RootsChat.Com
General => The Common Room => Topic started by: Edward Scott on Friday 02 February 18 17:59 GMT (UK)
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-42919441
I, like many others, just wish they had done this for the last 180 years or so
Edward
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It does make sense, especially in these days when there are so many single parent families. At the moment it could mean that someone is brought up by their mother, yet when it comes to their marriage it is a long absent father's name who goes on the certificate. Lets hope it gets passed and becomes law quickly.
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I agree that it makes sense, could we start a petition to make the law retrospective? :)
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In Ireland, the mother's name is on Marriage Certs from about 1960 or so.
I have Certs from 1961 and 1962 with all four parents' names on it.
1953 Cert has only the fathers' names.
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About time too! :)
This is long overdue. I think it would be great if the law concerning this could be made retrospective.
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I agree that it makes sense, could we start a petition to make the law retrospective? :)
That would be far too costly to do, unless of course you would be prepared to pay extra for each certificate
Cheers
Guy
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About time too! :)
This is long overdue. I think it would be great if the law concerning this could be made retrospective.
I really don't see how that would be feasible. Someone would have to cross reference everyone to find their birth and the name of the mother. The cost would be enormous. We have to remember that certificates are not primarily produced for genealogists even though we benefit from them.
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snip
We have to remember that certificates are not primarily produced for genealogists even though we benefit from them.
What makes you think that Groom?
In reality that is exactly why the civil registration was introduced to enable proof of heritage in estate claims.
To put it in simple terms it was thought the existing ecclesiastical records did not meet the needs of non conformists and other religions.
Cheers
Guy
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Yes, I concede that when you think about it it probably would be too much of a mammoth task and hugely expensive to do this retrospectively.
However, the good thing is it looks likely that things are going to change in the future. :)
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I agree that it makes sense, could we start a petition to make the law retrospective? :)
That would be far too costly to do, unless of course you would be prepared to pay extra for each certificate
Cheers
Guy
Guy, I was not being serious , hence the smiley. Perhaps I should have found a tic emoticon
Edward
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I came across a marriage record the other day which recorded the mother's name - and in occupation it said "single mother". So I guess she had brought up the child on her own.
And yes, it was in England - just can't remember the details!
FS
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I came across a marriage record the other day which recorded the mother's name - and in occupation it said "single mother". So I guess she had brought up the child on her own.
And yes, it was in England - just can't remember the details!
FS
That must be quite unusual and probably at the discretion of the vicar.
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I married 45 years ago today.My dad died when I was a child,so my mum became a 3rd witness to the marriage,just so our surname would be on the cert. It didn't say in what capacity she signed,but I know who she is/was and why it's there ;D
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Considering how common some of our names are, our records are more or less worthless when compared to those I discovered when I found my gt.gt. grandparents Hanoverian 1853 marriage record. The document states the Parish, the dates in each parish when the banns were read out plus the marriage date. Both the groom and bride's parents were named including occupations and their places of birth. Additionally the bride and groom's full names, occupations, with their dates and places of birth. Plus witnesses details.
Similarly the death records were just as advantageous, especially as the actual age of the deceased of years, months and days were recorded (e.g. 69 years, 10 months, 2 days).
In this days of easy travel, future am. genealogists would love to have this sort of information but on reflection, I presume some would think it was against some form of "right".
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It does make sense, especially in these days when there are so many single parent families. At the moment it could mean that someone is brought up by their mother, yet when it comes to their marriage it is a long absent father's name who goes on the certificate. Lets hope it gets passed and becomes law quickly.
Couldn't agree more. My 1st husband took off when I was pregnant and I've not laid eyes on him since. He didn't contribute a penny towards my son's upbringing, nor invest a minute of his time, so in truth I object to him being on my son's marriage certificate at all, let alone as the only one.
Thankfully my son son is still single so at least I will now be included :) but it's a pity that the man who raised him for the last 20 odd years won't be.
I'd actually have been happier if they'd removed the requirement for parents details completely and replaced it with date & place of birth of bride & groom.
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This kind of thing is the only reason I regret that I won't get married- not leaving a marriage cert. After having a folder filled with birth marriage and death certs it feels so incomplete not having that one cert. Maybe I should become one of those people who decides to marry the Eiffel Tower or something.
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Couldn't agree more. My 1st husband took off when I was pregnant and I've not laid eyes on him since. He didn't contribute a penny towards my son's upbringing, nor invest a minute of his time, so in truth I object to him being on my son's marriage certificate at all, let alone as the only one.
Thankfully my son son is still single so at least I will now be included :) but it's a pity that the man who raised him for the last 20 odd years won't be.
Is it actually a legal obligation to give a birth father's name? I know on some of the certificates I have there is a made up name or the step father's name. I don't see why your son couldn't give his stepfather's name and just say he doesn't know his father if asked.
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It seems genealogists have very short memories, doesn’t anyone remember the consultation document about proposed changes to the legislation relating to the Civil Registration Service in England and Wales by means of a Regulatory Reform Order back in 2003? (the process started in 1999).
Some of the changes proposed in that document have since come or at least partially come to fruition.
Some would address what people here have been calling for.
“Link registration records relating to the same person to create ‘through life’ records.
Add other records, such as divorce or naturalisation records, to the central database to build a more complete picture of a person’s civil status.
Introduce a more straightforward system for correcting and updating registration records.
Restrict access to linking information and to original information in the case of corrections and updates.
Plan to electronically capture registration records from the last 100 years.
Make available historic records for digitisation.
Remove the restrictions for accessing historic records.
Introduce a new framework for accessing modern registration records. They would continue to be publicly available but access to some information would be restricted namely address, occupation and cause of death. It would be available to the person named in the record, their family, those given access by the individual/family and those organisations with prescribed access.
Provide access to registration records, once they are digitised, via the central database.
The use of certificates would decline over time.
Introduce a statutory framework for the sharing of registration information.
Ensure the preservation of the original registers by allowing local authorities to have responsibility for their custody probably by depositing them in record offices.
Maintain the statutory arrangements for recording and depositing records of overseas events, records of HM Forces and other miscellaneous records held by the Registrar General.
Plan to electronically capture overseas records etc. The access framework would equally apply to these records.
Extend the current arrangements for depositing foreign marriage to include all marriages involving British citizens that take place in foreign countries.”
If anybody is interested they can download the 3 PDF files here.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01lh1/
Some of the replies to the consultation my be seen here
http://www.devonfhs.org.uk/civilreg.htm
Perhaps one of the most interesting and possibly worrying to many would be the setting up of a through life record, linking not only BMDs but other records such as divorce, census, school records even the possibility of hospital records etc. all being eventually interlinked
Cheers
Guy
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Is it actually a legal obligation to give a birth father's name?
No it isn't, and people do sometimes choose not to record their father's details for all sorts of reasons.
If they do add the name - it can be their natural father, adoptive father or step-father (if married to the mother).
I would assume the rules for adding the mother's details will be the same.
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Is it actually a legal obligation to give a birth father's name?
No it isn't, and people do sometimes choose not to record their father's details for all sorts of reasons.
If they do add the name - it can be their natural father, adoptive father or step-father (if married to the mother).
That's good to know, thank you.