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Census Lookups General Lookups => Census and Resource Discussion => Census Lookup and Resource Requests => Topic started by: Kathleenjean on Saturday 27 January 18 13:38 GMT (UK)
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I am looking for John Keates. He married Elizabeth Ann Hibbard Caudwell in January 1872 in Ilkeston, Derbyshire. He was shown as age 30. His father was James Keates. I cannot find the Keates -father or son in the census of 1841, 1851, 1861 or 1871. Elizabeth his wife was in Mansfield Union Workhouse with the children in 1881, she later married Charles Goodwin by 1891. Help desperately needed please.
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Welcome to rootschat. :)
What were the occupations of John & his father
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Father and son both shown as labourers on wedding certificate.
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Thank you. Not much help to you is it :)
Are the witnesses any help
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The witnesses are a married couple, surname appears to be unrelated to either bride or groom! I could try to find their marriage, the maiden name of the lady might be "Keates" - a long shot but you never know what might turn up.
It is so frustrating, John Keates must be on the census somewhere. Thanks for your help.
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Hello,
Who were the witnesses? Did John and Elizabeth give the same address?
Heywood
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Both bride and groom shown as living in Ilkeston (no address).
Witnesses Matthew and Mary Overton Hawkins.
I am looking for wedding of Matthew and Mary to see if there is a maiden surname of Keates, so far no success. They were grocers living in Ilkeston in 1871.
So far, Ilkeston seems to be the only connection between witnesses and bride and groom. It is a great mystery.
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Matthew Hawkins was a Plate Layer in 1871 not a grocer. His lodger was a Railway Labourer so John may have also been working on the railways.
Do you have any children’s birth records with his occupation?
The marriage for the Hawkins was December quarter 1852 , Louth Lincolnshire.
Mary Overton Hill and Matthew Hawkins.
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Thank you for the information regarding Matthew Hawkins. I am struggling to even find him on the 1871 census, believe I may have found his wife Mary shown as residing Alfreton Belper Derbyshire. I think another subscription to Ancestry is needed! Have you used Find My Past for your research, I wondered if that is as good or better than Ancestry? Your comments would be appreciated. Many thanks.
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It took a while to find Matthew and Mary transcribed as Harkins in 1871 3483 /7/7
but I am confused now. Have I got the right one? I thought you had them as you say they were grocers. :-\
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I am looking for John Keates. He married Elizabeth Ann Hibbard Caudwell in January 1872 in Ilkeston, Derbyshire. He was shown as age 30.
I found a baptism for Annie Mary Keates
baptised 8th June 1873
Whaley Thorns, Derbyshire
Father: John Keates
Mother: Elizabeth keates
GRO record shows her birth March quarter 1872 mmn Hibbard.
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You have probably got the correct Hawkins, mine was me grabbing at straws in desperation. The marriage certificate shows Mary Overton Hawkins as one of the witnesses. I could not understand how a labourer would have a grocer and his wife as witnesses if there was no family connection!
Thank you for the help re:- 1871 census, I will investigate. Hopefully it will point me in the correct direction.
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Hiya and welcome to RootsChat
John may have been illegitimate which might be why you cant find him with his father James there is a birth registered 1842 Basford of a John Keys no mothers maiden name given
Willow x
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Hi Willow,
I have looked up John Keys b1842 Basford Nottinghamshire and it would appear that he also dies in 1842! Unless I have not found the same John Keys as you. Thanks for your help, much appreciated.
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I'd missed that one but I have now found the death for John 1877 in Mansfield but it gives his age as 55 which would make him born about 1822 not 1842 as we were looking for
There is a baptism of a John Keats 21.12.1823 Stinsford Dorset parents James and Rachel this is the only one I can find so far with a father called James but I am having no luck at all finding him with his father on a census
Found him with his wife Mary in all the census so it isn't him
John buried 31.7.1877 All Hallows church Gedling Nottinghamshire
Willow x
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Very interestingly I found this
7.4.1871 St Peters Church Derby Derbyshire John Keates father James married Sarah Johnson father George
Willow x
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Very interestingly I found this
7.4.1871 St Peters Church Derby Derbyshire John Keates father James married Sarah Johnson father George
Willow x
Should this be 1851?
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Duhhh! yes 1851
Willow x
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A big thank you to all trying to help me find John Keates, I am still struggling.
The only info I have is on his marriage certificate, age about 30, labourer, living in Ilkeston, father James. The bride was heavily pregnant at the wedding (January 1872) because daughter Annie Mary Keates was born Mansfield in March quarter 1872, baptised 1873 Whaley Thorns, Derbyshire. Next child, James born1874 Mansfield. Daughter Sarah born 1877 Leeds, Yorkshire, daughter Elizabeth born 1881 March quarter apparently in Mansfield Union Workhouse, no sign of John Keates though. Son Arthur born 1883 Belper Derbyshire. No sign of John Keates found as yet.
The bride Elizabeth Keates b1850 Hucknall Nottinghamshire then re-married in 1884 in Derby.
The family seems to have moved around a lot!
I have tonight found a John Keyte born 1846 Shardlow Derbyshire, might try to trace him. The above information is just for your interest. This is the hardest person in my husband's tree to find. Happy days, and thanks once again.