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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Shropshire => Topic started by: tonyharrison on Wednesday 02 August 17 12:18 BST (UK)
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There are a number of Swains in this area and I've contacted a couple so far, with no result except a couple of leads to follow. I wonder if there are any Swains on this forum who hail from the Condover area? My maternal grandfather was Louis Swain, born at Cross Houses (his army record suggests, barely legible!) in probably June 1893 - on joining the army 31st August 1914 he gave his age as 21 years and 2 months. He'd married Ada Gibbons in Malpas, Cheshire (he worked as a butcher at Hampton nearby) on 5th January 1914, survived WW1 with a couple of wounds, and lived thereafter in Cheshire, dying in the 1970s.
The photo might help: my best guess is it dates from about 1910. Seated front is my great-grandfather William Swain, with his wife (said to have been Welsh, maybe called Rachel) standing behind. At the back, centre, stands my grandfather Louis; at the front seated are his brothers Archie (L) and Charlie (R) with their sister Esther; the other four brothers are Tom, Will, Jack and Hugh, though not necessarily in that order. Hugh was a lorry driver, my mother (aged 89) recalls, and later moved to Blackpool; Archie started a coal business - I was led to believe a spot on the OS map south of Shrewsbury, on the railway line adjacent to a signal box, was named Swain's Field because of his business located there; Charlie stayed near Condover and had one child, Arthur; Tom later on lived at Shawbury. My mother says she always understood her grandfather William Swain had a brother who started a haulage/transport business.
I've had no luck so far in finding any further information, but perhaps someone here can help.
Thanks - Tony
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Welcome to RootsChat! ;D
RootsChat has it's very own Surnames Interest Table :D Have you looked there?
Scroll down to the bottom of any RC page.
There, in the dark brown box, underneath the heading "Your Tools", you will find "Surname Interests".
Click on that and then go searching under "S" etc for Swain.
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https://familysearch.org
Name Louis Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 1891
County Shropshire
Parish Berrington
Ecclesiastical Parish BERRINGTON
Registration District Atcham
Residence Note Brampton Lane
Wm Swain Head M 30 Farm Labourer Shropshire, England
Eleanor Swain Wife F 35 Shropshire, England
Wm Swain Son M 6 Shropshire, England
Esther Jane Swain Daughter F 4 Shropshire, England
Louis Swain Son M 1 Shropshire, England
Name Lewis Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 31 Mar 1901
Event Place Upton Magna, Shropshire, England
County Shropshire
Civil Parish Upton Magna
Ecclesiastical Parish Upton Magna
Sub-District Condover
Registration District Atcham
William Swain Head M 40 STOCKMAN ON FARM Atcham, Salop
Elenor Swain Wife F 45 Parish N K, Montgomeryshire
Lewis Swain Son M 11 Uffington, Salop
Thomas Swain Son M 9 Uffington, Salop
David H Swain Son M 7 Preston Gubbulds, Salop
John E Swain Son M 5 Preston Gubbulds, Salop
Archie C Swain Son M 2 Albrighton Shrewsbury, Salop
Charles Swain Son M 0 Albrighton Shrewsbury, Salop
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Welcome to Rootschat Tony,
Birth Reg GRO Index
SWAIN, LOUIS, Mothers maiden name LEWIS****
GRO Reference: 1889 S Quarter in ATCHAM Volume 06A Page 622
Marriage Reg FreeBMD
June 1884, Oswestry, 61 1281
William SWAIN and Elenor LEWIS on same page
Esther Janes Husband was a Carter;
She married James Edward Albert Meredith 1912 in Lancashire
Not sure what you have so just a brief out-line;
William Swain 1861's Parents were WILLIAM/ELIZABETH nee MULLARD
Info from Edwards GRO Index Birth Reg;
1861 Census
William Swain 49
Elizabeth Swain 29
John Swain 4
Edward Swain 1
1871 Census
William Swain 59
Elizabeth Swain 40
John Swain 14
Edward Swain 12
WILLIAM Swain 10******
Sarah Swain 7
Mary I Swain 4
Emma Swain 1 Year, 6 Months
FreeBMD has a 1855 Marriage for Emma MULLARD but a male spouse is missing.
(he may be down as William Hiam)
Anyhow its the right Marriage as Familysearch.Org has;
5 August 1855, Oswestry, Shropshire, William SWAIN to Elizabeth MULLARD
Trish :)
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Alberbury, many thanks for this. It exemplifies a factor I'd already discovered in my initial researches: conflicting information. This is clearly my grandfather and his family, but here he's been born about 1890; the record of his marriage in 1914 at Malpas says he was aged 24, which matches; yet his military record, which I just checked, says his stated age on 31st August 1914 was 21 years 2 months... Nice to have confirmation that great-grandmother was indeed Welsh - my mother says she was thought to be rather fierce, chasing Louis and his brothers with a pig stick if they misbehaved!
KGarrad, thanks for the tip about surnames, which I'll try. Trish, ditto for the information about great-grandmother Lewis - I wonder if her maiden name has anything to do with a certain confusion over the spelling of my grandfather's forename.
Kind regards, Tony
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I would think her maiden name is the reason for the confusion over Louis/Lewis.
Just added a bit more to my other posting :)
They are a good looking Family.
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Trish, many thanks for your kindness. This extra info is valuable - I now know of another great-great-grandfather, born it seems in 1812! Married at 43 to a lady 19 years his junior, eh... Yes, my Swains picture is a good one, lucky to have it. They all look quite smart & prosperous so perhaps great-grandfather had progressed a bit from farm labourer.
Kind regards, Tony
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https://familysearch.org
Name William Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 1911
Event Place Upton Magna, , Shropshire, England
County Shropshire
Parish Upton Magna
Sub-District Condover
Registration District Atcham
William Swain Head M 50 COWMAN ON FARM Masebery, Shropshire
Elenor Swain Wife F 55 Mivod, Shropshire
Archie Swain Son M 12 Berrington, Shropshire
Charley Swain Son M 10 Upton Magna, Shropshire
Maesbury south of Oswestry
Meiford north-west of Welshpool
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https://familysearch.org
Name William Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 1911
Event Place Meifod, Meifod Welshpool, Montgomeryshire, Wales
County Montgomeryshire
Parish Meifod
Sub-District Llansantffraid
Registration District Llanfyllin
David Roberts Head M 56 Llansaintffraid, Montgomeryshire
Margaret Roberts Wife F 58 Llangyniew, Montgomeryshire
Harry Cureton Roberts Son M 25 Llansaintffraid, Montgomeryshire
Ada Louisa Roberts Daughter F 23 Llansaintffraid, Montgomeryshire
Maude Roberts Daughter F 22 Llansaintffraid, Montgomeryshire
Arthur Owen Roberts Son M 18 Llansaintffraid, Montgomeryshire
Doris Hilda M Roberts Daughter F 15 Llansaintffraid, Montgomeryshire
William Henry Lloyd Servant M 34 Llansaintffraid, Montgomeryshire
William Swain Servant M 26 single WAGGONER ON FARM Berington, Shropshire
I think this William is the son of William and Eleanor Swain on the 1891 census of Berrington. Also Eleanor might of been born in Meiford. Could William or Eleanor Swain be related to either David or Margaret Roberts.
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https://familysearch.org
Esther Jane Swain
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 21 November 1886 Berrington, Shropshire, England
residence: Berrington, Shropshire, England
father: William Swain
mother: Eleanor
Lewis Swain
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 28 July 1889 Berrington, Shropshire, England
residence: Berrington, Shropshire, England
father: William Swain
mother: Eleanor
Thomas Swain
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 21 June 1891 Berrington, Shropshire, England
residence: Berrington, Shropshire, England
father: William Swain
mother: Ellen
David Hugh Swain
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 1 October 1893 Berrington, Shropshire, England
residence: Berrington, Shropshire, England
father: William Swain
mother: Eleanor
John Edwards Swain
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 6 October 1895 Berrington, Shropshire, England
residence: Berrington, Shropshire, England
father: William Swain
mother: Ellenor
Name Archy Clement Swain
Event Type Birth Registration
Registration Quarter Apr-May-Jun
Registration Year 1898
Registration District Atcham
County Shropshire
Event Place Atcham, Shropshire, England
Volume 6A
Page 600
Line Number 90
John Edwards Swain. The middle name could give you clues to an earlier family.
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Alberbury, thanks again for this additional information. If you do this for everyone here you can't have time to eat or sleep! Re your suggestion about my great-uncle Jack Swain's second name, might not "Edwards" be a misprint for "Edward"? The records certainly contain plenty of those: my great grandmother's name is spelt variously Eleanor, Elenor and plain Ellen. Then there's the odd business of my grandfather Louis/Lewis* apparently understating his age on joining up - why would anyone do that? Most likely a clerical error by an army clerk. Re great-uncle Will(-iam) listed as part of the Roberts farming household at Llansantffraid in 1911, I suppose it's possible there was some sort of connection with his mother's being from Montgomeryshire.
Kind regards, Tony
*Grandfather's army records show his name clearly as "Louis" not "Lewis".
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You're Welcome Tony.
https://familysearch.org
Name William Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 1881
Event Place Oswestry (Rural Part), Shropshire, England
Registration District Oswestry
Gender Male
Age 26
Marital Status (Original) Single
William Swain Head M 63 Ponsbury, Shropshire, England
Elizabeth Swain Wife F 49 Ponsbury, Shropshire, England
Emma Swain Daughter F 12 Maesbury, Shropshire, England
Sarah Mullard Mother F 77 Pontsbury, Shropshire, England :)
William Swain Son M 26 Farm Labourer Maesbury, Shropshire, England
Name William Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 1871
Event Place Maesbury, Maesbury, Shropshire, England
William Swain Head M 59 Labourer Shropshire
Elizabeth Swain Wife F 40 Pontesbury, Shropshire
John Swain Son M 14 Maesbury, Shropshire
Edward Swain Son M 12 Maesbury, Shropshire
William Swain Son M 10 Maesbury, Shropshire
Sarah Swain Daughter F 7 Maesbury, Shropshire
Mary I Swain Daughter F 4 Maesbury, Shropshire
Emma Swain Daughter F 1 Maesbury, Shropshire
Name William Swain
County Shropshire
Event Type Census
Event Date 1861
Event Place Maesbury, Shropshire, England
Ecclesiastical Parish Trinity Church
Registration District Oswestry
Residence Note Marsh Lane
William Swain Head M 40 Lead Farmer Man Pontesbury, Shropshire
Elizabeth Swain Wife F 24 Pontesbury, Shropshire
John Swain Son M 4 Oswestry, Shropshire
Edward Swain Son M 1 Oswestry, Shropshire
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https://familysearch.org
Name William Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 1851
Event Place Pontesbury, Shropshire, England
Registration District Atcham
Gender Male
Age 39
Marital Status Wr
William Swain Head M 39 Labourer Worthen, Salop
Ann Swain Daughter F 13 Pontesbury, Salop
Richard Swain Son M 9 Pontesbury, Salop
Elizabeth Swain Daughter F 7 Pontesbury, Salop
Hannah Swain Sister F 32 Pontesbury, Salop
Emma Swain Niece F 1 Pontesbury, Salop
Name William Swain
Event Type Census
Event Date 1841
Event Place Pontesbury, Shropshire, England
Residence Note Church Street
William Swain M 29-33 Shropshire
Elizabeth Swain F 26-30 Shropshire
Ann Swain F 3 Shropshire
William Swain
England Marriages, 1538–1973
marriage: 5 June 1837 Pontesbury, Shropshire, England
spouse: Elizabeth Gittoes
Anne Swaine
England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
christening: 9 May 1838 PONTESBURY, SHROPSHIRE, ENGLAND
father: William Swaine
mother: Elizabeth
I would check all these records from the local archives at Shrewsbury or findmypast.
At the moment this is just guess work.
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Further thanks, Alberbury - it starts to become a little confusing when one finds people with the same name and apparently the same age marrying on two occasions four years apart in the same place! This is the case with great-uncle William Swain... I can see that much comparing of records is necessary. It doesn't help that names and places are often spelled so differently.
Regards, Tony
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Hello Tony
There was a SWAIN family living in Condover in the 1950's when Mrs Swain was one of the cooks at the village school. They had at least one son but he moved out of Shropshire when he started work. There is at least one Swain family buried in the small cemetery at Condover.
With regard to the haulage business you are probably thinking of 'Swains of Stretton' which was located at Church Stretton for many years in the mid to late 1900's but has now relocated. Their former yard is now a housing estate and the road is named Swain's Meadow. If you do a search on the Internet for Swains of Stretton you will find several entries, one of which has the heading 'A History of Road Transport' and this will tell you a bit about the company.
Mike
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Mike, many thanks for taking the trouble to tell me this. Yes, I've known about Swains of Stretton for some years, having passed their trucks a few times! I've spoken with the boss Scott Swain - though I think it's his son who runs things mainly these days. He put me onto his cousin and her sister, with whom I am now in touch: they've been doing a bit of family research. We agree it seems likely these two branches of the Swains are connected, though this has yet to be confirmed.
Regards, Tony
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Hi. I believe I may be linked up too. My grandfather was Harold Swain (born 1904) who hailed from Salop but lived in Bangor/Llanfairfechan. His father was Thomas W Swain (1875-1933).
Wendy
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Hi. I believe I may be linked up too. My grandfather was Harold Swain (born 1904) who hailed from Salop but lived in Bangor/Llanfairfechan. His father was Thomas W Swain (1875-1933).
Wendy
Hello Wendy - sorry for my tardy reply but I fiddle with family history only intermittently, and hadn't logged on for ages. I've checked my records, and among my own Swains of the appropriate generations, I find no Harold or Thomas. Sorry!
rgds Tony
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First time I've posted here in ages, but a very brief update...
My attempts to look into some Swains in the Condover area were thwarted, since I failed repeatedly to receive responses from some Swain descendants in that immediate area. Maybe they've died, or moved away; maybe (like so many are, disappointingly) just not sufficiently interested to bother. They don't care about their family history.
On the other hand I was contacted recently by a lady (hello Karen!) looking into some family history re Swains from the Oswestry area - this might well affect me, since my Swain great-grandfather (William Swain) was born in 1861 at Maesbury, near Oswestry.
It's hard going, not helped by the fact that I'm busy with other things and spend time abroad; still, new information is always welcome.
Regards, Tony