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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Lancashire => Topic started by: Marycav on Monday 04 September 17 13:03 BST (UK)

Title: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: Marycav on Monday 04 September 17 13:03 BST (UK)
After searching for years, hoping someone can help. John Daly born Liverpool 1889 is my Grandad, his mum is Elizabeth born 1854 Liverpool.
 It's  said she married William Daly. On Johns marriage cert says Father's name John. On Cencus Elizabeth is a widow, 1901 & 1911. John's siblings are Louisa 1879 and William 1880. I can't find any record of Elizabeth's, birth or marriage, lots of family's with same names, but working backwards from my information they don't fit.  Known to have died 1930. Would be grateful of any information. Mary x
 
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 16:45 BST (UK)
If this is his birth reg then his mothers maiden name was Murphy

Births March qtr 1889      
John   Daly     Liverpool    8b   71

However see below

Births March qtr 1879 
Louisa Daly West Derby    8b   479   Mothers maiden name was Maylor

Births September qtr 1880 
William Daly      Liverpool    8b   63   Mothers maiden name was Fitzgibbon

Have you found the family on the 1891 census?

Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 16:52 BST (UK)
Full 1901 entry - all born liverpool - all Daly's shown as lodgers

Joseph Matthews   22
Louisa Matthews   22
Mary Matthews   4
Louisa Matthews   2
Elizabeth Daly   47 mother in law
William Daly   21
John Daly   11
RG13 Piece 3472 Folio 73 Page 12

Joseph & Louisa married 1897 - RC marriage as www.lancashirebmd.org.uk shows it as a registrar attended or civil marriage
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 17:01 BST (UK)
1881 shown as Daley

William Daley   43 b Ireland
Elizabeth     36 b Liverpool
Louisa     2       ditto
William T   3mths b Bootle
RG11 Piece 3684 Folio 141 Page 39

Births March qtr 1881 
William Thomas   Daley     West Derby    8b   480  mothers maiden name MAYLOR
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 17:03 BST (UK)
William Thomas Daley mmn Maylor, birth reg Mar qtr 1881 West Derby
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: trish1120 on Monday 04 September 17 17:06 BST (UK)
wrong one, deleted :-[
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 17:07 BST (UK)
I don't think John was Elizabeths son - here is the 1891 entry and no John shown.  The Daly's are lodgers

Dennis Heragan   50
Margaret Heragan   44
Dennis Heragan   16
Ann Heragan   26
Elizabeth Daly   40
Elizabeth Daly   16
William Daly   12
RG12 Piece 2906 Folio 43 Page 8
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 17:15 BST (UK)
If this is his birth reg then his mothers maiden name was Murphy

Births March qtr 1889      
John   Daly     Liverpool    8b   71


This corresponds to a Catholic baptism at Holy Cross, Liverpool (the register is in Latin):

Baptised 22 Dec 1888

Johannes [John] Daly, born 11 Dec 1888

Parents: Joseph Daly and Francesca (Frances/Fanny?) formerly Murphy.

Godmother: Maria [Mary] Daly.

Added: The register also shows a David born to the same parents 31 Mar 1885 and baptised 6 Apr 1885.  Its margin annotations show that David later married Eugenia Jane Reilly at the church of St Bernard, Mt Lebanon, PA. www.stbernardchurchpgh.org
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 17:26 BST (UK)
If this is his birth reg then his mothers maiden name was Murphy

Births March qtr 1889      
John   Daly     Liverpool    8b   71


This corresponds to a Catholic baptism at Holy Cross, Liverpool (the register is in Latin):

Baptised 22 Dec 1888

Johannes [John] Daly, born 11 Dec 1888

Parents: Joseph Daly and Francesca (Frances/Fanny?) formerly Murphy.

Godmother: Maria [Mary] Daly.

Added: The register also shows a David born to the same parents 31 Mar 1885 and baptised 6 Apr 1885.  Its margin annotations show that David later married Eugenia Jane Reilly at the church of St Bernard, Mt Lebanon, PA. www.stbernardchurchpgh.org

If this is the right family, it appears that Frances Daly also emigrated; she, as his mother, was David Daly's "nearest relative" on his WW1 draft registration.  Both were residing at Millvale, Allegheny, Pennsylvania.
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 17:30 BST (UK)
Quote
After searching for years, hoping someone can help. John Daly born Liverpool 1889 is my Grandad, his mum is Elizabeth born 1854 Liverpool.
It's  said she married William Daly. On Johns marriage cert says Father's name John.

How do you know John was born 1889 and how do you know his mother was Elizabeth?

Do you know for certain her had a sister Louisa and a brother William or is that supposition from the 1901 entry?

Words like "it's said she married William Daly" need to be supported by facts otherwise you end up researching completely the wrong family

Who did John marry and when,  as you say his marriage cert shows his father as John.  What was father John's occupation on the marriage cert and who were the witnesses to the marriage?

Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 17:32 BST (UK)
OK I think the Joseph Daly & Frances Murphy/Pennsylvania link is a red herring (sorry).

This looks likely to be the correct birth registration:

John DALEY mmn MAYLOR, Sep qtr 1889 West Derby.
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 17:36 BST (UK)
So we now have a link to Louisa and William - well done Anna
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 17:42 BST (UK)
Also:

Ellen Daley mmn Maylor, Jun qtr 1883 West Derby - buried aged 4mo at Ford Cemetery, 22 Aug 1883*
John Daley mmn Maylor, Jun qtr 1883 West Derby - buried aged 4mo at Ford Cemetery, 29 Jul 1883*
George Daley mmn Maylor, Sep qtr 1885 West Derby - buried aged 4mo at Ford Cemetery, 14 Oct 1885

* The abode listed on each of the twins' burials was 92 Bal(l)iol Rd.
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 17:49 BST (UK)
deleted
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 17:53 BST (UK)
I can't find a Daley/Daly marriage to a Maylor/Mayler
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 17:57 BST (UK)
I can't find a Daley/Daly marriage to a Maylor/Mayler

1881 shows William as 47 and Elizabeth as 36 with the two young children - perhaps one or both had been married before?
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: CaroleW on Monday 04 September 17 18:04 BST (UK)
My thoughts to but Elizabeth is 40 in 1891 and 47 in 1901.

I think the 1889 John Daley birth cert may be needed to confirm his father was William.  If it was - then it does not support the name John as his father on his marriage cert

We really need some answers to the questions I raised earlier as I would expect John to be with Elizabeth in 1891 but he isn't although her older children are.
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 18:20 BST (UK)
Elizabeth is enumerated as a widow in 1891.  Possible Catholic burials for William therefore:

William Daly aged 43 (R Infirmary), 5 March 1882 Ford Cemetery
William Daley aged 49 (Liverpool Workhouse), 15 October 1890 Ford Cemetery.

The first one could obviously not have fathered any of the post 1881 children found (John & Ellen, George, John). 

The second one therefore looks much more likely.  John born 1889 would not have remembered him so perhaps that is why the father's name doesn't match on his later marriage details.
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 18:24 BST (UK)
We really need some answers to the questions I raised earlier as I would expect John to be with Elizabeth in 1891 but he isn't although her older children are.

The daughter with her in 1891 is Elizabeth, 16 b Liverpool.  So I wonder whether this is Louisa b 1879 in disguise, or another daughter we didn't see in 1881?
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: Marycav on Monday 04 September 17 19:39 BST (UK)
Cant thank you all enough, john born last quarter ties in with army records. I have been following Maylor family, they had a daughter Sarah Ann always wondered if she was Elizabeths Mum. Johns dad was Labourer on marriage cert. John Daly married Rebecca Chambers 1911. So delighted to see Maylor as mm name for all 3    children. Have never had proof of   this before. Could i ask if dads  names are all the same ? Thank  you All so much  Mary x Have just seen more replies, i have never thought the cencus 1891 to be correct, as have no proof of Elizabeth as daughter. Louisa and William are only a year apart in age. I also find Elizabeth's age a mystery. In 1911 cencus she is 59. 1881 cencus 36 ? Born 1854.  x
Title: Re: Liverpool great grandmother.
Post by: avm228 on Monday 04 September 17 20:07 BST (UK)
We can't tell you what any of the Dal(e)y/Maylor children's birth certificates say about the name of their father, as that information will only appear on the certificate which you would need to order.