RootsChat.Com
Ireland (Historical Counties) => Ireland => Derry (Londonderry) => Topic started by: ABradley on Monday 12 November 07 20:05 GMT (UK)
-
I have been searching for some time to try and locate the home town/parish in Co.Derry of my g,g,grandfather Francis Bradley married to Ann O'Neill.
His son John,my g,grandfather was born in 1851 and emigrated to Coatbridge in Scotland where he became a miner.
Any info/suggestions greatly appreciated. I have tried all the various gen. sites.
-
Civil registration of births in Ireland began in 1864 so you will need to find church records (if they still exist). To do so you need to know their religion and where they lived.
If John Bradley died in Scotland his death certificate (or even a marriage certificate?) might have additional clues to where he was from in Co. Derry (Bradley is a very common surname there). See Scotland's People for the information which is on Scottish certificates and ordering them.
-
found this marriage, you may already have this.
FRANCIS BRADLEY TO M.ANN ONEIL 28-1-1841. @DRAPERSTOWN R.C CHURCH, BALLINASCREEN, MAGHERAFELT,CO.DERRY.
regards mary.
-
Thank you Mary, thats sounds good. Where did you find this information?
-
Hi,
In my attempts to find my Co.Derry ancestors I have obtained a Death Cert from GRONI for a Francis Bradley(g.g.grandfather??) who died 10th February 1867 at Fallagloon,Maghera,aged 55. These dates would fit the time frame and the death was reported by his son John Bradley(this was my g.grandfathers name). And I know his fathers name was Francis married to Ann/Nancy O'Neill.
What other information might be available on Francis to help identify him? Other family members,proper address etc.
Andrew
-
I've merged your new post with the existing thread on Bradley family.
The 'proper' address was Fallagloon which is the name of the townland where they lived (we only got road names in the country about 30/40 years ago). The name means (possibly) 'the hedge, or enclosure, of the step' and is in Maghera civil parish.
-
Hello ABradley
I may be able to help you - I am researching the Donnelly family who come from this area. I have tried to keep an eye on certain names & places as I feel that as it was quite a small community there may have been marriages within these local families and some may tie in with others. It is always helpful to know if anybody else is researching this area. As Aghadowey says "Bradley" is a common name. Without giving you false hope however, I have come across three Bradley families in the 1831 Census for Kirley that may be worth you persuing. At least you may be able to eliminate them from your search?!
The Donnelly's came from a small townland called "Kirley" in the foothills of the Sperrin Mountains roughly halfway between Draperstown (Ballinascreen) and Maghera. Assuming RC - there are two choices of churches they could have frequented: The RC Church in Draperstown (Ballinascreen) or St Patrick's in Glen (nr. Fallagaloon I think). Mine attended St Patrick's. It is quite an ancient and established RC church.
I have a copy of the 1831 Census for Kirley which names three Bradley families. As you may or may not know this Census only records place and number of males & females in a family. In 1831 it records:
Name of Owner/Occupier: Mary Bradley
No of families: 1
Males 4 ; Females 4
Name of Owner/Occupier: Thomas Bradley
No of families: 1
Males 1 ; Females 3
Name of Owner/Occupier: Hugh Bradley
No of families: 1
Males 4 ; Females 3
These families would have been tenant farmers for the Drapers Company. Have you checked Griffith Valuation yet? There do not appear to be any Bradley's left in Kirley in 1901 or 1911.
The other item that stood out in your message was that your relative went to Scotland and became a miner. Mine also left but alot later approx. 1894 to Glasgow and worked as a Quarry Master.
Hope the info may help :)
-
Hi,
Yes too many Bradleys :)
Thanks for that information.
Although I have no other names to follow up yet you never know when it might fall into place.
Andrew
-
Hi Andrew -
Yes as you say too many Bradley's!! :(
Just reading over your previous messages -and I hate to throw cold water over you Fallagloon death cert but -
I just had a quick look at the Griffiths Valuation for Fallagloon which is a decidedly larger townland than Kirley and I found the following Bradley's:
Dominick, Mary, Paul x3, James x3, Tho x2,Bernard x2, Sarah x2, Edward x2, Elizabeth, Alexander x4, Patrick x6 John x2, Francis x2.
(Just as a note: many of the Bradley's seemed to share a portion of land and work in a family "rundell")
Fallagloon is very near St Patrick RC Church in Glen.
I have also done a brief check to see about the other Francis' nearer Ballinascreen (Draperstown) and there are four on Griffiths. 2x Corick townland, 1x Patrick St. Cahore and 1x Moyard townland.
So I guess my question is - seeing as the marriage entry seems to co-roborate your family names, what indication do you have that the Death certificate of a Francis in Fallagloon is "your" Francis? I would have thought that if Francis and M.Ann O'Neill married in Draperstown more than likely they were from a townland nearer that Church. There must also be many Francis Bradley's who had a son called John.
On face value I guess I am saying I would feel a bit skeptical about the Francis in Fallagloon being yours.
If you feel fairly confident about the Fallagloon Francis there may be a clue on Griffiths which may help you -
Often more than one person in a townland had the same name. Surveyors distinguished between them in a variety of ways like "senior" and "junior" or they also used the custom of adding the father's forename after the name such as John Smith (Patrick) i.e. John son of Patrick Smith, or an occupation or physical observation (e.g. tall, short) To distinguish women with the same name their maiden name might be put in the brackets.
For the Fallagloon Francis' one has after his name in brackets (Corker) and one (Bee). They were both tenants of the Earl of Stafford, Sir Rbt. Bateson & Lady Louisa Trench. I have seen their name alot, so like the Drapers Company must have been fairly big land holders.
Does this help :-\ or add more confusion! ???
Hope it helps - I have been lost and dazed for awhile now.
-
Hi Again,
Thanks for your interest and detailed reply.
To quickly answer some of your points before I return to my confused state.
My first choice during my investigations into the Bradleys was the Ballynascreen Bradleys. As advised to me by Aghadowey.
However I had no further detailed knowledge about their deaths or offspring.
As you say there must be a lot of "Johns".
I was drawn to the Fallagloon Bradleys because Francis and his possible wife Ann both had died prior to 1872. I know John's parents died before that date because it says so on John's marriage cert. from St.Patrick's, ,Coatbridge.
Also, I have contacted The Drapers Company in London,but they had no further details on their tenants.
I will look into the points you have raised.
What would be the easiest/best way of getting further info on the Draperstown family?
Andrew
-
Hi Andrew
Well you have asked the million dollar question!
I would suggest that you yourself have a look at the Griffiths Valuation for the Draperstown (Ballinascreen) area - but remember that the tenants of Draperstown were not all tenants of the Drapers. So you would really need to find out more about the various landowners there. For example the Corick Bradley - the landowner was a Rev. Alex. Miller. Perhaps there were a lot of smaller landholders on that side of the mountain?
The Kirley Bradley's would have been tenants of the Drapers Co. If you try this link hopefully it will give you some background on the company. It also tells you all of the townlands that the Drapers Company had holdings in. (Hope I have copied the link properly!)
http://www.proni.gov.uk/introduction__drapers__d3632.pdf
All info about the Drapers Co. is also at PRONI.
Once you have ascertained which townland you can find and have a look at the actual lease that your "Bradley" would have signed.
But I think the key really is knowing exactly which Bradley before you can go any further - you have seen how many there are and the same names are being perpetuated within the same generation. Dad - Pat, Uncle Pat, son Pat , cousin Pat .....you get the idea!
This is where I have ground to a halt because really I need to get to PRONI and start to look though the films of the Parish registers. I hate to say it but you probably do to. If you know some of the family members you should be able start to pick them up in the registers. You almost need to draw up a couple of family trees to see who fits where to rule families out. That's the approach I coming from. But I'm sure you may be advised differently by others more experienced than I!
As you probably know PRONI will be closed as of Sept (for 9 months I think) getting ready for the move to their new premises. I think some small portion of information will be available to view elsewhere? I'm sure Aghadowey will know... ;D
It tricky because if you're like me you probably live nowhere near Belfast. Just tread carefully because it would be awful to pick up the wrong Francis & John.
Best Wishes
Leslie
-
My first choice during my investigations into the Bradleys was the Ballynascreen Bradleys. As advised to me by Aghadowey.
My advice was actually to search for more information in Scottish records (reply #1).
See PRONI website for details of closure and also this post on records which will be held at Creggagh Library-
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,470107.0.html
-
Thanks for the link regarding Creggah Library. I thought I had seen some information.
I have to ask though - if Andrew is unable to turn up any further information in Scotland (let's hope he can), what could his second line of attack be?
-
Without any exact place (townland) looking for a common surname like Bradley would only be speculation.
-
Thanks for that - I had been thinking some search of parish registers just might turn up something. You know some comment, address, name etc.
But yes needle & haystack spring to mind.
-
Oh Well,
I will have to rummage through all my stuff tomorrow and make a plan (like buying a pitchfork)
Andrew
-
are you seeking info on the Bradleys from Draperstown, parish Ballinscreen? Does this pdf help any?file:///D:/Bradley%20Census%20from%201911%20in%20Ireland.pdf
HI!..I am not sure if this helps anyone or may help connect us...but my name is Lori (Lorraine) Bradley Coleman and my grandfather was Daniel Quigley Bradley born in 1911 and he was the son of Edward L. Bradley and Susan Montague Bradley. Edward was born in 1879 and Susan in 1877. I have this document which is the 1911 census...He was born Draperstown and his family resided there. He came over to the states via the Transylvania when he was 18.
Margaret Ann Bradley Keenan, his sister, was born in Draperstown July 1905. Her parants were Edward Bradley and Susan Bradley(McTeaque/Montaque) of Cahore. The McTeaque is on the baptism record, parish of Ballinscreen, and the Montaque is on her birth certificate
does this help
-
Welcome to Rootschat :)
You should probably check the date and place of Edward Bradley's birth-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/civil-search.jsp
Edward Bradley, age 20, son of Lawrence, and Susan McTeague married 1898-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1898/10434/5799189.pdf
-
thank you SO much!!...That is them!!!!! I printed out the wedding information!!! I am trying to figure out now when Edward was born...there are 4 Edward Bradleys that were born in 1898 in Magherafelt
-
Marriage of Edward (father Lawrence) & Susan in 1898 show them both residing in Cahore townland. Son Edward born there in 1902-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1902/01904/1739107.pdf
This birth in 1878 for Edward Lawrence Bradly shows his father as Lawrence and mother Ann Quigly and birthplace as Bancran (Bancran Glebe, Ballynascreen civil parish- west of Draperstown)
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1878/02957/2083385.pdf
https://www.townlands.ie/londonderry/loughinsholin/ballynascreen/bancran-glebe/
Cahore townland runs south from Draperstown so not far away from where Edward was born-
https://www.townlands.ie/londonderry/loughinsholin/ballynascreen/cahore/
-
Edward, Susan & son Joseph in Cahore in 1901-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Londonderry/Draperstown/Cahorl/1543814
Lots more children in 1911 with her sister Rose-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Londonderry/Draperstown/Cahore/609996
Sadly, Edward died 1914-
Bradley Edward of Cahore Draperstown county Londonderry farmer died 10 July 1914 Administration Londonderry 26 May to Susan Bradley widow. Effects £63.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1914/05298/4473261.pdf
Death Laurence Bradley 1905 shows widow Ann- possibly Edward's parents-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1905/05589/4570574.pdf
Administration (with the Will) of the estate of Lawrence Bradley late of Moyard Draperstown County Londonderry Farmer who died 27 August 1905 granted at Londonderry to Hugh Bradley Farmer.
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Londonderry/Sixtowns/Moyard/1544562
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Londonderry/The_Six_Towns/Moyard/610696
-
it would be Lawrence and Ann Quigley Bradley because my grandfather's middle name was Quigley. you are an absolute blessing to assist me with this information...each link to a record I open is like a present...Thank you SO much!
-
Even more sad, and a bit eerie...Edward's son, Daniel..who was 3 when Edward unexpectedly passed away....died of a PE (pulmonary Embolism) in 1950, here in the states in Beacon, NY at the age of 38...leaving my father who was only 8 and his brother 7 and my grandmother Mary Morse Bradley, entirely too early....
-
Do you know why there is a gap in the census from 1851 to 1901?
I am looking for the 1891...
-
The first complete census for Ireland is 1901- only small fragments of earlier ones for a few areas survive. For County Derry there is the 1831 but only head of household listed by name.
Back to hospital for evening visiting but will try to post more later if I get a chance.
-
:D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Hello Lori!!! My name is Jared and I have been digging into my families past. It appears that our families are connected. My Grandfather, Edward Lawernce, born 1902 in Belfast, was cousins to your grandfather, Daniel Quigley Bradley.
I can fill you in on the details if you'd like, or send you a link to what I have found on Ancestry.com.
You're the first living relative we've found on my Grandfathers side! We've been looking for around twenty years.