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Scotland (Counties as in 1851-1901) => Scotland => Lanarkshire => Topic started by: acurtis on Thursday 12 October 17 23:48 BST (UK)
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Please bear with me as I'm very new to this - but I have reason to believe my maternal great grandmother, Josephine Helen Showell Carter (maiden Clark or Clarke) was born in Lanarkshire Scotland on or around October 7, 1893. I'm finding conflicting details regarding spelling of her various names, as well as her parents. I believe their names were James William Clark/Clarke and Helen Hastie/Hasting.
If it helps narrow it down at all, she married my Great Grandfather Roy William Carter on June 2, 1915 in Fredericton, New Brunswick (CANADA)
Any details you could provide would be amazing! I have a family tree started on Ancestry and have only recently started tracing my roots as I am an adult adoptee.
Thank you in advance for any and all assistance :)
April
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Could this be the one?
CLARK
JOSEPHINE HELEN
F
1893
649/ 277
Lesmahagow
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That is very possible - What is the info below the birth year?
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It's the index number 649/277 .
Birth registered in Lesmahagow, Lanarkshire
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Hi April ,
There's a marriage on Scotlandspeople for a James Clarke / Helen Hastie , 1893 , Lanark Lanark(shire).
ev
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This could be a possible record 1901 census address Kirkfield Bank Lesmahagow
Mary Ann Hastie age 49 born Carlow Ireland
Helen Clarke ( Hastie ) age 24 born Glasgow
Emma Clarke age 3 born Lesmahagow
Annette Clarke age 11 months born Lesmahagow
No sign of the father or Josephine but there is a Josephine Clarke age 8 as inmate at Camlachie on the 1901 census along with a Caroline Clarke age 7 ?
If you get a copy of the birth certificate as anne-p has posted it will confirm the parents names
Rosie
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Adding this , needs to be checked but looks relevant -
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/genealogy/records/james-clarke_123184061
ev
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Looks like the same family ev ...
There is a birth Scotlands People for Helen Maria Agnes Hastie 1877 Bridgeton Lanarkshire
Death for Helen Maria A Hastie other surname Clarke ..1947 Townhead Glasgow age 70
This could also be a possible record for Emma Clarke age 4 with a group of other children going to Canada arrival date 27 February 1904 ship Bavarian
Rosie
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From the free index -
1911 Census , St Rollox , Lanark , 644/8 26/ 10
Helen Clarke 34
Josephine Clarke 17
Caroline Clarke 15
Helen Clarke 9
ev
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18 yr old Caroline Clarke emigrated to Canada in 1913 aboard the Cassandra
Departure 28 Jun 1913 Glasgow.
Arrival 8 Jul 1913 Quebec
Her destination was Manitoba.
No contact details on either outgoing or arrival document
It seems she married Patrick McAnulty in Winnipeg, Manitoba on 1 Nov 1913
By 1921 in Manitoba, they have a 2yr old child, named Caroline McAnulty born Scotland
Could this be her?
MCANULTY
CAROLINE MOORE
F
1919
644/19 323
Shettleston
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Yes did see that record for Caroline Clarke but several tree's have different parent's ???
Rosie
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Annette married and died in Renfrewshire:
Marriage
CLARK
ANNETTE
FURIE
ROBERT
1943
572/1 9
Neilston
Folllowing death shows that Annette must have been in her 40's when she married in 1943
CLARK
ANNETTE
85
HASTIE (Mother's maiden name)
1985
649/ 195
Barrhead
Same index No
FURIE
ANNETTE
85
HASTIE ( Mother's maiden name)
1985
649/ 195
Barrhead
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Yes did see that record for Caroline Clarke but several tree's have different parent's ???
Rosie
Have you looked closely at some of them?
One states that Caroline born was born in 1895 to a mother born in 1806?
Another is a mess and looks like it was based on impossible, random folk all joined up.
She apparently had siblings older than her parents and none share the name Clark?
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Yes did see that record for Caroline Clarke but several tree's have different parent's ???
Rosie
Have you looked closely at some of them?
One states that Caroline born was born in 1895 to a mother born in 1806?
Another is a mess and looks like it was based on impossible, random folk all joined up.
She apparently had siblings older than her parents and none share the name Clark?
Yes I did a bit of a mess I would say ;D ;D ;D
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There are only 2 potential births for a
Caroline Clarke/Clark over a 5yr period from 1895
One was born in Rothesay the other was:
Caroline Frances Clarke born 1895 and registered in Camlachie
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April, in the enthusiasm to find your family, we seem to have forgotten to tell you that you can view some* of the original Scottish birth, marriage and death certificates online, and download them, at modest cost. Go to www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk, buy a few credits and use them to pay for the certificates you need to see. You'll need 6 credits for each certificate.
*Births over 100 years ago, marriages over 75 years ago and deaths over 50 years ago.
And never, never, ever trust anything you find online unless it's an image of an original document. In particular, online trees, while they can be useful pointers, cannot be relied on to be correct.
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Thank you for this! I was able to find her birth registry via this link you provided - see attachment!
It is so exciting to see real proof - otherwise we are going deeper into a rabbit hole of information lol
Now to figure out how/when her family came to Canada - will be tracing some of the other details provided above - Thank you EVERYONE!
April, in the enthusiasm to find your family, we seem to have forgotten to tell you that you can view some* of the original Scottish birth, marriage and death certificates online, and dowload them, at modest cost. Go to www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk, buy a few credits and use them to pay for the certificates you need to see. You'll need 6 credits for each certificate
*Births over 100 years ago, marriages over 75 years ago and deaths over 50 years ago.
And never, never, ever trust anything you find online unless it's an image of an original document. In particular, online trees, while they can be useful pointers, cannot be relied on to be correct.
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Glad you found it.
As you can see, her parents names and their marriage date are included.
A marriage cert will provide names for both sets of parents
I would not be surprised if her mother, Helen Hastie was the daughter of William James Hastie and Mary Ann Wilson who married in Glasgow 1874. Registered in Bridgeton
1881:
45 Tobago St, Glasgow
George Wilson 53 born Kilmarnock
Ellen Wilson 55 Born Ireland Wife
Helen Wilson 28 B Ireland Daughter
Georgina Wilson 22 B Edinburgh Daughter
Marianno Hastie 29 B Ireland. Daughter..(Mistranscription of Mary Ann?)
Thomas G Hastie 6 Grandson B Glasgow
**Helen M A Hastie 4 Grand daughter B Glasgow
** Georgina Wilson b 22 Sep 1858 in Edinburgh**
Parents: George Wilson and Ellen Coghlan
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Linnville https://scotlandsplaces.gov.uk/digital-volumes/ordnance-survey-name-books/lanarkshire-os-name-books-1858-1861/lanarkshire-volume-44/31
Then http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17&lat=55.6744&lon=-3.8198&layers=6&b=1
Now http://www.geograph.org.uk/gridref/NS8543
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Previously posted by Rosie
1901 Kirkfieldbank, Lanark
Mary Ann Hastie age 49 born Carlow Ireland
Helen Clarke ( Hastie ) age 24 born Glasgow
Emma Clarke age 3 born Lesmahagow
Annette Clarke age 11 months born Lesmahagow
I am beginning to wonder about this?
I have no doubt that this is Helen Clarke Ms Hastie but, perhaps I have misidentified daughter Caroline after all?
CLARKE
CAROLINA SOULI
F
1895
649/2 32
Kirkfieldbank
CLARKE
AMELIA TRITCHLE Could this be Emma?
F
1897
649/2 37
Kirkfieldbank
CLARKE
ANNETTE
F
1900
649/2 18
Kirkfieldbank
Edit:
Caroline Frances Clarke b 1895 in Camlachie that I mentioned earlier, also died in 1895 .
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CLARKE
AMELIA TRITCHLE Could this be Emma?
F
1897
649/2 37
Kirkfieldbank
I would say so Anne . ...You could be right about the marriage for Caroline but April would need to try and get a copy of the marriage certificate ...Not finding immigration record for Josephine ???
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I was able to locate a marriage certificate for James and Helen.
It's quite difficult to read, but yet another piece of the puzzle.
See attached
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It's quite difficult to read, but yet another piece of the puzzle.
I've seen worse!
Any time you get a certificate or census you really can't read, report it to SP using the link on the web site and they will send you an improved version.
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That confirms the parent's then if you have any credits left you should maybe look for them in the 1911 census to see if Helen the mother is widowed ..
Forgot to say Welcome to Rootschat April :)
Rosie
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I can't thank you all enough for your help! I've definitely been steered in the correct direction :)
Now to work on determining on how the family (and which parts of the family) made their way to Canada in time for my great grandmother to marry in 1915.
Again, thank you! I'm sure I'll be asking more questions in the future and will spend some time searching out your database here!
April
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Still not having much luck finding a suitable immigration record ??? ..Would interesting to see what you find :)
Good Luck Rosie
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Found an application for poor relief for your family held at the Mitchell Library in Glasgow and will send you a pm with details
Janie
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Hi,
I am Charlene Best, My mother was Carole M Mc Anulty...Great grand daughter of Caroline, who you are looking for information on.
Where and how are we related?
Char
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Hi April, I've just come across your post this evening as I've just started looking into our family ancestry. Annette(Clarke) Furie was my gran who would have been Josephine's sister. We have my Nana's birth certificate and the census of 1901 shows Carter's living at the same address as Nana. My mum is also sure there was a sister Caroline. I also have downloaded the marriage cert for James Clarke and Helen Hastie if you need a copy.
Scott.