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Research in Other Countries => United States of America => Topic started by: Gerry on Monday 20 March 17 16:41 GMT (UK)
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Daniel Baines was born in Bootle/Liverpool in 1891. In 1906 he was living in Southampton and the passenger manifest for the Philadelphia shows he was aged 15 and sailed from Southampton, arriving NY on 22 December 1906, aged 15. Grateful for any record of what happened to Daniel
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Hi,
Do you have a question as there is no indication of what you are looking for in the above post.
JJ
Added - I see you have altered your post :)
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Is there something you want us to look for? :)
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Sorry, hit the send button before I finished the posting. Would appreciate any record of Daniel after he arrived in NY.
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It says that he was going to join his father Richard Baines, 143 Greene St., Brooklyn, NY. Do you know anything about what happened to his father?
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Many thanks for responding, sadly the only information I have is in my initial posting, Daniel arriving in NY in 1906. I was hoping he might be found in a census return or other family record.
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If we can find more about his father, that might give us clues for where Daniel was.
I didn't see any likely matches in census records for Daniel, but they're available at www.familysearch.org if you want to check. You can also see the passenger list there.
There is a Daniel Baines who died in WWI - https://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=56239120 Have you ruled him out?
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shelleyesq mentioned information about Daniel's father. Information I have suggests Daniel's father was Richard Baines born c.1855 in Ireland. Not much to go on, but it's all I have.
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I've had a previous attempt to find Richard and Daniel but hope with the following information someone might be able to help me.
Richard Baines was born c.1855 in Ireland. The 1891 census records him as a marine fireman, living in Bootle (Liverpool) with wife, Sarah, born c.1856 in Liverpool, together with several children. The 1901 census records Daniel Baines born c.1891 in Bootle living in Southampton with three other siblings.
Richard is not recorded in the 1901 census, his wife, Sarah, died in 1900 and family notes say (but without a date) Richard 'left Southampton to live in America'. I cannot find Richard on Ellis Island records. Richard was a seaman, perhaps he arrived in New York by other means. Ellis Island records show Daniel Baines, age 15, arrived on board Philadelphia on 22 December 1906 - to join his father, Richard Baines, living at 97 Hall Street, Brooklyn.
I wonder if anyone has access to census/residential records that might help me to trace what happened to Richard and Daniel?
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The US census is available on Family Search
Links to 1910-1930 censuses
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/1727033?collectionNameFilter=false
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/1488411?collectionNameFilter=false
https://familysearch.org/search/collection/1810731?collectionNameFilter=false
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Many thanks CaroleW but each site has drawn a blank. Both Richard and Daniel are in America post 1906 but must be hiding under a stone yet to be overturned. Much appreciate your help.
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Previous thread for information purposes
Threads merged.
Sandra
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Its not just Richard and Daniel Baines who entered New York.
Also on the 1891 Census you refer to was John C Baines. John "Curran" Baines.
John Curran Baines - Curran Order
GRO Reference: 1884 D Quarter in West Derby Volume 08B Page 468
Daniel's birth is also registered with "Curran" as a middle name.
Daniel Curran Baines
GRO Reference: 1891 J Quarter in West Derby Volume 08B Page 461
Richard Baines 36 Sarah Baines 35
Mary Curran 70
Lawrence Baines 10 Richard Baines 8
John C Baines 6 Mary Baines 4
Sandra
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New York, State and Federal Naturalization Records, 1794-1940 shows john Curran Baines - 30 August 1884 - Liverpool England - arrived New York 4 May 1905 on the St Louis - spouse Hannah - resides 6 Fulton Street - occupation seaman -
Married Hannah born 10 July 1887 Liverpool England and now resides 12 - 7 th Street Long Island City new York. Has no children.
Declared intention 14 December 1917 Southern District Court New York.
Served for 3 years on American Vessels.
Dated 8 October 1924
Sandra
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The wife of John was listed as Annie on New York Passenger List - born 1881 - arrived New York 5 October 1911 on the Majestic - going to Long island City - 112 - 7th Street - had been in the USA in 1909 - 1911.
Sandra
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Lawrence Baines - mothers maiden surname Curran
GRO Reference: 1881 M Quarter in West Derby Volume 08B Page 509
Many entries on Liverpool Crew Lists.
New York, State and Federal Naturalization Records, 1794-1940 - Declaration - Lawrence Baines -
14 January 1881 - Liverpool England - arrived New York 25 December 1904 on the St Louis - Declaration date 3 November 1909 - occupation Mariner -
Sandra
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There is a Richard Baines age 54 listed as a Greaser not as a Fireman who died on the Titanic 15 April 1912.
Born about 1858 so maybe not the one you are looking for.
Liverpool Crew Lists on ancestry track him for many years his last entry is 1900 for the ship Custodian
he is age 45 so I imagine that's when he went to USA
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There is a Richard Baines age 54 listed as a Greaser not as a Fireman who died on the Titanic 15 April 1912.
Born about 1858 so maybe not the one you are looking for.
Liverpool Crew Lists on ancestry track him for many years his last entry is 1900 for the ship Custodian
he is age 45 so I imagine that's when he went to USA
Seems to have been mentioned on an earlier thread
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=764398.9
Sandra
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Thanks Sandra, for the many helpful replies. John Curran Baines entering New York was was unknown but I believe the reference to Lawrence Baines is wrong.
Family search.org records the birth of (1) Lawrence Baines b.1881, Liverpool, father John, mother Mary and (2) Lawrence Baines b.1881, Lancashire (Bootle) father Richard, mother Sarah. My Baines research refers to (2) and I think your note probably refers to (1). Lawrence No 2 died at sea in 1917, torpedoed by the enemy.
Which Richard Baines died on the Titanic has been a puzzle for a long time. Richard, born 1855 also had a son, Richard, born 1883. A Richard Baines went down with the Titanic, his body was not recovered and no death certificate was issued. Titanic records showing Richard's age are inconclusive, the age recorded does not match either father or son. We know Daniel Baines went to America in 1906 and the passenger manifest says he was joining his father, perhaps this suggests it was Richard junior, born 1883, who drowned at sea in 1912.
Your replies have been helpful, many thanks. What happened to Daniel Baines and his father, post 1906 still remains a mystery.
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There doesn't see any likely matches in USA census records for Daniel but if you have an exact date of birth for Daniel Baines that might help us check that against the SSDI records.
Sandra
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...Ellis Island records show Daniel Baines, age 15, arrived on board Philadelphia on 22 December 1906 - to join his father, Richard Baines, living at 97 Hall Street, Brooklyn...
Not that it matters yet (I've not yet found any reference) but I believe Richard's father lived at 143 Greene? St, Green St?, Brooklyn, NY [Note: the image I saw was on a pay site - not sure why Greene/Green was written twice. The writing is neat, but I find it a bit difficult to read - perhaps that isn't what was written.] :-\
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...Ellis Island records show Daniel Baines, age 15, arrived on board Philadelphia on 22 December 1906 - to join his father, Richard Baines, living at 97 Hall Street, Brooklyn...
Not that it matters yet (I've not yet found any reference) but I believe Richard's father lived at 143 Greene? St, Green St?, Brooklyn, NY [Note: the image I saw was on a pay site - not sure why Greene/Green was written twice. The writing is neat, but I find it a bit difficult to read - perhaps that isn't what was written.] :-\
Hi Lisa,
That sounds right Lisa and tallies with Shelly's reply on the previous thread - reply 4
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=767843.0
Sandra
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Ellis Island records are free to access. It looks as though two address lines have been transposed and against Daniel Baines it records the Greene Street address, also that he was joining his brother William King. Wm King was not his brother. On the line above it records Daniel was joining his father, Ric
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joining his father, Richard Baines - hence the Hall St address.
Sorry for the half-message - pressed the wrong key !
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That's normally how passenger lists are shown - William King info relates to the passenger below and had nothing to do with Daniel Baines.
Sandra
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This might be worth investigation - the birth year 1891 agrees with Daniel Baines you are looking for - there were no other births in that year. Discounted Daniel Barnes 1893 Preston passed away 1934 - 8e 574
UK, WWII Civil Defence Gallantry Awards, 1940-1949 - Daniel Baines - 1891 - residence year 1941 Hull - 5 Aug 1941 - Civilian - Dock Labourer - 68 Nornabell Street Hull - rescue work at Hull 9 May 1941 - early morning - recommended by Hull Controller -
No2 (N.Eastern) Regional Commissioner recommends - commendation 23/6/1941
Sandra
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Following up on Sandra finding a Daniel in England, could this be Daniel in 1911? (Am I correct in believing that Bootle and Everton are just a few miles apart?)
Update: I removed the original text placed here to make sure I didn't have any copyright issues. ;)
In summary, a Daniel Baines was residing in Firmley, Surrey in 1911. He was age 19.
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Thought I should share with everyone what I found last night. Where possible I like to illustrate family history with a picture - perhaps the church where parents/grandparents married or the Victorian street where they once lived etc.
1891 census shows the Baines family living at 75 Olivia Street Liverpool so I googled the address more in hope than expectation. There in the middle of current house sales was the headline 'Richard Baines - Titanic Victim - Encyclopedia Titanica'. (www,encyclopediatitanica.org). If you want to read the content its quicker to use the address on google rather that search the website.
The content offers the answers to so many questions, not least that it was Baines snr who went down with the Titanic. It also draws together and fills in many blanks in my research of this family.
I'm still puzzled about Daniel Baines joining his father Richard in 1906 in New York but the content of the latest find offers a more formal appraisal of the family. It also helps to understand why Richard and son Daniel could not be found in USA records post 1906.
The extract on Daniel looks promising but I'm hesitant to claim it as 'my' Daniel without being able to bridge the intervening years.
A big thanks to everyone for the help and information you have given me. I still cannot believe my luck at finding that article last night.
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Great article - great to solve the mystery of which Richard Baines.
Sandra
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It was very interesting reading about Mr. Baines, quite sad as well. :'(
The age is out, but I thought I would mention it anyway...
Hildebrand crew list
D C Baines, age 26 (born c1887) Liverpool
Home address: 18 Rundle Road?
Event date: 1913
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Thanks for your continued interest Lisa. Only yesterday I discovered the full name - Daniel Curran (mother's maiden name) Baines so, age apart, the crew record of D C Baines is welcomed. Yes, the Titanic story like all others was sad, however the article revealed so many unknowns.
This family is full of surprises. Daughter, Mary Baines c.1887 married age 17 in Southampton to Alexander MacIntosh. In 1906 she is a passenger on the Philadelphia to New York to join her husband, In 1907 daughter Euphemia is born in America, in 1909 back in Southampton son William is born. 1911 census Alexander MacIntosh is missing - he was a seaman which probably explains his absence. Mary had two more children, Alexander 1912 and Herbert 1914. Without a marriage certificate nothing is known about Mary's husband Alexander but the line has to be drawn somewhere and i will leave it at that.
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Euphemia McIntosh may have married Norman A Clift - September 1928. Sadly there is a death record for Euphemia Clift - March 1931 - Isle Of Wight - 2b 1027 ::) There was a birth of a daughter to the couple registered March 1930 - 2b 828.
William Alexander Mcintosh passed away June 1982 Southampton - 20 - 1253
Sandra
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Thanks for your latest Sandra but could I trouble you once more !
In an earlier thread there is mention of John Curran Baines arriving with spouse Hannah in New York. Hannah born 10 July 1887 in Liverpool. I'm having trouble finding a record of this marriage and need a fresh pair of eyes - can you help, please?
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Hi not sure who is asking what, never used this site but have known about it for many years.
Richard Baines senior was the Titanic victim, Richard junior died in Southampton in 1944.
John (Jack) Curran Baines and Daniel as stated appear to have disappeared; there are stories about that, Mary Left Macintosh and married Walker, Lawrence was killed during WW1 his ship was sunk.
There mother Sarah wife if Richard (Titanic) died 1900 buried at St Mary's Extra Cemetery Southampton, also a war memorial there with Lawrence mentioned. The Curran's in Liverpool kept in touch with the Baines in Southampton. My wife's grandmother was Mary Baines.
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Hi ScarrottK, welcome to RootChat which I trust you will find very helpful if you're researching family history. I have the following notes on Mary Baines which might be of interest
1904 - Mary Baines married Alexander Macintosh
1907 - Daughter, Euphemia born in America
1909 - Son, William Alexander, born in Southampton
1911 - Census shows Euphemia and two children living 9 Union Place, Southampton. No husband - perhaps at sea?
1928 - Euphemia married Norman Clift in Southampton
1930 - Daughter, Pamela, born in Southampton
1931 - Euphemia Clift died in IOW age 24
1982 - Mary's son, William Alexander, died in Southampton
You say Mary left Macintosh and married Walker but i don't have that record, or when Mary died.
Good luck with your research
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Hi Gerry
What is your connection to the Baines family?
William (Bill) Alexander Macintosh I have met (only once before he died in 1982). I know quite a bit about the Baines and Curran families. Mary Baines first husband (Macintosh) appears to have disappeared, I am under the impression she left him in the states she remarried Walker in 1914.
Euphemia (Effie) Macintosh husband Norman Clift's 2nd wife Phyllis later married William (Bill) Alexander Macintosh. Alexander Macintosh born 1912 was killed in an accident in Southampton Docks in 1956. I also knew Lawrence (Larry) Baines daughter Musie.
If you live in the Southampton area perhaps after the summer we could meet?
Regards
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I am somewhat late arriving but I do hold quite a bit of data on this family. Mary's first husband Alexandra died in 1942, his death registered at Chicago and he's buried out there. I think I am right in saying Mary later married Thomas Walker in 1914. Mary reverted back to her maiden name of Baines. When Mary Married Alexandra in 1907, her father Michael was the landlord of a pub in Southampton.