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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Warwickshire => Topic started by: teddygreen1 on Friday 03 July 15 07:50 BST (UK)

Title: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Friday 03 July 15 07:50 BST (UK)
hi im am trying to find out if my 2nd great grand mother  sarah tranter is anyway related to or is the daughter of william tranter who invented tranter revolver. we thnk that she was born 1836 and lived in prices street in 1841 with william  and in 1858 she married abraham groutage . we can not find marriage certificate anywhere . can anyone help
thanks
kath 
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: lizdb on Friday 03 July 15 07:59 BST (UK)
Marriage
Oct/Nov/Dec 1858
Birmingham
Ref 6d 195
Abraham Groutage and Sarah Tranter on same page

Cert can be ordered online from www.gro.gov.uk using the reference given.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: pjm99 on Friday 03 July 15 08:03 BST (UK)
Kath,

According to England Select Marriages:
Abraham Groutage married Sarah Tranter on 14 Nov 1858 at St Peter, Dale End, Birmingham

Peter
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Friday 03 July 15 08:12 BST (UK)
thank you for your replies much appreciated
kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: ciderdrinker on Friday 03 July 15 13:08 BST (UK)
Just to add the details
Abraham Groutage bach cooper Birmingham son of John cooper
Sarah Tranter spins Birmingham d of William Tranter jappaner
wit Thomas and Emma Henne(fsay)?

Ciderdrinker
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: Jane_K on Friday 03 July 15 13:39 BST (UK)
Kath, on the 1851 census it shows Sarah's father William as having been born in Liverpool, but on 1841 it says Warwickshire? but that is on the transcription and not shown on the census image so may be an assumption on someone's behalf. I've done a bit more looking and your William has actually a third place of birth! On the 1881 census he is with his wife Ann and Grand-daughter Sarah Ann Grolage (probably should be Groutage), he is still listed as a Japanner but this time is place of birth is Plymouth, Devon.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Friday 03 July 15 16:16 BST (UK)
Yeah o know that's what's confusing ive got him as Plymouth too. Thanks kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: Jane_K on Friday 03 July 15 19:25 BST (UK)
Yeah o know that's what's confusing ive got him as Plymouth too. Thanks kath

I have found a birth for a William Tranter born 27th January 1812, in Plymouth his parents are Joseph and Ann, but I can't find any for him in Warwickshire or Liverpool around when he would have been born. I also checked Shropshire(where the gun makers family are from) as you wondered if Sarah was related to William Tranter the gunmaker and there are a few William Tranter's born between 1811 and 1813 but with no concrete details about your William it'd be hard to prove a connection.
http://www.firearmsmuseum.org.au/TranterHistory/wt_fam_fra.htm This is a link listing William Tranter the gun maker's family.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Friday 03 July 15 19:39 BST (UK)
thank you so much for looking really appreciate what you have done and thanks again kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 10:24 BST (UK)
hello again i thought i put this on a old tread as there is new query i could do with some help with....
 whilst updating my records i decided to get a sibling birth certificate  of sarah tranter  as she was born in 1836 through the gro but looking at the siblings moms maiden name they have all come up as hensaw
ann maria 1848
emmala 1845
benjamin 1852
alice 1858
we had always thought that sarah mom was ann standley as on the 1851 census it states that wife sister maria standley lived with the tranters.
is there any  way i could try to see if sarah mom was standley or hensaw apart from purchasing certificate of sibling
thanks kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 11:25 BST (UK)
There's a big gap between Sarah & Emmala which might indicate a 2nd. marriage. Maybe Ann Standley was previously married to a Henshaw.
William Tranter Bach. = Ann Henshaw Spin. (image says Inshaw) 6/6/1837 St. Mary's Handsworth.
Both signed X
Wit: Wm. Price & Sophia Newman.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 11:32 BST (UK)
there was a mary ann tranter born before sarah so maybe you are righht. might have a look to see if there is a death for a ann tranter maybe she died in child birth and william married again
thanks kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 11:40 BST (UK)
Quote
William Tranter Bach. = Ann Henshaw Spin. (image says Inshaw) 6/6/1837 St. Mary's Handsworth.
Both signed X
Wit: Wm. Price & Sophia Newman.
modified above post.
Mary & Sarah were born before Wm. & Ann married. I'll have a look to see who their mother was.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 11:44 BST (UK)
Mary Ann Tranter b. 21/8/32
Sarah Tranter b. 4/9/36 parents Wm. & Ann.
Baptised together 6/2/37.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 11:46 BST (UK)
thanks jim i know that sarah was born around  4th sept 1837 
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 11:53 BST (UK)
so there is two sarah tranters then.
sarah tranter married a abraham groutage , ive bought wedding certificate as i could not find it online and it states william tranter was her dad and he was a jappener and the census i have for them states william tranter jappener .
for example 1851 census subscribed as granton jappener but if you look on census pages subscriber error.
sub-registration district   St Mary
ED, institution, or vessel   12
Household schedule number   145
Piece   2057
Folio   325
Page number   35

thanks kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 11:58 BST (UK)
Quote
so there is two sarah tranters then.
Not sure how you work that out.
To find the Standley/Henshaw connection you need to look at those families.
Maybe they were half-sisters.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 12:17 BST (UK)
ive just found another child ann tranter 1840 born to william a jappener on baptism record and then went into gro mom name inshaw . totally confused now
kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 12:20 BST (UK)
Saw that birth.
Maria Standley was dau. of Thomas & Maria nee Inshaw married 1821 St. Mary's Handsworth.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 12:25 BST (UK)
ive just looked up baptisms for most of insaw/ hensaw and the sarah baptism  children all have  william as a jappener price street
kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 12:28 BST (UK)
Seen all of the Baptisms up to Alice.
An Interesting 1841 entry;  HO107; Piece: 1143; Book: 6; Folio: 29; Page: 17; Line: 10;
Thos Stanley   45 gunmaker
Maria Stanley   50
Thos Stanley   15
Maria Stanley   11
Wm. Henshaw 20 gunmaker
Thos. Henshaw 8
All born B'ham

Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 12:33 BST (UK)
thanks jim . they were all gunmakers by trade. i think there is a gumaker museum in price street so will have to go. i think maybe get ann certificate as nearest to sarah age ?
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 12:35 BST (UK)
You don't need the cert. to find her mother's maiden name, just do a free search on GRO.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 16:40 BST (UK)
ok thanks jim.
im wondering if ann hensaw/ ann standley are the same person . could it be feasible that ann mother was unmarried when she had her but married hence maria standley
kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 16:53 BST (UK)
I'm confused, who's Ann Standley?
Maria Standley is dau. of Thomas & Maria Standley nee Henshaw/Inshaw.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 16:58 BST (UK)
sorry jim i thought i mentioned it before. we thought ann tranter mom of sarah and siblings was ann standley as on the 1851 census it states that maria standley was wife sister.
kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 17:13 BST (UK)
The Maria Standley relationship is incorrect.
Ann is definitely Ann Henshaw/Inshaw. She's probably related in some way to Maria Henshaw/Inshaw who married Thomas Standley.
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 17:15 BST (UK)
ok thank you jim . much appreciated
kath
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: jim1 on Sunday 11 June 17 18:41 BST (UK)
I think I may have sorted it.
George Inshaw married Maria Hartley 1806 Aston.
Children:
1807 George
1810 d.1837 Elizabeth mother of Thos b. 1833 (below)
1813 Ann married William Tranter.
1817 William (below)
1819 John
1823 George James.
Looking again at the 1841 census;
Thos Stanley   45 gunmaker
Maria Stanley   50 was Inshaw nee Hartley m. Thos. Standley as Maria Henshaw 1821.
Thos Stanley   15 Son
Maria Stanley   11 Dau. appears with Ann Tranter in 1851 & therefore half-sister.
Wm. Henshaw 20 gunmaker son (father George Inshaw)
Thos. Henshaw 8 G/son illeg. son of Elizabeth b. 1810 (above)
All born B'ham
Title: Re: tranter
Post by: teddygreen1 on Sunday 11 June 17 19:01 BST (UK)
ah thank you so much jim you are marvellous 
kath