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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: bitzar on Friday 13 November 15 00:44 GMT (UK)
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Hi... I'm looking for a birth/baptism of Agnes LANG bc.1816 in either Cadder, Monkland, or Chryston depending in which years census you look at. Her death certificate in 1886 reads father James LANG, farmer deceased, and mother Agnes SINCLAIR. Members on ancestry have James LANG 1780-1872 and Agnes SINCLAIR 1781-1877 but I cant find any deaths for them in those years!
Any thoughts.
Regards, Steven.
Melbourne, Australia.
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Hi Steven, I checked on ScotlandsPeople for the birth of Agnes Lang 1806-1816 and found 3 for her with father James but mother in each case is not Sinclair. Then checked 1790-1816 for marriage of James & Agnes but no Agnes had last name of Sinclair. Lastly, I checked 1800-1830 for any births to James Lang & Agnes Sinclair but none came up. Do you know who the informant was on her death cert? They may not have gotten the name correct. As to the trees on Ancestry, I do not count them unless they have proof of whats written on their trees. Many times people just copy each other. What censuses are you looking at for Agnes??? If you can give anything else, I will look further, Kim
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Steven, did Agnes die in Australia or Scotland?
Just echoing blemdookie's thoughts that the informant may have got Agnes's mother's name wrong. This can happen especially if a death occurred in another country. I have a number of incorrect mother's surnames in particular in families I have researched.
It might be worth looking at the other likely births anyway in case one of them is your Agnes, though I'm not sure how you would ever be sure which might be the correct one. There may be a clue there somewhere though. Perhaps you could eliminate any father James who is not a farmer, check abode etc. Mother's surname probably not be given at that time anyway though sometimes they may be.
Sorry I don't have more to contribute.
Good luck.
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Thanks for your reply.
Agnes ROBERTS died 11 APR 1886 at Barrhill, Kirkintilloch, Dumbartonshire, Scotland aged 71. Wife of James ROBERTS, Forrester. Father: James LANG, Farmer, deceased. Mother: Agnes SINCLAIR, deceased. Informant was James ROBERTS, husband. She is buried at Auld Aisle.
1851 Census states born Monkland
1861 Census states born Cadder
1871 Census states born Cadder
1881 Census states born Chryston.
Her eldest son has a grandchild with SINCLAIR as a middle name.
Kim, I'm hearing you on the copying re Ancestry. I cant believe the errors I've seen. Some people are so blind to it too. This is the reason I'm asking this question. I don't believe what people have stated.
So many thanks.
Steven...
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Her eldest son has a grandchild with SINCLAIR as a middle name.
That's a nice big possible clue.
Perhaps they didn't marry .... Have you looked for births and deaths for James Roberts and Agnes Sinclair?
Apart from Agnes did they have any other children? Their births/baptisms might be worth looking at.
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Hi Steven,
There is also a possibility that she is down as Nancy rather than Agnes.....worth checking?
Annie
ADDED....Maybe even Senga?
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I know when James ROBERTS was born and died and also when Agnes ROBERTS ms SINCLAIR died. I cant find her birth, their marriage or her parent marriage. I also don't know of any siblings of Agnes SINCLAIR.
Ta, Steven.
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Is it possible Agnes was illegitimate although she knew who her father was & used his surname?
I have a g grandmother, illegitimate but used her Father's surname throughout her life on every document including her marriage & kids birth certs.
She was from Lanarkshire & her mother applied for "Poor Relief" so that may be worth looking into too?
Annie
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Is it possible Agnes was illegitimate although she knew who her father was & used his surname?
OR......
Did her father die & mother had a relationship with someone named James Sinclair & Agnes used his surname as being a step-father?
Are their any other surnames used as middle names for a clue?
Annie
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Annie
LANG is also used as a middle name by her eldest son for one of his daughters.
Steven.
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Hi, I looked at some births of the children to James Roberts & Agnes Lang hoping they would have the parents' marriage date but both pre 1855 & post 1855 in Kirkintilloch do not seem to list what date parents married. I went back and looked again for a birth for Agnes and between 1800-1817 there are 4 in Scotland, one catching my eye. 31 Oct 1802 Agnes born Kilsyth, Stirling to James Lang & Agnes Hamilton. It only struck me as in the censuses James Roberts says he is also born there. This may be no relation at all or ??. Its possible the birth was no registered or the marriage as it was not compulsory at this time. Kim
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Hi Kim and thanks.
1802 looks a bit early, but who knows really. Thanks for your efforts.
Steven.
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They may have been members of a Dissenting church and those records may be held in Edinburgh
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Sorry, I had to google it! Good Grief.... I'm a Dissenter, How exciting. Do all Presbyterians know this?!
Steven....
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Not just Presbyterians ;)
https://familysearch.org/learn/wiki/en/Glasgow_Dissenters_Nonconformist_Churches
There's hunners and thoosands ay us
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Hi Steven:
I have Langs in my family. William Lang married Janet Scott on 2/21/1828.
They had a daughter Isabella Lang born in Denny circa 1831. Both of them were weavers.
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Oh my gosh Em2
So soz for the massive de-lay.
This doesn't ring any bells bit I don't know anything about LANG except for what I've already mentioned.
rgds
bitzar.
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Team
I'm just putting it out there again....
I've worked out that this all must of been happening in a short space of time....
1841 Census. My James ROBERTS still at home in Kirkintilloch with his father and siblings aged 18.
1841 Census. Agnes LANG. No idea where she is or even if this is really her name!! But I have now found this...
1841 Census. Bothwell Castle Gate.
John Gordon. 56
Agnes Lang. 55
Agnes Lang. 23
Gaven Gordon. 18
All born Lanarkshire.
Soooooo.... The 1841 Census was enumerated on 7th June 1841 and William Roberts, the eldest child of James Roberts and Agnes Lang was born in March 1842 (cant find a baptism for him but I can for the other children). So for William to be born in March 1842, Agnes probably became pregnant in June 1841, Census time!
bitzar.
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team
I'm back on it.... Forget about reply #17... seems Agnes is still on the 1851 so not my Agnes!
Online tree's have a James LANG marrying an Agnes SINCLAIR at Cameron, Fife on 24 November 1811! I cant see it on SP. Is anyone able to check it actually did occur please...
Cameron is a hike from Chryston but anything is possible isn't it. Seems there are 2 LANG families mixed up together on many online tree's.
Many thanks as usual.
bitzar.
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Hi team
I'm back on it.
Can anyone find Agnes LANG on the 1841 or pre that?!?!
bitzar.
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Hi all
Any fresh eyes that can find Agnes LANG on the 1841?!
Regards
Bitzar.
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I have the photo of the gravestone of James Roberts and Agnes Lang at Auld Aisle Cemetery, Kirkintilloch.
My late husband and I photographed all visible stones in Auld Aisle in 2007 and a friend and I are adding them all to the Find a Grave site. You one is not on yet as it is a mammoth task.I do have the indexes and found it there!
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Oh no Muriel. For some reason I didn't know that you had posted this photo of my gr gr gr grandparent's headstone. I haven't visited in nearly 9 years now. James' parents are also buried in Auld Aisle I believe but I don't think there is a monument.
Many thanks...
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I'm looking for a birth/baptism of Agnes LANG bc.1816 in either Cadder, Monkland, or Chryston Her death certificate in 1886 reads father James LANG, farmer deceased, and mother Agnes SINCLAIR.
Does the DC have Agnes' mother as Agnes Lang, M.S. Sinclair or simply Agnes Sinclair?
Annie
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The DC reads that her father was James LANG, Farmer, Deceased. Mother Agnes LANG, ms SINCLAIR, deceased.
It's as like everyone is made up although these names run in my family but not after another 2 generations.
I did have a thought that Agnes' son, who was my gr gr grandfather and Agnes' and James' eldest was maybe illegitimate but I have DNA matches a generation further back so he is definitely James' even though on the 1841 census when she ought to be pregnant they werent in the same household.
bitzar.