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England (Counties as in 1851-1901) => England => Worcestershire => Topic started by: daljul on Monday 05 March 18 07:57 GMT (UK)

Title: Query on birthplace
Post by: daljul on Monday 05 March 18 07:57 GMT (UK)
I have a birth certificate for 1876 showing a place of birth as Grape Tree Row Butts St Clements Worcester. I can't find this address on the 1881 census. Is it a road or a dwelling place?

Thanks

dinkey
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: PaulineJ on Monday 05 March 18 08:05 GMT (UK)
The butts is a street address.

In 1871 it was RG 10/3048   39-41 & RG 10/3049   95

Pauline
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: daljul on Monday 05 March 18 09:16 GMT (UK)
Thank you Pauline J.
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Tuesday 06 March 18 11:52 GMT (UK)
There were a lot of small rows in Worcester & Grape Tree Row may mave been built on as Ive never heard of it & was born in Worcester - bear in mind a big development in the Butts is the HIVE where the parish register films for the county are now held for use by the public who are into Family History. its worth checking on the site Old Maps as that may well show Grape Tree Row

All the very best

Phil
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: daljul on Tuesday 06 March 18 13:06 GMT (UK)
I do not live in the Worcester area but if anyone can check out a map to see if there is a Grape Tree Row then it would be very much appreciated.
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: PaulineJ on Tuesday 06 March 18 14:20 GMT (UK)
You need to "walk" the census route to see if any group of 3/4 homes in a terrace are labelled as "Grape Tree Row" . Their footprint will be too small to be labelled on a map.

if you find it in (say) 1871, but not in 1881, then find an 1871 landmark (vicarage, pub, etc) nearby and start "walking" around that feature in 1881. people/neighbours may also be unchanged, so double-check on family names

Pauline
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: daljul on Tuesday 06 March 18 14:32 GMT (UK)
I live in Lancashire Pauline so I am too far way to walk the route myself. Hoping that someone living in the area could check it out for me if possible.
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: PaulineJ on Tuesday 06 March 18 14:42 GMT (UK)
you read the addresses as you scroll through the census pages, no need to travel.
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Saturday 10 March 18 11:42 GMT (UK)
Hi Dinkey

I have a set of 4  Alan Godfrey maps for Worcester City dated 1902 & there is no sign of a grape Tree Row on them so all I can suggest is that you put a request on these pages asking if anyone will be going to the HIVE at Worcester soon & if you find someone who is, ask if they would mind looking at old street directories of the City for you.  Or you could try this on line as old directories are free online to search but I don't remember the web site

All the very best

Phil
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Saturday 10 March 18 12:23 GMT (UK)
Hi Again

Ive just had a good look at Historic Directories the site run by university of Leicester & there is no sign of grape Tree Row on it as I did several searches - Grape Tree Row, Worcester. grape Tree Row, The Butts, Worcester. & several other permutations but none of them came up with Grape Tree Row - the only thing I didn't try was a soundex search

All the very best

Phil
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Saturday 17 March 18 11:44 GMT (UK)
Im still searching for Grape Tree Way but am drawing a blank from all the books I have

Ive looked at all the planning applications for Worcester City from 12DEC1865 to 9FEB1901 but there is nothing at all referring to Grape Tree Way & there should be had there been any development there & there has been a lot of development in the Butts area.  So this makes me wonder if it was a nickname for somewhere else off the Butts.

Extract from street directory C1902 shows streets off the Butts are :-
Infirmary Walk
Netherton Lane
Croft Walk
Rack Alley
& all the addresses for the Butts were for traders
I hope this is of some help & wonder if you could put an image of the entry you have for Grape Tree Way on these pages as it may help those of us who are looking for it

All the very best

Phil
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: avm228 on Saturday 17 March 18 12:02 GMT (UK)
The references earlier in the thread are to Grape Tree Row rather than Grape Tree Way?

“Row” names often referred to a row of buildings on a road, rather than a separate road.
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Saturday 17 March 18 13:03 GMT (UK)
Sorry that was a typo my posting should have read Grape Tree Row not way & I did say in an earlier posting that there were a lot of rows in Worcester but forgot to elaborate on the meaning that Row could have regard property

All the very best

Phil
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Saturday 24 March 18 11:49 GMT (UK)
Hi Dinkey

Grape Tree Row has really got to me & Ive looked at all my old maps (going back to 1840) for it as well as going through my rather large personal library about Worcester City but have had no luck so I intend to try & find it at the HIVE in Worcester as I should be going to visit the county of my birth in mid April so plan to have a good look at street directories on my first visit there next holiday & I normally visit the HIVE 6 times during each holiday so will do my best to find Grape Tree Row for you

All the very best

Phil
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Saturday 07 April 18 11:18 BST (UK)
Hi Dinkey

Just to let you know that I should be going to the county of my birth in about a weeks time & when there will do my best to try & locate where Grape Tree Row use to be with the aid of old Worcester City Street Directories so wish me luck with that - I Will let you know my findings as soon as I can

All the very best

Phil
Born Worcester City
Title: Re: Query on birthplace
Post by: philheeks on Thursday 19 April 18 10:44 BST (UK)
Hi Again

I  can find no evidence of Grape Tree Row in the very limited amount of Street Directories that are held at the HIVE for Worcester City but the archaeology dept at the HIVE have suggested that it may well have been a few cottages in the Butts that had the name Grape Tree Row for a very short period as if it had existed for for some time they would have a record of it on their very detailed maps of Worcester.

Sorry that this is the best I could do for you as I hate letting people down.

All the very best

Phil