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Old Photographs, Recognition, Handwriting Deciphering => Free Photo Restoration & Date Old Photographs => Topic started by: Microscopia on Wednesday 20 December 17 11:48 GMT (UK)
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Apologies in advance for the poor quality of the photograph.
However, they say the best camera is the one you have with you at the time, unfortunately in this case it was an ageing mini-iPad at the time I was shown some documents and photos, one of which was this tintype, presumably of some of my ancestors.
If anyone can help date the photo, together with any other useful observations however small, will all help in identifying the possible names. I am unable to provide any further information than what is shown here, only to say that it would have been taken in the Staffordshire Potteries area or immediate vicinity.
Lawrence
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Just photo enhancement attempt
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Hello Microscopia, I am not an expert, just an amateur observer but it looks like a mother with
her 2 daughters. She is holding the hand of the girl beside her and the girl in the rear has her
hands on the shoulders of the 2 in front of her, so all are likely to be related. Both girls are dressed similarly and the jabot style tie at the neck of the dresses will possibly indicate the era
the photo was taken, late 1860's or early 1870's maybe. Lovely photo.
Regards,
Jen.
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loord74 thanks for the photo enhancement, it certainly reveals their facial expressions more.
Jen It’s amazing how someone else notices things that another person does not, or takes for granted, like the hands on the shoulders you mentioned - thanks for your observations and suggested date.
Lawrence
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Another version.
I agree with Jen about the date and relationships. And the girls appear close in age, only a year or so apart, could even be twins.
Peter
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Definitely 1870's. Tintypes weren't universally popular & were short lived so I would suggest early-mid decade. It might also be worth mentioning that these were positives as there was no negative used so the image is in reverse.
It's possible this was taken in a booth rather than a studio.
This is how they would have looked.
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Peter thanks for the Info and photo enhancement. I like the wallpaper effect!
Jim1 thanks for explanation about the tintype photos and narrowing the date down a bit. This has also narrowed down the identity to a particular family.
It's looking good for a match, but before I'm completely happy with it, an approximation of their ages would be appreciated (I am terrible at judging female ages). If these estimations tie in with the ages given on the 1871 Census for the family I think they're from, then I will be reasonably satisfied about the identity. I won't give the family name and address on the 1871 Census until afterwards, as I wouldn't wish to influence their age estimations ;)
Lawrence
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Because of the damage/fading in the photos, leaving little detail/texture, it is difficult to judge the mother's age. I'd guess about 30, but if you needed her to be a young 40 that wouldn't be impossible. The girls, based on size, I'd say 10-ish, give or take a year or so.
Hope this is of some help.
Peter
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The children I would say are about 10 & 12.
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I would go with Jim's estimate...give or take a year.
Carol
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Thanks to everyone for the help given so far.
As promised here is the family, or rather part of the family, I believe is shown in the tintype photo.
Other supporting evidence, not previously given, is that the photo along with other documents and another photo, which I will be shortly posting on the forum were shown to me as being the effects from my late Uncle, who along with my late Father were Grandsons of Richard Simcock & Elizabeth Wilshaw (the older Daughter who I believe is seen standing behind her Mother in the tintype photo. See also marriage cert. below).
I may of course be completely wrong with this, but I believe the tintype photo was taken approx. 1872 and shows the Mother, Mary Ann Wilshaw (nee Curzon) age 39, and two of her Daughters, Charlotte Wilshaw (seated) age 9, and Elizabeth Wilshaw (standing) age 11. All of course give or take a year.
Elizabeth Wilshaw (standing) eventually married Richard Simcock (see marriage cert below) and were parents to my Grandmother (Martha Anne Simcock) and a Son named William Simcock. The tintype photo was accompanied by a memorial headstone photo and another photo (which I previously mentioned) of William Simcock who emigrated along with some of his other Sisters to the USA in the 1920's, where he was eventually buried.
These are the Census records for this family (note the age discrepancy for James Wilshaw):
1861 Census: Stanley Moor, Bagnall, Staffordshire
James Wilshaw. Head. Married. Age 37. Boatman. Born Stoke on Trent, Staffordshire
Mary A Wilshaw. Wife. Age 28. Born Stoke on Trent, Staffordshire
Mary A Wilshaw. Daughter. Age 2. Born Stoke on Trent, Staffordshire
Joseph Bailer. Servant. Age 11. Servant. General Servant. Born Stoke on Trent, Staffordshire
1871 Census: Waterfall, Endon, Staffordshire
James Willshaw. Head. Married. Age 38. Labourer at Iron Works. Born Norton, Staffordshire
Mary Ann Willshaw. Wife. Age 38. Born Norton, Staffordshire
Elizabeth Willshaw. Daughter. Age 10. Born Norton, Staffordshire
Charlotte Willshaw. Daughter. Age 8. Born Norton, Staffordshire
Jane Willshaw. Daughter. Age 6. Born Norton, Staffordshire
James Willshaw. Son. Age 2. Born Norton, Staffordshire
1881 Census: Baddeley Green, Norton in the Moors, Leek, Staffordshire
James Wilshaw. Head. Married. Age 58. Occ. Lime Burner Born Stoke on Trent
Maryann Wilshaw. Wife. Married. Age 50. Born Shelton High Street
Jane Wilshaw. Daughter. Age 15. Born Stanley Mop, Staffordshire [Probably Stanley Moor]
James Wilshaw. Son. Age 12. Born Stanley Mop, Staffordshire [Probably Stanley Moor]
Note: Difficult identifying Maryann's correct first name as it's scribbled over and re-entered. It could be Maryann or Marion. This was where their daughter Elizabeth Wilshaw, Age 21, resided at the time of her wedding to Richard Simcock.
Marriage Cert: 12 April 1880: Parish Church, Norton-le-Moors, Stafford
Richard Simcock, Age 25, Bachelor, a Sticker, Resident at Common St., Shelton. Father's Name: Charles Simcock a Well-Sinker.
Elizabeth Wilshaw, Age 21, Spinster, Resident at Baddeley Green. Father's Name: James Wilshaw a Labourer.
Witnesses: James Mollart & Mary Mollart [See 1881 Census where John & Mary Mollart ages 63 & 66 resp. lived next door but one to Elizabeth Wilshaw's parents at Baddeley Green]
So here's the real test - if the tintype photo shows the Mother, as being Mary Ann Wilshaw (nee Curzon) at the age of 39, then she must be the same person as shown in the other two pictures, estimated to be some 11 years later when she was about 50 years old - what do you think?
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I'd say it was the same lady..It's the nose :)
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Sounds reasonable to me.
In the Potteries of course there was no shortage of fine artists who could do these portraits.
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It's a yes from me.
Carol
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Thank you all for your help, it's greatly appreciated.
Merry Christmas! :)
Lawrence