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Some Special Interests => Travelling People => Topic started by: TravellingGirl94 on Friday 28 April 17 10:15 BST (UK)
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Having discovered I have 75% of my DNA matches as Romany, I am now trying to work out where in my family they originated. I have matches with Boswell, Lee, Smith, Scamp, Jackson. My grandmother was a Smithers from Lambeth, her mother a Judd and her mother a Bowley and her mother a Jennings from Buckinghamshire. Can anyone confirm a Romany link please?
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None of those names are listed in The Book of Bob.
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Thank you
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Hi it might confirm or deny a Romany link if you could provide the name/year/pob of the Grandmother Smithers with mothers maiden name Judd?
Keyboard86
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Florence Louisa Smithers b. 1889
Emma Louisa Judd b. 1857
Mary J Bowley b. 1836
Peggy Jennings abt 1812 Buckinghamshire
Eliza Ann Jopson b. 1832
Eliza Gudgeon b. 1803 Caddington, Bedfordshire
I have the Romany DNA, but just cannot find the relevant relatives! A friend is helping with my tree. This was the only branch of the family I never knew anything about.
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Hi is this Florence in 1891?
Robert Smithers 30 occ Engine Driver Brewery b Lambeth
Emma 35 b St Pancras
Robert 11 b Westminster
Willie 8 b Westminster
Harry 4 b Westminster
FLORA 2 b Westminster
Residing at Castle Buildings, Castle Lane, Westminster
Census ref RG12/82/155/27
Marriage 30th October 1881 Emmanuel, Camberwell
Robert William Alfred George Smithers 21 occ Labourer Father Robert John Smithers occ Labourer
Emma Louisa Judd 23 Father William Judd occ Coal Porter
Keyboard86
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Yes, this is her. I remember being told he worked for Watneys Brewery
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TG; Just a blind shot. But; What other names have ye got? Surnames alone might actually provide us with a better clue than anything ye think about the people behind them. Could at least provide a clue.
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Jopson, Gudgeon, Ell, Warren,
Gudgeon went back to Caddington in Bedfordshire
Eliza Ann Jopson married Stephen Judd, William Collins and Matthew Annan
Lovells and Hearn married into the family, but not my direct line
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Gudgeon / Kent. Warren / London. Neither has a date. But, they're names that have been given by Gypsys, somewhere along the line.
Lovell and Hearn?! Christ! Well, there's a big pointer. Why would they want to do with anyone else?
Not your direct line? No. But, Someone. Do ye know who? Only, if someone was interesting enough to those people? Those same someones had already found an interest in Your people. See? We need to join the dots ;)
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Hi Emma Louisa Judd was b c 1857 St Pancras, at marriage she gives her father as William Judd, not Stephen.
Emma Louisa Judd March qtr 1857 St Pancras V1b page 165 mmn Jobson
Marriage 21st April 1862 St Pancras, Old St Pancras
Stephen Judd occ Office Clerk Father Stephen Judd occ Coal??
Eliza Ann JOBSON father James Jobson. occ Brewer
Keyboard86
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Hi followed Eliza Ann Jobson/Jopson back to 1841/51 her father was dead as
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Marriage 3rd November 1840 St Leonard, Shoreditch
Geoge Allen Ordish Bachelor occ Merchants Clerk Father Edward Ordish occ Farmer
Eliza JOPSON Widow Father Wm Gudgeon occ Brewer
1841 census
George Allen 30 Not born in County
Eliza 35 Not born in County
John Gudgeon 70 Not born in County
Eliza Jobson 8
Wm Jobson 7
Mary Ann Jobson 3
Thomas Pearce 40 Not born in County
Residing at Macclesfield Street, St Luke, Middlesex
Census ref HO107/666/ 3/23/ 6
The fact that at present the families not only by their occupations but ease of locating via census suggests the link is way back?
Keyboard86
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We are working on checking facts. Thank you for the info :)
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We are working on checking facts. Thank you for the info :)
So just what are the facts, all that has been supplied or a 75% Romany DNA?
What has been located prior to say the 1841 census?
Keyboard86
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75% of my DNA matches are Romany.
We have back to William Gudgeon b. 1745 Caddington, Beds married to Ann Warren b. 1843 Luton, Beds
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For 75% of your matches to be Romany I would think there would be more than one distant Romany ancestor.
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I googled Jopson and found 2 who had married Smiths who were Romanies. Not it my tree, but just out there. So clearly there was a Romany connection.
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I googled Jopson and found 2 who had married Smiths who were Romanies. Not it my tree, but just out there. So clearly there was a Romany connection.
😂Did you also Google JOBSON,?
Keyboard86
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No, I did not
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Which company did you test with? What does it estimate your admixture to be?
How close are the Romany cousins estimated to be according to shared DNA?
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I tested with Ancestry. Closest cousins of any branch are 4-6. I have South Asia in my admixture, though only 4%. GED match estimates 4th cousins with numerous Romany matches. My closest matches are Romany.
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I know census records are often "near enough" but in 1851 Eliza Allen née Gudgeon says she is 42, so approx 1809, and born in Luton.
Then she's 49 in 1861, so approx 1813!
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I know census records are often "near enough" but in 1851 Eliza Allen née Gudgeon says she is 42, so approx 1809, and born in Luton.
Then she's 49 in 1861, so approx 1813!
How we can prove prior to 1837 in any form/surname of this line will be so difficult?
1871 census :-
James Allen 25
Eliza 60 Mother b Bedfordshire
Eliza Judd 36 Sister
Harrey Judd 11 Nephew
William Judd 9 Nephew
Alfred Judd 6 Nephew
Residing at Lancaster Street, Southwark
Census ref RG10/604/28/55
Keyboard86
EDIT Emma JUDA ( as transcribed) aged 14 b St Pancras is shown as Niece to a Jas Watson 40 and Emma 29 and family residing at Oak Village, St Pancras in 1871
Census ref RG10/246/34/61
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We will check this, personally I do not have access to many of these records. Thank you
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You're in luck because FindMyPast is has free access to their birth, death, marriage and census records this weekend. You will just need to register, which is free.