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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Essex => Topic started by: kitman64 on Monday 15 May 17 19:46 BST (UK)

Title: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Monday 15 May 17 19:46 BST (UK)
I have Ava Carrington b Ardleigh, Essex C1878, I have her parents as John and Eliza Carrington  as her birth parents, but on the 1881 census ava is down as johns niece, cannot find her on 1891, she marries William avenell Oct q 1900 in Colchester Essex can someone please confirm her birth parents; on 1901 census she appears as Eva avenell living in Maidstone kent
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: PaulineJ on Monday 15 May 17 19:52 BST (UK)
You, yes you, look for her birth registration , and see what is given for he MMN.
A quick look suggests sep 1877 in tendring.

Repeat for any kids shown with the 1881 adults.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Jebber on Monday 15 May 17 20:03 BST (UK)
She appears to have been registered as Eva, no mother's maiden name so likely she was illegitimate.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Milliepede on Monday 15 May 17 20:06 BST (UK)
If she is down as a niece those aren't her parents.  The other children listed will be her cousins.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Milliepede on Monday 15 May 17 20:12 BST (UK)
John has a sister Hannah who could be her mother but birth certificate for Eva will confirm who her parent/s were.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Jebber on Monday 15 May 17 20:17 BST (UK)
You beat me to it Milliepede ;D ;D

Hannah was still unmarried in 1881 , so  a good possibility, the only way to find out is  as Milliepede says, you need the birth certificate.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Milliepede on Monday 15 May 17 20:19 BST (UK)
There's an Eva Harrington in 1891 again niece age 14 don't know if that could be her.  Birthplace down as Birch?

Head of the family is Frederick Mills 37 wife Marion 35 and children Arthur 7 Harry 5.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Cas (stallc) on Monday 15 May 17 20:29 BST (UK)
Possible...

1891- Eld Lane, Holy Trinity, Colchester, Essex, England

Edward   Butcher   Head   Married   Male   34   Railway General Labourer   Essex
Hannah   Butcher   Wife   Married   Female   39   Ardleigh   Essex
Eva   Butcher   Daughter   Single   Female   13  Ardleigh Essex

Marriages Sep Q 1884   
BAXTER    Frederick Henry  Colchester    4a   557    
BUTCHER    Edward Allen     Colchester    4a   557    <<<<
CALVESBERT    Georgina     Colchester    4a   557   
Carrington    Hannah        Colchester    4a   557    <<<<<

Cas
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Milliepede on Monday 15 May 17 20:35 BST (UK)
Liking the look of that one Cas right age and birthplace for Eva plus a Hannah Carrington marriage  :D

No Eva Butcher birth to match so I think that must be her.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Monday 15 May 17 20:58 BST (UK)
looking promising for Hannah being her mother, i'm loathe to get certifictes got so many over the years but on this one It does look like i'll have to, will post again if I decide on certificate; OUCH! many thanks for your help and posts
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Milliepede on Monday 15 May 17 21:06 BST (UK)
I know what you mean about certificates but it is exciting opening them so fingers crossed if you go for it  :)
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: olleym on Monday 15 May 17 23:44 BST (UK)
Birch was not in tendring registration district
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Tuesday 16 May 17 00:17 BST (UK)
No baptism in ardleigh between 1874 and 1884.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: olleym on Tuesday 16 May 17 06:02 BST (UK)
There was both a Harrington and a Carrington family in Ardleigh in 1876/77
A John and Eliza Ann Carrington had baptised Ethel Carrington on 17.10.1876.
Looking at the 1881 census these are 3 of the people with which Eva was living, perhaps the erroneous Ardleigh birth source.

Mark
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Tuesday 16 May 17 20:17 BST (UK)
thanks for all posts and help, was hoping nannyj that there was a baptism, oh well; have sent for birth certificate for Eva Carrington will post info when I receive it
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Tuesday 16 May 17 22:57 BST (UK)
John and Eliza baptise a child or two in manningtree too, which is close to ardleigh.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Wednesday 17 May 17 09:26 BST (UK)
thanks nannyj do you have info on baptisms in manningtree for carringtons
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Wednesday 17 May 17 22:35 BST (UK)
Hi. I have been through the Manningtree and Mistley parish registers and there are numerous Carrington baptisms across both. Families seem to use both parishes for different births within the same family. Their occupations range from mariner (a few) to a shoemaker, a farmer and a labourer.

Your John and Eliza Anne baptised Emily 16/11/1879 and John 31/3/1878 in Manningtree. they were living in Ardleigh and John was a farmer.

I did find a Hannah Carrington baptised in Mistley to a Thomas and Sarah Carrington 13/8/1825. Thomas was a mariner.

I have written down all the baptisms I could find for Carringtons in these parishes from about 1770 to 1895, so when you know what you want, post again on here - there's too many for me to write them all up on here!!!
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Thursday 18 May 17 11:47 BST (UK)
that's really great nannyj appreciated, will let you know after I receive birth cert for eva
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Friday 19 May 17 21:28 BST (UK)
Found another baptism for a child of John and Eliza Ann carrington in elmstead: Arthur 12/2/1882
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Friday 19 May 17 21:55 BST (UK)
thanks, no cert yet expect tues or wed as they say 4/6 days
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Friday 19 May 17 21:57 BST (UK)
I have Ava Carrington b Ardleigh, Essex C1878, I have her parents as John and Eliza Carrington  as her birth parents, but on the 1881 census ava is down as johns niece, cannot find her on 1891, she marries William avenell Oct q 1900 in Colchester Essex can someone please confirm her birth parents; on 1901 census she appears as Eva avenell living in Maidstone kent
kitman

The marriage with avenell was in Chelmsford, not Colchester.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Friday 19 May 17 21:58 BST (UK)
thanks, no cert yet expect tues or wed as they say 4/6 days
kitman

Did you order direct with GRO? If you're prepared to wait about three weeks, I think it's only about 10.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: Milliepede on Friday 19 May 17 22:04 BST (UK)
GRO are pretty quick at the moment.  Have done a couple lately and been about a week but I know times do vary.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Friday 19 May 17 22:21 BST (UK)
That's good. Last time I ordered was a year or so ago and it was 15 working days. Felt like I was waiting forever!
Found your Eva in 1891: holy trinity, Colchester. She's down as Eva butcher. It's looking like Hannah is her mother, as parents are Edward and Hannah. Dates and places of birth all match?

Edited:
Sorry Cas. Should've read this earlier post from you with this info.

In 1881, Hannah is unmarried and living as a domestic servant at planes farm, Ipswich road. Maybe the reason Eva is living with her uncle?
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Saturday 20 May 17 11:21 BST (UK)
thanks again, I have eva on 1881/91 census just hope father present on birth cert "I live in hope" :)
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Sunday 21 May 17 10:00 BST (UK)
Received birth certificate yesterday Eva Carrington born Ardleigh Essex, 13 August 1877, mother Hannah Carrington no father present, do you have a baptism for Hannah as i'm getting conflicting ages on censuses for Hannah
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 21 May 17 10:15 BST (UK)
Yes. I've seen the conflicting ages too, although most seem to suggest 1838/9 so ...
Hannah carrington baptised 15/4/1838 to Jonathan and Anne. He was a farmer. Ardleigh.
Siblings: shadrach 18/4/1844, shadrach 25/9/1842 (must've died before 1844), Jonathan 25/4/1841, Betsey 17/7/1836, Maria 21/9/1834, Sarah Ann 12/5/1833, Jonathan 18/9/1831 (must've died before 1841), Susanna 16/6/1830 when Jonathan senior was a labourer. All ardleigh.

I'll have a look for the marriage of Jonathan and Anne later today and see if I can find their baptisms too.

Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Sunday 21 May 17 15:44 BST (UK)
I see a Hannah Carrington b april 1838 tendring, also a death for Hannah Carrington
 july 1838 Colchester; there is another Hannah Carrington b 1844 tendring "hope i'm not confusing anyone" I see Ardleigh is in the parish of Tending 4 miles from Colchester and all 3 places have been used as place of birth, now on the 1871 census Hannah age 23 abt 1848 [1838] parents johnathon and ann, bit confusing
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 21 May 17 16:16 BST (UK)
Lol. I know what you mean. Mother in law coming for dinner. Will have another check when she goes home 😊
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 21 May 17 20:56 BST (UK)
I can only find one Hannah for 1838. She consistently gives 1838/9 as her year of birth 1841 - 1881 (one entry of 1848 is a transcription error). On these she is Johnathan and Ann's daughter. I can only find one Hannah carrington baptised in ardleigh. I'll look in the other parishes.

Then in 1891 she says she was born in 1852.
Couldn't see 1901 or 1911. What date does she give there?

If I can find hannah and Edward's marriage on the parish registers, I can find Hannah's father, which will rule in or out Jonathan.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 21 May 17 23:08 BST (UK)
Can't find Hannah and Edwards marriage. Have searched: ardleigh, arlesford, bradfield, Colchester, Dedham, elmstead, great and little Bentley, great and little Bromley, Langham, Langford, manningtree, mistletoe, Tendring, Thorpe Le soken, thorrington, Wesley, west bergholt.

These are all in Colchester registration district as far as I can see.

Might be worth getting hold of the marriage cert to find out who Hannah's father is?
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Monday 22 May 17 09:47 BST (UK)
sending for marriage cert today "Colchester July q 1884 vol 4a page 557", I cannot find them either after 1881 census. thanks again nannyj, Eva Carrington was the G/Grandmother of my daughter inlaw
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Monday 22 May 17 10:43 BST (UK)
Ok. Let me know what you find and we can see how far back we can get with the parish records.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Monday 22 May 17 18:47 BST (UK)
sending for marriage cert today "Colchester July q 1884 vol 4a page 557", I cannot find them either after 1881 census. thanks again nannyj, Eva Carrington was the G/Grandmother of my daughter inlaw
kitman
You've got them on the 1891 census, yes?
Title: Re: ava carrington bNoirth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Monday 22 May 17 20:15 BST (UK)
yes have them as Edward and hannah butcher eva is with her as butcher age 13 no other children
no sign of her after that as yet,  there is a death for a Hannah butcher hampstead London 1898 ?
gives her date of BIRTH abt 1850, Eva married William Avenell DEC 1900
KITMAN
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Sunday 28 May 17 11:23 BST (UK)
Received marriage cert for Hannah Carrington age 29 to Edward Butcher age 27, date July-22-1884;
father Johnathon Carrington deceased, I have his death as 29 sep 1875 so it seems that Johnathan and Ann are her parents. I have their marriage as 6-may-1830 that would put her mother age about 51 when having Hannah, I note on the 1891 census there is a ann Carrington age 88 born Mayland ?
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 28 May 17 12:46 BST (UK)
Excellent. It did look like it was them. Will see what I can find on parish registers.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 28 May 17 13:10 BST (UK)
Jonathan carrington married Ann Hellen 6/5/1830 at ardleigh by banns. Witnesses Richard Hellen and Sarah carrington. Had first child in June, I think! Can't find my notes about Hannah's siblings, as am up at my dad's and they're at home.
Jonathan's parents were John carrington and joice Cooke (widow) 15/4/1800 in ardleigh. Will look out the birth for Ann in Mayland.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 28 May 17 13:29 BST (UK)
On 1851 & 1871 census she gives her place of birth as Mile End and in 1851 as Colchester. When I look at the parish records, there is a Mile End in Colchester, which is much nearer to ardleigh.
Mile End, Colchester: Ann Hellen of Richard and Sarah Hellen, born 29/9/1803 and baptised October.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 28 May 17 13:32 BST (UK)
On the 1871 census, Hannah is there with her brother John. She is 33 and he is 23. That would make Ann 35 and 45 having the two of them? There is a Hannah carrington baptised 1838 in ardleigh.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Sunday 28 May 17 14:03 BST (UK)
Richard Hellen and Sarah Stapleton married in Mile End, Colchester 6/3/1792. Witnesses Thomas Hellen and John Stapleton.
Sarah Stapleton born 19/10/1772 to John and Mary Stapleton in Mile End, Colchester.
Richard Hellen baptised 15/6/1768 in St James Colchester to Thomas and Sarah Hellen.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Monday 29 May 17 13:30 BST (UK)
thanks again for all the info on Carrington line nannyj; for Hannah giving different dates of birth through the census returns 1891 census with Edward she's 39, marriage cert to Edward butcher 1884 she's 29, I note a death 1838 Colchester Essex for a Hannah Carrington. I have to go at the moment with Hannah 1838 "parents Johnathon and Ann"  being Eva's mother. BMD INDEX give 3 Hannah Carrington's B Tendring 1838 1841 and 1842, better post this confusing myself here  ???
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Monday 29 May 17 13:44 BST (UK)
From what i can remember, they were different parents for Hannah. Will have a look when I get home. Currently on m25 (passenger obviously!)
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Monday 29 May 17 21:34 BST (UK)
Ok. Had a quick look again.
This is what I can see ...
Hannah carrington daughter of Jonathan and Anne was born in 1838 on the 1841, 1851, 1871 and 1881 censuses - can't find her on the 1861 census.
On the 1891 census with Edward she is 39 and he is 34. Does that tie in with the ages on the 1884 marriage?
Does the marriage certificate have a parish? Or an address for Edward and Hannah? Does Hannah's dad have an occupation?
P.s. The Hannah who is buried in 1838 is in Colchester. Jonathan and Anne baptised all their children in ardleigh, so would be surprised if they buried on in Colchester?
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Tuesday 30 May 17 11:10 BST (UK)
marriage 22-July-1884 at the register office Colchester living at maidenburgh street Colchester
father Johnathon Carrington deceased farmer; Edward age 27 bachelor, bricklayer, Hannah age 29 spinster no occupation; Edward's father Henry Butcher; It's Hannah giving her age as 29 that's putting me in a quandary,
kitman
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Tuesday 30 May 17 15:48 BST (UK)
I know what you mean. I just think she's lied/ got it wrong. Everything else ties in. Jonathan's occupation on baptisms was farmer. Can't see it can be anyone else.
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: kitman64 on Tuesday 30 May 17 18:37 BST (UK)
That's the only conclusion I can come to nannyj and the fact that Eva is her mother, many thanks for all your help and dates. I'm off to Newport Gwent registry office in the morning for birth cert of Annie Florence Bevan; got a post on the  Monmouthshire Board, "Whatever happened to Edward Bevan" well worth a look.
kitman 
Title: Re: ava carrington birth parents
Post by: nannyj on Tuesday 30 May 17 19:25 BST (UK)
Amazing the info you can get from being on here! Good luck.