RootsChat.Com
Research in Other Countries => Australia => Topic started by: M S Harmer on Thursday 04 January 18 05:18 GMT (UK)
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Hi all.
I'm trying to help my brother in-law with his family tree but cannot find birth and marriage details for his g grandfather Joseph Francis Watts..
He was born abt 1870 , died 1943 in Pt Pirie S.A. Wife's name was Alice Dyer. According to S.A. birth records they had 10 children born between 1894 and 1910. Any and all help would be much appreciated.
Regards
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There is birth recorded for a Francis Joseph Watts
Births Mar 1869
Watts Francis Joseph Westbury, W. 5a 149
Mother's maiden name is Applegate
Most likely marriage
Marriages Mar 1868
Applegate Julia Ann Westbury 5a 206
Watts Francis John Westbury 5a 206
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Family Search shows a marriage between Francis Joseph Watts and a Maud Stanhope in 1928 in Cape Town, South Africa. They are both shown as born in England.
Is this a relation or someone completely different?
You don't say where your Joseph Francis Watts was born.
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He was born abt 1870 , died 1943 in Pt Pirie S.A. Wife's name was Alice Dyer. According to S.A. birth records they had 10 children born between 1894 and 1910. Any and all help would be much appreciated.
If you mean Port Pirie, South Australia, please say so to avoid (understandable) confusion with South Africa.
In what country was this man born/married?
Carol
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Sorry about that.Yes to south Australia. Birth records for their children say parents are Joseph Francis Watts and Alice Dyer
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Do not know where born could be another state. Aged 74 when he died so puts birth about 1870
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Are you absolutely certain he was born in Australia? If you're sure, hit 'Report to moderator' and ask for this to be moved to the Australia board.
Carol
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There is a lovely report of their 50th wedding anniversary in 1942 on Trove:
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article96315170
Joseph - youngest son of Thomas WATTS of Werocata Station and Alice daughter of William DYER also of Werocata, married 11 April 1892 at Whitwarta.
Modified to add:
genealogysa has their marriage record:
year-1892 reg no 171/105
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And an informative obituary for Francis in 1943:
http://nla.gov.au/nla.news-article96359466
born at Bowmans c1870
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Joseph Francis WATTS born 1870 with parents Thomas WATTS and Mary Ann GREHAM registered Adelaide 86/358.
Thomas WATTS and Mary GRAHAM married 1855 registered at Clare 24/60.
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My resource shows a little more information. The marriage was in the registration district of Clare not registered at Clare.
WATTS Thomas 26 years Status Single Father unrecorded [father's names not recorded in South Australia until 1856.]
GRAHAM Mary 20 years Status Single Father unrecorded
4 Dec 1855
At St Mark's Church, Penwortham District Clare Symbol A Book 24 Page 60
A. Amended Entry. The Purchased Certificate will differ slightly re clerical information
· Deduction of a Registration District
· Deduction of a year where a new year date confusion was detected.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penwortham,_South_Australia
Birth
WATTS Joseph Frances
28 Aug 1870
Father Thomas WATTS Mother Mary Ann GREHAM
At Port Wakefield District Adelaide Book 86 Page358
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Wakefield,_South_Australia
Cando
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From Biographical Index of South Australians. This appears to be a contributed entry. Only two births registered to Thomas and Mary on the SA birth indexes and possibly because there was a reluctance by sections of the community to register their chn births. This included Roman Catholics.
BISA was published in 1986 and information was gleaned from research by the South Australian Genealogy and Heraldry Society in archives, public records, private papers, and letters of administrations as well as contributions from individuals. All info needs to be checked where possible as there are errors and omissions but an excellent resource to start your SA research.
WATTS Thomas
Born 1822 Belfast NIR Died 8 Oct1887 Balaklava SA
Arrived 1841 on the HAWK
Occupation Labourer Lived Balaklava, Pt Wakefield.
Religion Roman Catholic
Married 4 Dec1855 Penwortham SA Mary nee GRAHAM born c1835 OFF IRL
Died 26 Mar 1910 Willaston SA
Children Eliza Jane 1857-, Miriam Hazel BRODERICK 1859-1948, David Joseph 1862-1952, Agnes Mildred TYLER 1864-1944, Eliza TUDOR 1868-1938, Joseph Francis 1870-1943 James 1871-.
This entry may have been compiled from publicly available records.
WATTS Joseph Francis
Parents Thomas and Mary nee GRAHAM Born1870 SA Died 12 June1943 Buried Pt Pirie SA
Married Alice nee DYER born c1874 died 15 Oct 1969
Children Effie Letitia 1894-, Francis Roy1898-, Wm Thos 1904, Sidney David Gee 1906-, Ruby died as infant.
Cando
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Marriage
WATTS Joseph Francis 22 years Status Single Father Thomas WATTS
DYER Alice 18 years Status Single Father William DYER
11 Apr 18921
At the Whitwarta Hotel, Whitwarta Gil 171/105
Cando
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Burial records at Pt Pirie for Joseph and Alice
http://www.pirie.sa.gov.au/page.aspx?u=423&c=89420
http://www.pirie.sa.gov.au/page.aspx?u=423&c=75379
Photo of headstone available for a small fee
https://headstones.weebly.com/port-pirie.html
Cando
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Thanks all for the help and info, it's a great help.
Some where on one of the maternal lines there is a connection to the camaleers of south australia, yet another challenge. Possible maiden names are Wilsdon, McCartney.
Regards.
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That's a bit vague M S Harmer. I think you need something more definite for us to help you.
Cheers
Cando
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Hi Martin,
I agree with Cando.
Have you tried google? You will likely find the Cameleers were of the Muslim faith and were from Afghanistan. http://www.southaustralianhistory.com.au/cameleers.htm
JM
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Sorry for late reply, still no info from brother in-laws sister re cameleer connection.
Will have to start looking at his maternal lines starting with his mother and grandmother
Merle Laura McCartney b. abt 1928 ?. Married Keith Raymond Watts. b. 29 Jul 1926. S. Aust. (no marriage or birth info). Parents, g parents, siblings ect.
Hilda May Wilsdon b. 5 Sep. 1902, Solomontown, S. Aust. Married Ronald Charles Watts, 26 Nov 1921, Pt Pirie. Parents, g parents, siblings ect.
Any and all info great-fully received.
Regards
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Martin,
The people you name as born in the 1920s ... please confirm that you already know each one is no longer living ... otherwise modify your post and remove the names, against the rules to identify people who may still be living.
JM
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Merle Laura McCartney died 1982, buried in Pt Augusta, Sth Aust.
Keith Raymond Watts died and buried 2001 in Pt Pirie, Sth Aust. Both were found on council web site.
Have photo of Keith's plaque.
Regards
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Sorry for late reply, still no info from brother in-laws sister re cameleer connection.
Will have to start looking at his maternal lines starting with his mother and grandmother
Merle Laura McCartney b. abt 1928 ?. Married Keith Raymond Watts. b. 29 Jul 1926. S. Aust. (no marriage or birth info). Parents, g parents, siblings ect.
Hilda May Wilsdon b. 5 Sep. 1902, Solomontown, S. Aust. Married Ronald Charles Watts, 26 Nov 1921, Pt Pirie. Parents, g parents, siblings ect.
Any and all info great-fully received.
Regards
Birth
WATTS Keith Raymond
27 Sep 1927
Father Ronald Charles WATTS Mother Hilda May WILSDON
At Port Pirie West Cla 196A/513
No birth for Merle Laura McCARTNEY in South Australia.
My resources for marriages in SA only extend to 1937 and births to 1928.
In South Australia access and privacy restrictions do not apply for:
Marriage records more than 75 years old
Birth records more than 100 years old
Death records more than 30 years old.
Marriage
WATTS Ronald Charles 19 years Status Single Father Joseph Francis WATTS
WILSDON Hilda May 19 years Status Single Father Albert WILDSON
26 Nov 1921
At the Methodist Parsonage, Port Pirie Cla 289/706
You can search further yourself at
http://www.genealogysa.org.au/resources/online-databases.html
Cando
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Hello,
You will find details of Joseph Francis Watts KHQ2-XGV and Alice Dyer KH96-JHB and their children on FamilySearch.
I live in South Australia, Australia and would be happy to answer any of your queries on the Watts family if I can.
I am researching the family of my deceased step father Francis Roy Watts.
His father was Francis Roy Watts and his father was Joseph Francis Watts - the person you are inquiring about.
I am currently trying to find details of the grandparents of Joseph Francis Watts ie parents of Thomas Watts (father of Joseph Francis Watts) who lived in Ireland. Do you have any information about Joseph's grandparents in Ireland?
Look forward to your reply.
Lyn
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Hi Lynn.
Sorry I have only gone back back as far as Thomas and Alice.
Irish cencus records could be difficult.
Also if you are who I think you are my brother in law is one of your brothers
I'd send a PM but cannot find it on my mobile.
Do you have any info on the so called link to camaleers of Sth Aust.
Regards M
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Lyn needs to do two more posts before she can use the personal message system. When she has done that she can send personal messages to other Rootschatters.
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Thank you for reminding me. :)