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Research in Other Countries => New Zealand => New Zealand Completed Requests => Topic started by: mmkiwi on Friday 31 March 17 08:34 BST (UK)
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Have seen a comment in a book from the 1940's suggesting a relative was in the crimean war. He arrived in NZ in 1851, so it is possible. Searching on google hasnt given me any resources similar to archives nz to verify records. does anyone know where service records from that time period may be found?
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If you would like to post a name folk here may be able to help you,
Cheers Janette
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The National Archives would be the place to start I suppose
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/crimean-war-records/
(but don't expect too much) :)
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Hello.
I don't make a habit of joining forums all over the place, and don't subscribe to what I consider social media sites, but last year my research into the Crimean War took me to this forum, which I found very helpful.
http://www.victorianwars.com/
It has some very knowledgeable participants but appears to have few volunteer Moderators, so thread replies can be slow at times, compared to RootsChat.
It even has a Maori Wars section. A site search will probably give you a better appreciation of what is available.
Alan.
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If you would like to post a name folk here may be able to help you,
Cheers Janette
Name is Frederick or Fred White - born about 1821, in Hertfordshire Uk, died 1877 in Christchurch NZ
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Do you have his parents names?
Cheers Janette
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Hi Mmkiwi,
I assume he was the Frederick WHITE stabbed to death by the patient PRICE at the Asylum?
Do you have any other clues which might help, a possible regiment, old uniform or memorabilia, anecdotes?
I think you need the attention of the military experts on the Armed Forces board. I'll move your topic across.
Happy hunting.
Spades
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Is this his death?
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/GRA18770628.2.6.14?query=frederick%20white
Cheers Janette
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Inquest.
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP18770629.2.24?query=frederick%20white
No biographical information on Frederick, unfortunately.
Spades
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[...] a relative was in the Crimean War. He arrived in NZ in 1851
Hello...
The Crimean War was fought from October 1853 to March 1856.
So if your relative arrived in NZ in 1851 it's more than likely he wasn't involved.
Doesn't mean he wasn't in the British Army though.
Would suggest searching pension records on FindMyPast.
Or, although it's more 1860's onwards, the British Army pensioners listed at NZ Archives in Wellington (General Biographical Card Index [Bio 1])
Regards
Beg
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Reference to a married son
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/AS18770628.2.21?query=frederick%20white
Cheers Janette
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I forgot to ask.
Can you tell us the title of the book you mentioned, please?
And I checked my copy of Discharged in New Zealand. Soldiers of the Imperial Foot Regiments who took their discharge in New Zealand 1840-1870. (Hughes, H & L, 1988), since some of those regiments, the 57th (West Middlesex) Regiment for one, served in the Crimea prior to arriving in New Zealand. No Frederick WHITE listed.
Spades
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Do you have his parents names?
Cheers Janette
I believe his parents where Charles White born abt 1781, d after 1851 and Elizabeth, but this is unverified
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Hi Mmkiwi,
I assume he was the Frederick WHITE stabbed to death by the patient PRICE at the Asylum?
Do you have any other clues which might help, a possible regiment, old uniform or memorabilia, anecdotes?
I think you need the attention of the military experts on the Armed Forces board. I'll move your topic across.
Happy hunting.
Spades
Yes he was killed by an inmate of Sunnyside asylum in 1877
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So if your relative arrived in NZ in 1851 it's more than likely he wasn't involved.
Regards
Beg
A tree on the Ancestry site, mentions that he arrived on Steerage on the SS Bangalore with a Mary Anne, Henry and James Nottage - the relationship is not really known .... reference Canterbury Assn Shipping Emigrant Passenger List.
Cheers
KHP
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I forgot to ask.
Can you tell us the title of the book you mentioned, please?
And I checked my copy of Discharged in New Zealand. Soldiers of the Imperial Foot Regiments who took their discharge in New Zealand 1840-1870. (Hughes, H & L, 1988), since some of those regiments, the 57th (West Middlesex) Regiment for one, served in the Crimea prior to arriving in New Zealand. No Frederick WHITE listed.
Spades
the book is The Early Canterbury Runs by Leopold George Dyke Ackland .. it refers to head stockman White ... the digital copy is found on http://nzetc.victoria.ac.nz/tm/scholarly/tei-AclEarl-t1-body-d2-d13.html I hope it is ok to send this link on this forum.. I was searching on Springs Station in Canterbury as it is referred in his sons obituary.
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So if your relative arrived in NZ in 1851 it's more than likely he wasn't involved.
Regards
Beg
A tree on the Ancestry site, mentions that he arrived on Steerage on the SS Bangalore with a Mary Anne, Henry and James Nottage - the relationship is not really known .... reference Canterbury Assn Shipping Emigrant Passenger List.
Cheers
KHP
Mary Anne Nottage or White is his mother, Frederick White is her husband. James Nottage .. isnt a sibling but maybe a cousin - still looking into that one
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From that book linked to above, relevant quote:
"...Their head stockman was a man named White who had been a navvy in the Crimean War. He afterwards became a warder at Sunnyside and was killed by a lunatic."
The word 'navvy' suggests (to me, at any rate) either a dock docker, labourer or perhaps a Royal Navy seaman. Certainly not Army.
But if he arrived per Bangalore in 1851 it's all moot: he was in New Zealand for three years prior to the war commencing.
Spades
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From that book linked to above, relevant quote:
"...Their head stockman was a man named White who had been a navvy in the Crimean War. He afterwards became a warder at Sunnyside and was killed by a lunatic."
The word 'navvy' suggests (to me, at any rate) either a dock docker, labourer or perhaps a Royal Navy seaman. Certainly not Army.
But if he arrived per Bangalore in 1851 it's all moot: he was in New Zealand for three years prior to the war commencing.
Spades
In Wikipedia there is a reference to Navvies working on the construction of the railway in 1855 for the Crimean war. I am not aware if NZ would have sent anyone to this war ..
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From that book linked to above, relevant quote:
"...Their head stockman was a man named White who had been a navvy in the Crimean War. He afterwards became a warder at Sunnyside and was killed by a lunatic."
The word 'navvy' suggests (to me, at any rate) either a dock docker, labourer or perhaps a Royal Navy seaman. Certainly not Army.
But if he arrived per Bangalore in 1851 it's all moot: he was in New Zealand for three years prior to the war commencing.
Spades
In Wikipedia there is a reference to Navvies working on the construction of the railway in 1855 for the Crimean war. I am not aware if NZ would have sent anyone to this war ..
but think you are right this appears to be a "tall tale" .. or a misunderstanding.. as the book was written in the 1940s I am guessing the author is not available to verify sources. Just wanted to see if there were any verifications I could find as I have seen a few pages with NZ in the Crimean and wasnt sure if there was a source I was overlooking
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The 1851 census has Frederick White aged 30 as the Head Married to Mary A aged 40 born in
Netteswell, Essex, England
Henry Nottage is listed as Son-In-Law aged 13 born Sawbridgeworth, Hertfordshire, England he is more likely to be Mary A's son by a previous marriage?
Charles White is listed Father .Widower born 1781 occupation is Road Lab born Sawbridgeworth, Hertfordshire, England.
Cheers Janette
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A Frederick White was baptized on 14 Jan 1821 in Sawbridgeworth parents Charles and Elizabeth,father's occupation labourer
Cheers Janette
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A Henry Nottage was born on the 5th August 1838 in Sawbridgeworth to Mary Nottage he was baptized on the 19th August and is stated as BB of Mary
Cheers Janette
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QUOTE:-....
but think you are right this appears to be a "tall tale" .. or a misunderstanding.. as the book was written in the 1940s I am guessing the author is not available to verify sources. .........[/quote]
Balakava, the port of entry for the British Crimean Campaign, went from a little fishing village to a port where over 100 vessels were recorded attempting to discharge their cargo, or were in roadstead acting as accommodation, stores, ammo depots and hospital ships.
All trades in, and out of service, were engaged in building wharfs, warehouses, roads and a railway to get the necessities of war, off the ships, and up the valley.
It is quite probable that Mr White had a sibling or relative that was involved for a time, or the author was confusing the previous history of stockmen employed on the station.
Alan.
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You will have all this wonderful information about the son Henry, who is mentioned in the inquest concerning his father.........
[Marriage:1863/3982 Emma Berry Henry White]
Photograph:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19340829.2.159.9?query=henry%20white
Photograph:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19330809.2.130.3?query=henry%20white
Obituary:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19340809.2.50?query=henry%20white
Obituary:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/EG19340828.2.27?query=henry%20white
Account of the funeral:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19340830.2.135?query=henry%20white
Minniehaha.
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Crimean War Records..........
https://www.forces-war-records.co.uk/crimean-war-records
Minniehaha.
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You will have all this wonderful information about the son Henry, who is mentioned in the inquest concerning his father.........
[Marriage:1863/3982 Emma Berry Henry White]
Photograph:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19340829.2.159.9?query=henry%20white
Photograph:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19330809.2.130.3?query=henry%20white
Obituary:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19340809.2.50?query=henry%20white
Obituary:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/EG19340828.2.27?query=henry%20white
Account of the funeral:
https://paperspast.natlib.govt.nz/newspapers/CHP19340830.2.135?query=henry%20white
Minniehaha.
thanks, aware of these articles, isnt it great when there is something in the papers that gives you a feel for how they lived their lives.