG19010920.2.38.2

Debra  :)
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Friday 09 February 18 18:42 GMT (UK)
Correct the family are in New Zealand.  It is my husbands mother's family.
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: matthewj64 on Friday 09 February 18 23:52 GMT (UK)
William and Sibby were researched by David Coad in his book "Port Cygnet English Convicts"
The couple and their three children arrived aboard the Reindeer at Lyttleton NZ in October 1855.
They had five more children, Sabina died in 1901 and William in 1904.

M
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: matthewj64 on Monday 12 February 18 07:31 GMT (UK)
Interesting read about a visit to the Brickfields hiring depot where Sibby would later be charged with allowing smoking in the dormitory.
https://www.femaleconvicts.org.au/index.php/convict-institutions/brickfields#VisitingMagistratesReport
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: Suzy W on Monday 12 February 18 19:02 GMT (UK)
Thanks Matthew.  I have all this now.  This is a old post from some time ago. Sibby was also dobbed in by her sister :o
My mother in-law was born a Fleet.

Suzy W
Title: Re: Convict details
Post by: opelia on Tuesday 13 February 18 02:04 GMT (UK)
Marquessate  Thank you for answering my query so much usually if it says cut to self the husband has died or run away.  Obviously not in this case.  I am a researcher trying to find what happened to the convict women who came to Tasmania  would you be able to list the children