RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: spades on Monday 04 July 11 04:22 BST (UK)
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Hi everyone.
I'd love some help finding this lady.
Mary Dorothea THRUSTON was born in 1894 Epsom, Auckland, the daughter of Herbert Edward Thruston, a mariner aged 34 years, born in Wales, and Emma née CRICHTON, aged 24 years born at Nelson.
In 1919 she married George Henry RILEY (1881-1948) at Auckland. He was a life insurance agent and she was a school teacher. The marriage was not a success and by 1924 they were living apart.
In 1926, according to the divorce file, Mary was living in Mountain Road, Epsom, Auckland, the last record I have of her. They divorced in 1927 without children and later that same year George Riley married again.
Can anyone help me trace her death or burial?
Spades
Edit: Subject title altered to correct spelling of the surname due to momentary dyslexia on my part lasting ten years. <sigh>
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There is only one entry indexed for a Mary Dorothea Riley registered on the Electoral Roll in 1928 in Rotorua (on A$).
Updated to add: Due to Rotorua Council Cemetery Database running on Silverlight I can't access it, otherwise I would see if you could search there for her first two names only, in case she married there and stayed.
http://www.rdc.govt.nz/Services/CemeteriesCrematorium.aspx
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I noticed that, but would she still be classed as married ... after the divorce?
The only other one for that year had the spelling of the middle name Dorathea living up in Marsden, Northland, but classed as married. So that probably rules that one out.
Cheers
KHP
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Could she have reverted to her maiden name?
there is this death which may be stretching things
1940/25705 Thurston Dorothy Mary 56Y
10 years out but maybe ??? ???
Cheers Janette
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Hi Spades,
Do you know where her parents are buried?
Cheers Janette
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Nothing comes up on the Rotorua database, can only search by surname.
Cheers
KHP
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Using the names "Mary Dorothea" in Archway, here is a looooooooong shot at a probate that reveals a burial, that may just fit her age:
Record No: MV03C077
Family Name: CONRADSON Age: 85 years
Given Names: MARY DOROTHEA Date Deceased:
Address: Interment Date: 2/02/1981
Gender: F
Cemetery: MARSDEN VALLEY
Plot 077
Block: 03C
Grave/Ashes: Burial
Funeral Director: P. DAY & SONS
Notes M D
DAY /
Edited to cite: Nelson City Council Cemetery Database
Sorry, not cross-checked nor of the utmost genealogical standard...grasping at straws for you ;)
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Ohhhhh Twiggytree, I think you've found her! ;D ;D She certainly looks very likely.
<tree-hug> ;)
Right age, right first and middle names. When did she marry this CONRADSON, can anyone check? I presume it was after 1956 so if anyone can find it you might need to PM me.
Hi Janette, No, I don't know when her parents died or where they're buried.
Spades
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This is the only male Conradson death
1964/34901 Conradson Steffan James 65Y
Her death
1981/32756 Conradson Mary Dorothea 14 August 1895
Cheers Janette
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Thanks Janette,
Mary Dorothea CONRADSON likely followed the Roman Catholic faith as her name is listed in the list of departed St Francis of Assisi parishioners in Nelson.
http://www.stfrancis.hostei.com/memorialann.html
I never expected to get a lead on her this quickly (but of course I should have known better, shouldn't I, this is the New Zealand Board after all! ;D).
I'll do some legwork on this and let you know how I get on.
Spades
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Conradson Steffan James
The marriage on the CD is not to your lass Spades.
Archway has a probate for this chap at Christchurch.
Cheers
KHP
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:'(
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Blast! And with that name and age I was sure it was her.
Back to square one, then.
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Just a thought, though.
What was the year of his marriage? Might Steffan have been married twice, with Mary Dorothea the second one, and after 1956?
Spades
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I doubled checked on A$A and that wife is with him on the 1954 ER and from there on he is listed with no wife.
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Just a thought, though.
What was the year of his marriage? Might Steffan have been married twice, with Mary Dorothea the second one, and after 1956?
Spades
After 1930 ..... I will PM the exact year
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Just a thought, though.
What was the year of his marriage? Might Steffan have been married twice, with Mary Dorothea the second one, and after 1956?
Spades
No second marriage. I found the cemetery where he is buried and there is a photo of the headstone.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e2z/
Cheers
KHP
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Could it not be that Mary Dorothea married Steffan Conradson prior to him marrying Mary Agnes, and then separated?
Does A$ support that supposition?
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Could it not be that Mary Dorothea married Steffan Conradson prior to him marrying Mary Agnes, and then separated?
Does A$ support that supposition?
No mention of separation on Archway. There is no sighting of a marriage for her on the CD that I can see.
Cheers
KHP
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Are divorces always listed there though? I have had one, where you had to know which index to look in and then which court box to find it in - it wasn't listed on Archway.
Having said that I see there is a Mary Dorothea Conradson in 1919 in Buller, West Coast, so not likely spades' gal.
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It's so annoying when other people share the same two names and surnames, a right old needle in the haystack.
Could it not be that Mary Dorothea married Steffan Conradson prior to him marrying Mary Agnes, and then separated?
No, she was divorced by 1927
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Hello...
Could it not be that Mary Dorothea married Steffan Conradson prior to him marrying Mary Agnes, and then separated
She may not have even married as there is a Mary Dorothy CONRADSON born in 1895
BDM 1895/7094
Due to Rotorua Council Cemetery Database running on Silverlight I can't access it
Rotorua can be accessed by non-Silverlight computers at the following link
http://cem.rdc.govt.nz/CemeterySearch/default_lite.aspx
Regards
Beg
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So what tips and tricks do others have up their sleeves for people who vanish into thin air like this?
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Hope and pray that they make an appearance when they are ready. ;D
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Spades,
Just speculation here, I haven't sighted (unless someone else can) her parents death or burial ............. and no sightings afte 1927 for your lass .......... sooooooooo wonder if maybe the parents and Mary left NZ.
Cheers
KHP
EDITED Forget about the speculation. Parents been found
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No sightings after 1919 Mangere ER for the parents. Fathers middle name was spelt as "Edwards".
Surname spelt as "Thruston"
Cheers
KHP
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BDMHR
1915/7593 Thruston Herbert Edwards 56Y
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BDMHR
1943/28166 Thruston Emma 75Y
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Buried at Mangere
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Looks like there might be a son buried there. Herbert Francis died 1917 aged 21.
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Nuts, and rats. >:(
Alright, I'll dismiss Mary Dorothea CONRADSON.
I think KHP might be right (and thank you for the marriage information) and Mary Dorothea left NZ. This possibility was always on my mind.
Spades
p.s. I've just seen TwiggyTree's death information for Herbert and Emma. Interesting that the surname was spelt THRUSTON, as it should be THURSTON. No wonder I couldn't find them. Many thanks.
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I can't see Mary born though???
1899/5335 Thruston Eva Grace Emma Herbert Edwards
1895/14275 Thruston Herbert Francis Emma Herbert Edward
1906/18083 Thruston Emma Marion Emma Herbert Edward
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On the Marriage CD they are Thruston on the 1905/1906 ER they are Thurston and Mary's 1919 marriage name is spelt the latter
Chees
KHP
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This is Mary's birth certificate:
Birth Certificate 1894/65.
Mary Dorothea THURSTON was born on 3 February 1894 at Williamson Street, Epsom. Her father was Herbert Edward Thurston, a mariner aged 34 years, born in Wales. Her mother was Emma Thurston formerly Crichton, aged 24 years born at Nelson. They were married on 30 March 1893 at Wellington. Informant was Herbert E. Thurston, Father, of Epsom. Registered on 2 March 1894.
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Spades, the father (Under Thruston) has a Probate held at Auckland
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0cfc/
Cheers
KHP
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BDMHR
1915/7593 Thruston Herbert Edwards 56Y
Yet as mentioned before he appears on the 1919 ER ???
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Being that she was a school teacher, might there be something in the Gazettes that may trace her where-abouts?
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Thanks KHP! ;D
I have already looked for his probate without success, but never under THRUSTON.
And TwiggyTrees, good idea, I'll try the NZ Gazette.
Spades
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Just in case you hadn't stumbled across this on the WWW for Herbert Edward Thruston/Thurston, its a death notice for his mother and lists both his parents as having passed. So if Mary was to go somewhere it's not likely to be there.
THRUSTON 14 Feb 1915, Norwich, England, Mary, widow of late C F Thruston, Talgath Hall, Merionethshire, m/o Herbert E Thurston, Mangere, aged 89. . [AWN 25 Feb 1915]
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The birth notice for Eva?
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e33/
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Notice for Herbert
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e34/
Note both of these are under THRUSTON too, so that may well be the key to finding Mary.
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Eva appears on the 1928 ER but not at the same address.
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Mary's teachers certificate exam pass.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e36/
She was a smart cookie!
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More reading spades ..... St Dominic's College, Dunedin
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e38/
Cheers
KHP
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School Vacations ...... takes some finding but it's near the bottom ... Intermediate class.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e39/
Cheers
KHP
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spades, have you looked year-by-year through the marriages microfiche to see if she does remarry?
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This ties in with the 1917 death of the son
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e3c/
Cheers
KHP
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TwiggyTree's 'C.F. THRUSTON' appears to be Charles Frederick THRUSTON who married at Dover in 1848 according to FreeBMD. There are two Mary's on the same page, Mary Ann HINDS and Mary NISBET.
http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/
TwiggyTree, where did you find that death notice for Mary, please? I'd like to cite it. Regarding looking for her remarriage, I believe I did do a search several years ago but found nothing. She's been on the back burner for so long I've forgotten.
I'm a bit wary of the M. THRUSTON of Dunedin being Mary Dorothea. It's a long way from Auckland.
This is fantastic progress team, thanks a million.
Spades
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I'm a bit wary of the M. THRUSTON of Dunedin being Mary Dorothea. It's a long way from Auckland.
Spades
We do tend to throw the weeds into the garden to prune out later ;D
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It is fascinating to watch as you all look at the problem differently,keep it up,good to see Spades present another beaut ::) ::)
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Sources for Herbert's mums death:
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e3d/
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e3e/
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e3f/
Take your pick! :D
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talking about prune, KHP, you're reading my mind far too well. I've just hauled out the birth certificate of Mary Dorothea as I was getting a bit twitchy about this THUSTON versus THRUSTON thing, and...on the certificate (now with the benefit of hindsight, I admit) it is spelt 'Thruston' Grrrrrr >:(
Why did I miss it? Because I purchased her marriage certifictae first, trusted the -ing typing ::) and didn't check.
Very sorry about this folks.
Redo from start +++ insert more cheese
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Think we have all been there Spades. I have Mc all in mine, but one of ancestors went overseas and could never find him, why? because he is listed as a Mac ::)
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Mc,Mac,paddy wack give the dog a bone ::) ::)
sorry I'll be quiet now
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1919 ER Dorthea is living with mum in Takapuna.
Cheers
KHP
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LOL, that was very good, Janette. ;D ;D
Very embarrassing to start a topic when you haven't even got the name right (and you're the Moderator)! LOL
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You going to change the spelling on the Title ;D
Very very good Janette ........ knew you wouldn't be quiet for long :P
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Don't worry Spades,the proverbial happens to all of us it is only the depth that varies
Cheers Janette
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Snippet about Emma Crichton and Herbert Edward Thruston from another family tree.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e3i/
Edited to add - note on the link through to A$ for Herbert that there is a posthumous file listed - ???
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Title altered ::), and I have emailed the contact for the CRICHTON family provided by TwiggyTree.
And thanks for the 1919 ER entry, KHP.
Spades
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Night night all, this gal needs all the beauty sleep she can get.
<thread hijack> BTW, did you see that althea has a 'brick wall' of her own too? http://www.rootschat.com/links/0e3j/ </thread hijack>
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spades, how you going with this gal now?
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Just a thought Spades, if you can get the mothers death notice, there could be a mention of her, which could enlighten you with a new married name.
Cheers
KHP
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Hi KHP,
That's a very good idea.
I have sent a message to the owner of the SECCOMBE tree from the URL posted by TwiggyTree in Reply #58, so fingers crossed.
All the references kind provided from Papers Past have been transcribed. I wonder what happened to Herbert Francis THRUSTON to cause his death in 1917?
I have found the precis of Herbert Edwards THRUSTON's probate in the National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations),1861-1941 (ENG & WLS):
Year: 1917
Page: p.74
THRUSTON Herbert Edwards of Mangere Auckland New Zealand died 15 November 1915 Administration (with Will limited) London 22 September to Edgar BARRY Secretary attorney of the Guardian Trust and Executors Company limited. Effects £4200 15s 2d. Resworn £4438 2s 9d.
Spades
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Just curious spades how you work out which # the reply is (without counting them all) or do you have privileges that show this?
The posthumous probate in England is interesting as this means that a couple of years after dear Herbert's death, someone discovered that he still had a will/assets in England too. I wonder if it complemented or contradicted the one here?
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Hi TwiggyTree,
Yours was reply#64 and this will be #65. If you look under the topic title for each post you should see the word 'Reply' in bold with a number after it. Let me know if you don't see it.
I agree with you about herbert's ENG Will. I will try to get a copy of his NZ one.
Spades
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I wonder what happened to Herbert Francis THRUSTON to cause his death in 1917?
limited. Effects £4200 15s 2d. Resworn £4438 2s 9d.[/i]
Spades
Maybe you need to do some digging .... maybe he took ill? This was the year before the 1918 Flu Epidemic.
Cheers
KHP
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Aaaaah...d'oh. Never 'saw' that before. Thanks. I was trying all the techie things like hovering over links on the page/post to try and find it!
[It disappears in the mode where you have the reply to thread box at the top and all the previous messages down below though :( ]
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I began with only mild curiosity but Mary Dorothea is now starting to become an obsession...
I've checked FreeBMD and NSW BDM for marriages and deaths under both THRUSTON and RILEY: no joy.
Where on earth did she go?
Spades
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LOL, just done the same thing!!
Also checked Vic, AU.
What I was thinking was, in general was that it would be to gather a list of ports that ships from each of the NZ ports sailed to in particular years, especially seeing as we don't have outwards shipping lists. Then we could narrow down which country to search their inwards passenger lists.
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Also tried ACT marriages with the following policy "Access to index information is available where the marriage ocurred more than 75 years ago." and ACT deaths with this time frame " Access to index information is available where the death ocurred more than 30 years ago. "
Searched QLD, marriages to 30/12/1934 and deaths to 31/12/1964
Think I searched WA accurately: DEATHS (1841-1966) and MARRIAGES (1841-1936) (It has a slightly unusual interface)
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Thanks TwiggyTree,
I think the next step is to find her mother's death notice to see if she is mentioned, and go from there.
I didn't think that the 'M. THRUSTON' mentioned as a pupil at Dunedin's St Dominic's was Mary Dorothea but it certainly could be. Well-off farmers sending their children to finishing school, etc.
Spades
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Hey Spades, Are you aware that the NZSG have certificates in their collection for the Thrustons? Someone must have donated them.
Cheers
KHP
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NZSG First Families has Mary Dorothea THURSTON and George Henry RILEY,
Could be worth getting in touch with the person who put them up on the list.
Cheers
KHP
EDITED Unless it is you
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Yep, it's me.
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:-[ :-[ :-[ :-[ :-[
Well it was worth a try. :'( :'( :'( :'( better go and bury me head in the sand ;D
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Cats don't do that! :P
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They don't? :P I better go and chase mice then ;D
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Hi Spades
The St Dominic's prize list mentions 'Mona Thruston' in the list of prizewinners.
The 'Sydney Morning Herald' mentions the engagement of Edmund Wybergh THRUSTON, Lt-Cdr, RN, son of Col and Mrs EH Thruston of Pennal Tower, Merioneth and Abshot House, Hampshire (1jan1940).
It looks as if the Thurston variant in this case, is the bureaucrat-approach to people's surnames - if it looks/sounds different, it must be wrong so we'll spell it 'properly' for them!! Doesn't make it easy for you of course ... I'm still trying to get STRONG corrected to STRANG on some family BDM records.
EW THRUSTON was Commander of the 'Sydney' when she sank in late 1941.
Also mentioned in the SMH is 'Eva Grace HARKER nee THRUSTON' late of Bondi (12jan1944). Eva dies 11may1998 at Coffs Harbour aged 98 years.
Maybe Mary Dorathea escaped to NSW and her sister??
Best wishes
Elli
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Hi Elli,
Yes, it dawned on me overnight that the individual must be Mona THRUSTON.
Thanks for finding a NSW connection. I always wondered if she'd left the country...
Spades
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Also mentioned in the SMH is 'Eva Grace HARKER nee THRUSTON' late of Bondi (12jan1944). Eva dies 11may1998 at Coffs Harbour aged 98 years.
Hello Spades
Just for the record :-) I spent a wee while last night looking for the death notice for Eva's husband as the Ryerson Index says it's in the SMH. I'm pretty sure it's not where they say it is as I covered the period 27 Aug 1971 to 11 Sep 1971.
I'd guess it's in the Coffs Harbour paper (as is Eva's) and that Ryerson has it wrong.
Just saving you looking, although you're more than welcome to double-check.
Regards
Beg
PS - A photo of Eva's headstone is available on-line, if you don't already have it.
http://austcemindex.com/inscriptions.php
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Had a few moments at the library this afternoon, so thought I'd back-track through the marriage microfiche to double-check for Mary Dorothea RILEY or Mary Dorothea THRUSTON or Mary Dorothea THURSTON from 1924 -1944 and there was nothing.
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Thanks Beg and TwiggyTree,
I've never doubted your word yet, Beg, and I'm not about to start now! ;) ;D Thanks for doing that, the Ryerson Index and AUS research is still very new to me.
TwiggyTree, thanks very much for checking through the marriage fiche for ALL THREE NAMES!
Spades
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You both deserve a present. ;D
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Spades another avenue to try would be to get Eva's NZ marriage certificate .... Mary might have been a witness. I ordered one the other week on a Friday and had it on the Tuesday, how is that for service :D
Been thinking about the mothers death notice, we know that notices before 1950 were short and sweet and didn't always mention children if any. In my case I had one in 1930 and just found out recently there was a child to the marriage.
Cheers
KHP
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Evening KHP,
Good idea. I might hold it in reserve to see what the death notice says. In any case Mary might not appear on it.
Spades
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I have checked the Rotorua Council Cemetery Database as suggested by TwiggyTree, but no mention of Mary Dorothea under the name RILEY, THURSTON or THRUSTON.
I don't know if it is due to the Silverlight application or the design, but this database is very intuitive and quick to use.
But the 1928 Electoral Roll mention of 'Mary Dorothea RILEY' is tantalising...I'll see if she appears there in later rolls.
Spades
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I have received a response from the owner of the SECCOMBE family tree who has given permission to post the following information.
Emma Crichton’s parents were James CRICHTON (1821-1905) and Emily Lee EBAN (c’1847-1919). James CRICHTON hailed from Covington LKS SCT and he married Emily Lee EBAN at Nelson on 13 December 1866.
Their children were:
1) James; born 1867 at Spring Grove, Nelson, died 1930 at Nelson. He married Ethel WIN (1869 Ranzau NLN NZ -1959) in 1901.
2) Emma; born 1868 at Stanley Brook, Nelson, died 1943 at Auckland. She married Herbert THRUSTON in 1893 at Wellington.
3) Grace; born circa 1870 at Stanley Brook, Nelson, died 1945 at Nelson. She married Samuel TEECE (circa 1857 Shropshire ENG-1930 Neudorf NLN NZ) in 1902 at Stanley Brook, Nelson.
4) Robert; No birth or death dates provided. He married Agnes May GRIFFITH in 1901 at Spring Grove, Nelson. They had five children.
Spades
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The reply from NZSG North Shore doesn't advance my search unfortunately. They do not hold death notices for either 1915 or 1943.
I have visited National Library and searched issues of the New Zealand Herald from 23 October 1943 to the end of that month but did not find any death notice for Emma THRUSTON.
RATS :(
I have now ordered Emma's death certificate, hoping that Mary Dorothea might be among any surviving children.
She's playing very hard to get!
Spades
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Thanks for keeping us in the loop, spades. Fingers crossed.
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Thanks for the update ............ will keep me toes crossed, cause if me fingers are crossed I won't be able to type anything :P
Cheers
KHP
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Well, Emma Thruston's death certificate is revealing!
Mary Dorothea was still alive in 1943.
Emma THRUSTON, a widow aged 75, died on 22 October 1943 at 26 Donnell Avenue Epsom from Whangarei. Causes of death were myocardial degeneration and cardiac failure – 1 month. She was born at Nelson and her parents were Emily Lee CRICHTON formerly EVAN and James Crichton. She married Herbert Edward THRUSTON at Wellington when aged 24 years. She was buried or cremated at Mangere on 25 October 1943. Ages of surviving issue, all females, were: 49, 45 and 36.
Interesting to note that Emma Thruston died at Epsom but had been living at Whangarei. Was she staying with one of her daughters?
Beg, THANK YOU very much indeed for the information in your comprehensive PM. I will follow your leads. ;D ;D
Spades
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Hi Spades
it would have been a burial as Mangere has only had a Crematorium in the last 10 yrs or so
Cheers Janette
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Thanks Janette.
Thought so, but the certificate didn't specify.
Spades
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Hi Spades,
was the FD named?
Cheers Janette
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No, but that was my next thought.
I still have to check the NZ Gazette for any record of Mary Dorothea's teaching career post-1927 and electoral rolls for Rotorua post-1928.
But I've made great progress today. ;D
Spades
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Hi Spades
PM sent with cemetery email
Cheers Janette
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Hi Spades,
In my Reply #54 I mentioned that Dorothea was living with mum, what I didn't notice at the time, and have just had another gander, is that she is down as Dorethea and not Mary Dorothea
Could she be going by the name of Dorethea Mary or just Dorethea?
Cheers
KHP
Edited: I am probably scratching the wrong tree again
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Hi KHP,
Good point, but I would have thought a search on either of those names would have found her.
I have been to National Library: the full 1928 Rotorua Electoral Roll entry reads:
RILEY Mary Dorothea, Horo Horo, married
Horohoro (present spelling) is situated 16km south of Rotorua on SH 30 down a rural road. What was Mary Dorothea doing there? Was she staying with a relative? Might she have been a teacher in a nearby rural school?
Going on with this thought, I checked the NZ Gazette hoping to find her name amongst registered teachers, perhaps, but no luck. No mention of her under RILEY or THRUSTON. The Gazette's can be checked by decade, which I did. Did she stop teaching or achieved no further qualifications?
So the next step seems to be to find out the name of Emma THRUSTON's funeral director and see if they have any family information.
Spades
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Hi spades,
Have only come into this lately, but did you also see the following Electoral Roll entry for 1928, Marsden, Northland - might help, or confuse the issue ???
Riley, Mary Dorathea, [sic] Mangawai, married.
No other Riley at Mangawai.
John B
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John, you little beaut! ;D
After looking at the 1928 Rotorua ER entry I checked the 1931 Rotorua ER as well, but she didn't appear. Your information suggests that she moved north in 1928.
I had wondered if she might have moved up north given that her mother Emma was living in Whangarei in 1943.
Can I ask how you found that entry? Is there an electoral roll index I haven't heard about, or did you use deduction?
Spades
ADDED: And Mangawai is only 72km south of Whangarei.
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It's on A$try Spades under the E/R.
Cheers
KHP
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I'm a bit embarrassed I mentioned in my Reply # 2 that someone of that name was living up there and ruled it out, cause I thought (well we know what thought thought) because she was divorced she still wouldn't be classed as being married ::)
Cheers
KHP
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Quickly flicking back to Reply #2...Aha, but we weren't considering Northland at that point, so you can be excused. 8) I can't because I should have checked it myself. >:( ;D
I wonder if Mary Dorothea was as stubborn in real life ::) ::) Sheesh.
We've getting there slowly.
I have some leads to follow tomorrow, courtesy of the inestimable Beg ;D so i'll get back to you.
Spades
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Hi spades,
Yes, KHP has the right method. (and sorry, KHP, I didn't realise you'd already listed that entry :-[)
I checked 1931 Marsden, Northland electorate, page 77, but she is not there. Unfortunately, 1931 not indexed, so not easy to check in other regions.
Next indexed years are 1935, 1938 and I cannot see her in either.
Incidentally, I've come across many electoral roll entries where women are listed as 'married' even when divorced or widowed, so I think it was pretty common.
Perhaps a reluctance to appear on the roll as if living alone?
John B
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Thanks to leads provided by Beg via PM ;D ;D I have just spoken with a lady in Whangarei who provided the following information:
Mary Dorothea died in Geelong VIC AUS, date not recalled, having left New Zealand prior to 1938. She remarried, husband's name possibly MCDOUGALL, and had two daughters.
This confirms what I always suspected, that she left New Zealand.
RootsChat rocks 8) ;D
Spades
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Oh well done Spades woo hoo
Cheers Janette
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Yee haaaa ............. well done 8)
Cheers
KHP
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Now we need to find where and when she married :P :P
Cheers Janette
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Try this search....... just enter the Christian name in, and up comes four names
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0efy/
Cheers
KHP
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Looks like it is Mary Dorothea O'Neill, 5 March 1930 age 36, which fits the birth.
Cheers
KHP
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I wondered if the Sr by her name meant sister,as in a nun
Cheers Janette
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WOOHOO!
You guys are good! I thought it might take days to find her. So she died in 1952 (although her age at death is incorrect since she was born in 1894), my contact was bang on with the surname, and we have the name of the husband.
How can we find out where they marrried?
Spades
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This couple
MACDOUGALL MARY DOROTHEA 19 Sep 1952 Geelong Eastern Cemetery
MACDOUGALL WILLIAM 19 Jul 1946 Geelong Eastern Cemetery
well done KHP,good find
Cheers Janette
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I looked at the 1952 but the age didn't fit, so thought the 1930 was the possible fit. ::) :(
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The Mary Dorothea O'Neill seems to be a religious sister looking at the others in the plot,the MACDOUGALL dates are out as Spades said but the name fits.
Maybe she was a lady who was always 21 :P :P
Cheers Janette
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Hello...
Late to the party but here is her death notice
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article23209937
Regards
Beg
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That thought did occur to me Janette after I posted ... :-[ :-[ : Maybe I should just retire ::)
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ah well done Beg,the cemetery date was obviously the burial date
That thought did occur to me Janette after I posted ... :-[ :-[ : Maybe I should just retire ::)
Oh don't do that KHP,you are too helpful to retire ;D ;D
Cheers Janette
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I thought cats had nine lines, KHP: you've only on your first, aren't you? :P
Reading the death notice on Trove I can confirm that the Mary Dorothea MACDOUGALL who died in 1952 in the correct person. My contact gave the name of one of the two children which appears in that notice.
Spades
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Here is William's WW2 details
http://www.ww2roll.gov.au/script/veteran.asp?ServiceID=A&VeteranID=580755
and death notice
http://www.rootschat.com/links/0efz/
Cheers Janette
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So where's the party, spades? :D
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Here is my contribution ;D
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How can we find out where they marrried?
Hi again...
Ancestry has a William MacDOUGALL and a Mary Dorothea MacDOUGALL, both listed in the 1931 electoral roll for Corangamite, Victoria, Australia. Need to check at library (unless someone has a suscription) whether or not they're at the same address.
If they're our couple then their marriage must have happened between 1927 (divorce) and 1931 (electoral roll listing). Can't find a mention in the Victoria or NSW BDM's. Or ancestry marriage index. Or the NZ Marriages CD. Or BDM NZ.
Regards
Beg
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I can see them in the Aus 1936/1937 E/R - Newtown And Chilwell, Corio, Victoria, address being State Plantation, Anglesea. He is listed as a Forest Officer. She was still at that address in 1949.
Cheers
KHP
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Found it!!! I was looking for McDougall and not MacDougall.
1931 - Fyans Creek is the address, occupation Forest Worker and Home Duties.
Cheers
KHP
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I wonder if we can find what ship she emigrated on?
I think she must have left NZ in 1928 or 1929 at the latest.
Spades
p.s. Thanks for the champagne, Janette! ;D
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Great news, spades.
Always nice to see those 'bricks' come tumbling down. ;D
John B
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Just a thought,I wonder if they married in Scotland
Cheers Janette
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Or married on board?
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Would it be easier to locate the arrival into Oz rather than departure from here? Just a thought.
Cheers
KHP
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Yes, you're right. ;)
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Time I contributed something useful. One of Mary's daughters was a nurse...
From Trove:
The Argus (Melbourne) Saturday 27 November 1954 p.9
RESULTS OF NURSES FINAL EXAMINATION
Geelong and District
…[deleted] MACDOUGALL …
Whoops! name deleted
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Hello again...
Time I contributed something useful. Mary's daughter was a nurse...
From Trove:
The Argus (Melbourne) Saturday 27 November 1954 p.9
RESULTS OF NURSES FINAL EXAMINATION
Geelong and District
…[deleted] MACDOUGALL …
There's a possibility she is still alive.
The F stands for Frances. If you search Australia Archives you'll find her Navy Service Record as well as d.o.b (1934) and her sister's name. And google her with Cerberus too.
Her sister was/is a nurse as well.
Page 20 of http://gazette.slv.vic.gov.au/images/1957/V/general/28.pdf (4MB download)
Sorry Spades. I was going to get others involved as I said but ended up watching the rugby. Maybe tomorrow.
Regards
Beg
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Ohhh, getting closer ........... better get some fireworks ready for the closure. :D
Cheers
KHP
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No worries Beg. Can't miss the game!
I've deleted the name from my post and your quote. Thanks for reminding me.
Spades
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Morning Beg,
I was out last night so have only now opened that Gazette link you provided. Thanks very much again.
It even provides an address for them. I'll have a better look tonight.
Spades
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I wonder if we can find what ship she emigrated on?
Spades
Hi again...
Maybe Mary Dorothea's daughters know when their parents moved to Australia.
Here's a **link** to the funeral notice for Eva Grace HARKER m.s THRUSTON. Eva is the second of the three Thruston sisters. The notice mentions Mary Dorothea's daughters, and possibly their husbands, but unfortunately no married surnames.
**link** removed as thread completed but in a nutshell it said: HARKER, Eva Grace d.11 May 1998. Wife of Paddy (dec) and loving Aunty of Dorothy and Peter, Sheena and Philip
I don't know how to find recent-ish marriages in Australia so I started a thread (http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,546754.0.html) on the Australian board asking for help. The upshot of which is you're unlikely to find a recent-ish marriage unless you know an approximate date. You then need to physically search the newspapers. There doesn't seem to be an equivalent to our BDM NZ microfiche.
The few Australian obituary sites I know of didn't seem to help.
Apart from contacting the funeral director mentioned in the notice or stumbling across them in a google search I can't really see how to get contact details for Mary's daughters. But I'm sure someone else does.
It's interesting to think that, as the daughters were born in Australia, there is a chance they may not even know that their mother was previously married and divorced in NZ.
Regards
Beg
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Hi Beg,
Thanks for the Flickr link. It doesn't breach RootsChat privacy policy as far as I can see.
Your thread on the AUS Board was illuminating too. It is possible that a relative may find this topic via search engine and make contact.
But in the meantime I have found the date and place of death of Mary Dorothea THRUSTON and the existance of a second husband and two children!
I'm satisfied with what I have already, so thanks very much everyone for all your help. ;D ;D
Spades
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It was a pleasure Spades :)
Cheers
KHP
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Always interesting ;D ;D
Cheers Janette