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Research in Other Countries => Immigrants & Emigrants - General => Topic started by: Lesanne on Friday 01 December 17 18:29 GMT (UK)

Title: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Friday 01 December 17 18:29 GMT (UK)
 Help please finding James Henry Holmes born Aug 1855 in Scutari (info from service record)..
When /how did he come into England to marry Rhoda Isabelle Wiiliams  (1878 Decq Tendring Esx).

TIA
Lesanne
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: crisane on Friday 01 December 17 18:57 GMT (UK)
In 1861 he is in the Channel Isles
Military Hospital Fort Regent St Helier Jersey
James Henry Holmes , age   4 Scatare Constantinople Turkey
Father-  Henry Holmes age 32 Sergeant in charge (can't read occupation) born Albany Barracks Isle of Wight
Mother - Mary Holmes age 30 born Ireland
Niece - Mary Kilpatrick age 5 born Leeds yorkshire.
Brother - Charles George Holmes age 2 born Beggars Bush ? Barracks Dublin

So a small time frame to look for the family's return to the UK




Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Friday 01 December 17 20:02 GMT (UK)
Well done crisane, thank you, very much.
 :D


Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: JJen on Friday 01 December 17 20:31 GMT (UK)
James' father's Service record is available on FindMyPast. He served 1 ½ years in Turkey.

JJ
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Sunday 03 December 17 13:27 GMT (UK)
Thank you JJ.. will look that up.
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: dathai on Wednesday 13 December 17 18:03 GMT (UK)
Charles George 1859
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01l63/

edited to add
baptism 17th Jan 1859 at Haddington Road Church
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000633834#page/133/mode/1up
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Thursday 14 December 17 05:37 GMT (UK)
Thank you Dathai. Another piece to the jigsaw. Charles is with Henry and Mary (poss nee Green) in census.
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Thursday 14 December 17 09:18 GMT (UK)
1881 RG11; Piece: 1781; Folio: 59; Page: 12;
Is this Rhoda on her own, listed as Rhoda J but I think it is Rhoda I Holmes
aged 28 living Harwich wife of ship steward born Kent

Louisa Maud
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Thursday 14 December 17 09:30 GMT (UK)
IF I am correct it looks as if there were at least 2 children born
MMN Williams
Walter Charles Lancelot born 1883 Tendring

Leonard  Alan Raymond born 1889 London

Louisa Maud
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Thursday 14 December 17 09:54 GMT (UK)
Thank you Louisa Maud.
Yes to the above boys and another one Francis Henry Neville b 1881 Tendring.
 Haven't found anymore, yet.
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Thursday 14 December 17 10:02 GMT (UK)
Louisa Maud.. well there is this one...
 HOLMES, REGINALD  ARTHUR ERNEST    MMN WILLIAMS 
GRO Reference: 1884  D Quarter in PORTSEA ISLAND  Volume 02B  Page 450

This one takes on another surname! Kearnes.

I'm waiting on a Will of a James Henry Holmes d 1896 (Thomas J Kearnes is named)
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Thursday 14 December 17 12:26 GMT (UK)
1891 and 1901 they are in Southwark

Looks as if poor Rhoda spent some time in Lambeth workhouse, possible death 1919

Leonard looks as if he spent time in the first world war?

Louisa Maud
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Thursday 14 December 17 14:44 GMT (UK)
Wilfrid George Isodor Holmes
bapt 18/11/1891
Christ Church Southwark
of James and Rhoda
of Peabody buildings Blackfriars Road
occ Clerk

Louisa Maud
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Thursday 14 December 17 15:07 GMT (UK)
2 sons missing from 1891 census with Rhoda appear to be in Aldershot army corps
shown a nephews to Thomas Joseph REARNS, officer, is this your KEARNES  shown in will?

namely
Wilfrid (Charles isidor) Holmes
Reginald (Arthur Ernest) Holmes


Louisa Maud
PS I believe Thomas Joseph Kearn(e)s  was a military man, although the 2 sons were shown as "nephews" so far I cannot see a connection, Thomas Joseph  and his wife Haidee I were adopted aunt and uncle
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Friday 15 December 17 09:16 GMT (UK)
Thank you Louisa Maud. I hadn't found Wilfred :)

 Haidee Ida Holmes was born Canada to Henry Holmes and Mary Green.
 She married Thomas Joseph Kearnes.

Sister to James Henry and Rhoda.

There is this, which shows a complication to Reg A E Holmes/Kearnes.
http://www.margatecivicsociety.org.uk/Birchington%20War%20Memorial%20WWI%20Roll%20of%20Honour.pdf
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Friday 15 December 17 09:21 GMT (UK)
http://www.brothersofbirchington.org.uk/history/

This is Haidee Ida (Holmes) Kearnes buying land in memory of Thomas Joseph Kearnes.
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Friday 15 December 17 10:27 GMT (UK)
There only appears to be  a birth registered and a baptism for Wilfrid George Isidor HOLMES
Sept qtr1891  St Saviours ref 1d 70, no other info on him, wonder if he went under the name of George

LM
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Friday 15 December 17 10:57 GMT (UK)
Found bapt Nov 1891 under Wilfrid ..
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Friday 15 December 17 12:33 GMT (UK)
My mistake but I cannot find him at all other than baptism or registration, well at least we know he existed

LM
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: ShaunJ on Friday 15 December 17 13:06 GMT (UK)
Just to mention, as no-one else has, that Scutari was a  British Army barracks and (famously) a military hospital during the Crimean War 1854-1856.

Florence Nightingale was there from November 1854. Henry Holmes & family will have been there at the same time. As Henry later became a Hospital Sergeant it seems likely that he served in the hospital alongside Florence Nightingale.

See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Selimiye_Barracks
http://www.florence-nightingale-avenging-angel.co.uk/scutari.htm
http://hekint.org/2017/02/22/scutari-crimean-war-hospital/
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Friday 15 December 17 13:27 GMT (UK)
That is interesting Shaun

LM
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Friday 15 December 17 16:44 GMT (UK)
Thank you Louisa and Shaun.
 Yes it gets more interesting as we find more.
 
https://www.nam.ac.uk/explore/battle-balaklava

Must check Henry again to see if he was here at this time.
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: ShaunJ on Friday 15 December 17 17:14 GMT (UK)
Reading Henry's discharge papers, it looks like he was "in possession of the Crimean  medal with 3 clasps for Alma, Inkerman, and Sebastopol, and the Turkish medal,. Also the Distinguished Medal + gratuity of £5 for ? sortie 26th October 1854 "

He is on the Distinguished Conduct Medal list for service in Crimea.
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Friday 15 December 17 18:06 GMT (UK)
Have you got a sheet for comparison, £5 what it would be worth today, a  fantastic amount me thinks
LM
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Friday 15 December 17 23:32 GMT (UK)
Wow   :D
... 26th ..  was the day after the Battle of Balaklava, including the Charge of the Light Brigade
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: louisa maud on Saturday 16 December 17 08:06 GMT (UK)
That was a lot of money in those days, she married a man of means.
The will  will be interesting

Louisa Maud
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 16 December 17 08:18 GMT (UK)
Quote
Father-  Henry Holmes age 32 Sergeant in charge (can't read occupation) born Albany Barracks Isle of Wight

The occupation is "Sergeant Army Hospital Corps, Hospital Sergeant 30th Regiment"

See http://www.army.mod.uk/medical-services/30000.aspx :

"This neglect culminated in the disastrous medical scandal of the Crimean War when provision of medical support were entrusted to members of the wealthy and aristocratic classes who regarded soldiering as a hobby, wore highly exotic uniforms and gave no thought to the medical or logistic support to the army. As a consequence the responsibility fell to "Civil Departments" who were largely untrained in war.

Emerging from this fiasco was the formation in 1855 of "The Medical Staff Corps" composed of "...men able to read and write, of regular habits and good temper and of a kindly disposition". In 1857 the Medical Staff Corps was reorganised into the "Army Hospital Corps" a title it held until 1884 when it reverted to its former name.

Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Saturday 16 December 17 13:19 GMT (UK)
https://archive.org/stream/medalsbritishar01cartgoog#page/n110/mode/2up/search/Holmes

Francis George Holmes is coming up in search but no Henry Holmes.
Is this because he is in the hospital, I wonder?
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 16 December 17 14:07 GMT (UK)
I can't find him in that book either but the action on 26th October 1854 is described at the bottom of page 158 - see the citations for Sgt T Shaw  and Private J Andrews  re the capture of a Russian mounted officer at the sortie - that's the word I couldn't make out in Henry's army discharge papers.

Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Saturday 16 December 17 14:20 GMT (UK)
page 36 descript of Sortie 26th October.   https://archive.org/stream/medalsbritishar01cartgoog#page/n54/mode/2up
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: ShaunJ on Saturday 16 December 17 16:13 GMT (UK)
I think the book you need to find is "Recipients of the Distinguished Conduct Medal, 1855-1909" by PE Abbott
Title: Re: HOLMES, James Henry to Harwich Essex from Scutari
Post by: Lesanne on Saturday 16 December 17 16:38 GMT (UK)
Hmmm, yes, me too.. saw that last night £28 - £68 and no online version :(
 Hope someone has it in their library