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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => London and Middlesex => England => London & Middlesex Lookup Requests => Topic started by: lost1937 on Saturday 27 October 12 20:30 BST (UK)
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Looking for any info on the Haultaufderhyde family. The family were tailors and the records I have found highlight St Mary Abotts church,Kensington. I can only find James Haultaufderhydes family (after his marriage) on the 1851 census but i do know that he moved to Liverpool and changed his name to Hyde.(Have all that info)His father was David and his mother was Frances Price. He had a brother also called David.
Grateful for any help :)
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I can see a William baptised to a David and Elizabeth in 1820, a David baptised to a David and Frances in 1838, and a James baptised to a Samuel and Phoebe in 1834, all at St Mary Abbots.
David and Frances appear per familysearch to have married in 1830, which seems a bit late for your James who is enumerated as aged 29 in 1851.
Can you give us a bit more information on how you have managed to link your James with David and Frances - have you located baptism records for him? Have you got full details from his marriage?
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Hi
David is a witness on James's marriage record (1843). I presumed they were brothers as I found a death record for a David in 1842 and thought that could be his father. The name just seems to be very elusive. I know that James moved north because he owed money (bankrupt?) and at that point he shortened the name to Hyde. Have got James's marriage details and know the names of their children. Emelia b@1850 marrying a Thorpe.
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Ok have now found the 1843 marriage (Haultdaufterhyde) and the 1822 baptism of James Haltaufterhyde to David and Elizabeth (not Frances). David was an army pensioner.
I don't think you can presume the 1842 death is of James' father as it could just as well be of the David baptised in 1838, unless you have found him later.
There are various Haltaufderhyde (etc) events in the late 1830s (baptisms), a birth of a Lavina in Sep qtr 1841 and the 1842 death and 1843 marriage. Each of these records will give an address. Have you searched the 1841 census by address for each of these addresses from the records you have?
I have seen the bankruptcy records for James from 1869 but they seem to postdate the move north by a decade or so, going by children's birthplaces. Also they give James' name as Haultaufderhyde trading as Hyde, so the change may have been initially just the adoption of a trading name, even if the family did take on the simpler name of Hyde from then on. Unless you have other evidence it seems to me dangerous to assume that the move or the name change were motivated by a desire to evade creditors.
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James is listed as a tailor in 1846 Kelly's - at 3 Bathurst Street, Sussex Square
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Possibly Haltaufderheide originally? http://list.genealogy.net/mm/archiv/hannover-l/2005-07/msg00114.html
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Here's one from 1807:
Sophia Wilhelmina Haltaufderheided, daur of David and Elizabeth baptised 13 December 1807 at St Mary Abbotts
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Marriage of David Haultaufderhyde and Frances Price at St James' Piccadilly 17 February 1830.
Witness names difficult to read but it looks like Samuel Hidey and Phebe Hidey
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Following up on those 1830 marriage witnesses, in the 1851 census there are is this family:
Brook Green Hammersmith:
Samuel Hidey 67 Tailor Germany
Phoebe Hidey 50 Warwickshire
Emily 22
Louisa 18
James 16
Thomas 14
Maria 12
Samuel 10
Charles 8
The children are all born Kensington. There are corresponding Haltaufderhyde baptisms for several of them
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And it looks like the Hideys moved to Liverpool in the 1850's too. They are in Toxteth Park in subsequent censuses
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Hi
Burial
11th August 1842 St Mary Abbots Kensington
David Haultaufderhyde aged 75, Mews Hornton Street
Part of Kensington is missing from the 1841 census - Hornton Street and Hornton Mews as well as the High Street have been lost.
According to his army record he was born Trintelburgh Hesse. Discharged in 1817 aged 50
St Mary Abbots baptisms for David and Frances
11th February 1831
Emily Catherine parents David and Frances, King Street, father's occupation Tailor
27th November 1833
Frances Maria parents David Thomas and Frances Sally, Park Place, father's occupation Tailor
24th February 1838
David parents David and Frances, King Street, father's occupation Tailor
14th July 1839
Arthur John parents David and Frances, King Street, father's occupation Tailor
6th November 1842 (5 years old)
David parents David and Frances, Earl Street, father's occupation Tailor
St Mary Abbots baptisms for David and Elizabeth
13th December 1807
Sophia Wilhelmina parents David and Elizabeth
13th February 1814
Thomas Alexander parents David and Elizabeth, The Barracks, father's occupation Private Soldier
31st December 1815 born 21st December 1810
David Thomas parents David and Elizabeth, Gardeners Builds, father's occupation Musician
29th September 1820
William parents David and Elizabeth, Church Street, father's occupation Musician
23rd October 1822
James parents David and Elizabeth, Sutton Street, father's occupation Army Pensioner
Regards
Valda
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Hi Valda,
How did you find the army record ? I've been searching for that without any success!
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Hi
This post almost mentions the name change to Hidey and states sons Thomas Alexander and David Thomas also became soldiers.
http://list.genealogy.net/mm/archiv/hannover-l/2006-11/msg00307.html
The National Archives catalogue has David senior's army record reference. An electronic copy of the army record should be on the website Findmypast but may not be as he was discharged in Ireland and was a Kilmainham pensioner not a Chelsea pensioner. The spelling of the surname on the army record is Haulterafterhyde.
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/search.asp
http://www.findmypast.co.uk/search/army-service-records/all
I can't find a pension record (most soldiers didn't serve long enough to receive a pension) for Thomas Alexander Haultaufderhyde but there is one for a Thomas Alexander born Kensington who was discharged in 1854 aged 39.
A Thomas Alexander born Nottinghill aged 66 and unmarried is in Middlesex Lunatic Asylum in 1881. Hanwell Asylum's census returns in 1871 were initials only. There is a T A of the right age recorded. This may or may not be the same man as the army record.
David Thomas' possible army record is harder to spot.
It looks like all the children at some point changed their surnames. Emily Catherine married James Joseph Newbold in 1874 and was living with him as his wife in 1871. Can't see her on earlier censuses.
Regards
Valda
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Thanks Valda. It seems I was using the wrong search facility on the TNA website.
So David H served with the Hompesch Hussars, the York Hussars, and the 1st Foot from 1796 to 1817.
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Hi
29th October 1848 St Giles Cripplegate born 20th March
Alfred Haultaufderhyde parents David and Elizabeth, 10 Charles Street, father's occupation Tailor
The only use of the surname so the older of the two David's born to David senior must have been using another surname also. If he had an army career it was finished by 1848.
Regards
Valda
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David's army discharge papers are now viewable on FindMyPast.
Indexed as HAULTERAFTERHYDE