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Wales (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Wales => Denbighshire => Topic started by: Dingaling on Tuesday 11 April 17 05:15 BST (UK)
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I have a copy of a marriage cert dated 30th August 1856 Henllan Denbigh of a
William Jones (full age)
a Bachelor
Labourer of Ochr Bychau
fathers name Edward Jones a labourer
who married
Elizabeth Evans (Under Age)
Spinster
of Groes Fawr fathers name Edward Evans
Witnesses
Thomas Jones
Mary Evans and I have been trying to locate these families in the early parish records and early census records 1851 and 1841 but to no avail.
Hoping that someone may be able to help me with records that may relate. I have been able to locate William and Elizabeth Jones in the 1871 1881 1891 and 1901 census.
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As the marriage you have given does not us any idea of their ages could you please give an approximate birth date for them also places of birth
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Hi Rosie
As the marriage you have given does not us any idea of their ages could you please give an approximate birth date for them also places of birth
I think these are given in earlier threads - see
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=767899.msg6202057#msg6202057 *
and other postings on that and ref to other threads.
* Wrong link http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=767899.msg6201018#msg6201018
Gadget
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Thank you Rosie for your post.
The 1871 census gives
Event Place Minera, Minera, Denbighshire Wales
William Jones age 38 b 1833 Henllan Denbighshire
Elizabeth Jones age 36 b 1835 Henllan Denbighshire
children
daughter Margaret Jones age 14 b 1857 Henllan Denbighshire
Son Edward Jones age 9 b 1862 Minera Denbighshire
Daughter Catherine Jones age 6 b 1865 Minera Denbighshire
Daughter Jane Jones age 2 b 1869 Minera Denbighshire
1881 census has the above family at Minera Denbighshire with children Edward, Jane and ANOTHER DAUGHTER
Mary Ellen Jones Age 4 B 1877 Minera Denbighshire.
William Jones was a Quarry Man..
I have located a 1851 census which gives a Edward Jones age 60 b 1791 St Asaph Flintshire age labourer, wife Elizabeth Jones age 59 b 1792 St Asaph Flintshire daughter Mary Jones age 19 b 1831 St Astaph, son William Jones age 15 b 1836 St Asaph and daughter Elizabeth Jones age 9 b 1842 St Asaph. Event place Denbighshire Wales but dont know if they belong.
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Might be William in 1841:
1841
Henllan HO107/1402/5/39/3
Edward Jones, 35, ag lab
Catherine, 35
Margaret, 10
William, 8
Thomas, 6
Jane, 4
Richard, 2
All born Denbighshire apart from Edward
a couple of possibles for 1851 as William might have left home
Added - I see that William had a brother Thomas (cf witness)
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There are a few possible marriages for an Edward Jones to a Catherine in the approx timescale (1830 +/- 3 ) but not enough info to be certain.
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Thank you Gadget for your posts.
The 1841 census is a good match especially with Thomas Jones also mentioned in the census and a Thomas Jones as a witness in the 1856 marriage of William Jones and Elizabeth Evans
I have not been able to advance any further with Elizabeth Evans bc 1834 Henllan when she married William Jones fathers name Edward Evans a labourer. Elizabeth seems to have gone off the radar.
Once again thank you for your help.
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I see that the other witness was a Mary Evans - could it be Elizabeth's sister? Also, did they use a naming convention for their children ~
Margaret
Edward - fathers
Catherine - William's mother
Jane, Mary Ellen - maybe sisters
Could Elizabeth's mother have been a Margaret?
Just trying to work around the puzzle.
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The different census has
christian names for the 1871 census
William Jones and Elizabeth Evans. Children Margaret, Edward, Catherine and Jane,
the 1881 census for William Jones and Elizabeth Evans has children in household
Edward, Jane and Mary Ellen,
NO 1891 census
1901 census for William Jones and Elizabeth Evans
No children but grandchildren John W Caine, and Lily M Jones.
There is a pattern with names. Thank you for pointing out the familiarity.
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I should have mention that Catherine Jones b 1865/6 daughter of William Jones and Elizabeth Evans who married John Evans in 1886 named her children John Edward 1887 Minera Denbighshire` , Elizabeth 1891 Minera , Gwladys 1894 Minera and Idris b 1900 Minera. Witnesses on the marriage cert Enoch Williams and Jane Jones. So there is a naming pattern still in existence.
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I've found an interesting baptism in Denbigh:
14 Feb 1836 (born 7th Feb) - Elizabeth Evans d of Edward (labourer) and Margaret of Post Office Lane, Denbigh.
Henllan is only just over 2 mls/3.7 km from Denbigh.
I don't see them on the 1841 but they could be on one of those missing pieces. I'll have another look later .
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A marriage between Edward Evans and Margaret Williams (both otp) in Denbigh on 10th October 1835.
Witnesses - Thomas Evans and Elizabeth ?Zacchens? *
* I've been searching in the area for this surname for a while. The nearest so far is a marriage
between a Hugh Zachens and Elizabeth Jones in 1766, Llanrhaeadr yng Nghinmeirch. I think too
early but a possible lead. Llanrhaeadr yng Nghinmeirch is just over 3 mls from Denbigh.
Also mention in the North Wales Chronicle , Jan 29 1876 of a W Zachens who played in a Gentlemans X1 versus a Gentlemans X1 football match in Portmadoc on January 22nd!!
All this is possible only.
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It's worth looking through Jill Rose's Names from Clwyd - link to Zs
http://www.clwydsurnames.org.uk/Z.html
I see there are some Zacheus (Elizabeth and John) in Denbigh PRs so will follow up
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This is possibly the nearest to the second witness to the 1835 marriage:
https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KCPC-3WN
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There is an online tree for the Elizabeth Zaccheus b. 1804 - d. 1846
Parents - Thomas Zaccheus (1763-1833) and Anne Hughes (1761-1834) - Denbigh
Marriage 5 Oct 1840, Liverpool to David Jones (1802-1875)
I don't see a relationship of this Elizabeth to either Edward Evans or Margaret Williams so far, apart from her being a witness to their marriage.
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Thank you Gadget for your post regarding William Jones and Elizabeth Evans.
I like the baptism of Elizabeth Evans
14 Feb 1836 (born 7th Feb) - Elizabeth Evans d of Edward (labourer) and Margaret of Post Office Lane, Denbigh
and the marriage between Edward Evans and Margaret Williams (both otp) in Denbigh on 10th October 1835.
Witnesses - Thomas Evans and Elizabeth ?Zacchens? *.
The above seem to make match and as you mentioned Henllan is only a few miles away from Denbigh.