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Messages - element4

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1
Derbyshire / Re: Would Charlesworth come under Hayfield death registration district?
« on: Friday 12 October 18 17:58 BST (UK)  »
Fanny Greenwood was buried in the churchyard of St. John the Evangelist, Charlesworth.
There is a memorial, recorded by Derbyshire FHS, - "In Memory of/FANNY GREENWOOD who/died Jan 17 1866 in her 73 year."

Thanks for that. 

2
Derbyshire / Re: Would Charlesworth come under Hayfield death registration district?
« on: Thursday 11 October 18 12:57 BST (UK)  »
From GenUKI:
https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/DBY/Charlesworth

The Anglican parish church is dedicated to Saint John the Evangelist.
The church was built in 1849 and the ecclesiastical parish formed that same year out of Glossop.

Civil Registration began in July, 1837.
The parish was in the Hayfield sub-district of the Hayfield Registration District.


And, from Kelly's Directory of 1891:
CHARLESWORTH, on the borders of Cheshire, is a township and parish, formed in 1849 from that of Glossop, including CHISWORTH and SIMMONDLEY, in the High Peak division of the county, hundred of High Peak civil parish, petty sessional division, union and county court district of Glossop, rural deanery of Glossop, archdeaconry of Derby and diocese of Southwell. Charlesworth township is 1½ miles west from Dinting station on the Manchester, Sheffield and Lincolnshire railway, 2½ miles south-west from Glossop, 13 from Manchester and 200½ from London. The church of St. John, erected in 1849 at a cost of £2,700, is a cruciform building of stone in the Early English style, consisting of chancel, nave, north porch and a tower on the north side forming a north transept, and containing one bell, dated 1849: there are 480 sittings, 100 being free. The register dates from the year 1849.

Thanks, that information is useful.  It definitely answers my question that Charlesworth is in the registration district of Hayfield.  One day I might be able to look for her grave in that churchyard, and it could be that other family members who I can't trace might be buried with her or near to her.  Fanny going to live in Charlesworth some time between the 1861 and 1871 censuses, seemed to take younger generations of her family with her.  She had been born in Hebden Bridge, Yorkshire, and moved with her husband and older children to Manchester around 1830, where her youngest child Mary was born. Her husband Henry died some time between 1841 and 1851 in Manchester.  So I am thinking there is a reason an older, widowed woman would move to a place like Charlesworth, Derbyshire, maybe she already had family living there?  The 1861 census in Charlesworth gives her as a housekeeper, so maybe she went to live there for a job, or maybe that just meant that she did the housework and was financially supported by her daughter Mary who was living with her?  And maybe older widows did get pensions back then?  She had two young grandsons living with her so maybe her other children were helping her financially, though I assumed the grandchildren were orphaned.

3
Derbyshire / Re: Would Charlesworth come under Hayfield death registration district?
« on: Thursday 11 October 18 11:39 BST (UK)  »
yes it would.

https://www.ukbmd.org.uk/reg/districts/hayfield.html

Thanks.  That link does say that Charlesworth comes under the Hayfield registration district between 1894 and 1898, and was created in 1894 from the rural part of the parish of Glossop.

So maybe it was in 1866 when she died?

4
Derbyshire / Would Charlesworth come under Hayfield death registration district?
« on: Thursday 11 October 18 11:26 BST (UK)  »
I have been trying to trace as much as possible about my 3x great grandmother, Fanny Greenwood, born 1797 in Heptonstall, Yorkshire, who in later life was living in Charlesworth, Derbyshire, and I think died in Charlesworth, Derbyshire on 21st January 1866.

I found a difficult to find record in Derbyshire, England, Church of England Burials for a Fanny Greenwood who died in Charlesworth, Derbyshire on 21st January 1866, estimated age 73, born about 1793.

This might be the same person in the England and Wales Civil Registration Death Index of a Fanny Greenwood, born about 1793, died 1866, Quarter Jan, Feb, March.  Age 73.  Hayfield, Derbyshire.  Volume 7b, Page 473.

Would deaths in Charlesworth come under Hayfield?

On the 1861 census she is shown as a widow age 68, though she was 64 according to my reckoning of her birth in 1797.  Living with her daughter Mary and two grandsons.

Is the civil registration the same person as the Church of England burial record?  She was definitely living in the Charlesworth area.

5
It looks promising.
John W. Willis, born Hadfield, Derbyshire on the 1901 Census, and the 1897 marriage registered Hadfield. The couple readily found on the 1911 Census.

Yes, I am sure it is her.

6
Have you discounted 1901 Census  (RG13  3803  100  30)
Mary Ellen Willis, age 31, Frame Tenter Cotton Mill, born Salford - living in Hollingworth.

Struck by the similarity of occupation to 1891

There's a civil marriage of a John William Willis to a Mary Ellen Greenwood, Derbyshire, Sep Qtr, 1897

Thank you for finding that.  I had searched but didn't find it.  It does sound like her.  Hollingworth is the area of outer Manchester where Derbyshire, Cheshire, Lancashire and I think maybe even Yorkshire join, and this family lived in that area.

7
Thanks for that.  If she is a wife and from Halifax, it is almost certainly the wrong person.  The document I found on Ancestry said she was a servant, it was a different document, but it does seem to be the same people as on the Ancestry document where she is listed as a servant, she is also listed between Thomas Darby, labourer and Mary Mines, servant.  Also her age, 30, is in the column for single people not the column for married people.  So the two documents show different information, one that she was married and the other that she was single and a servant.  But as far as I know, my great aunt was last living with her parents in Hollingworth, near Manchester, not Halifax, and that was on the 1891 census, so she might have been living as a servant in Halifax immediately before travelling...

Greenwood was a very common name in West Yorkshire and nearby, so lots of false leads.  I thought the combination of her age, birth year, disappearance from English records, and likelihood that she was a servant, might mean I had the right person.

8
I just got a page asking me to register, and then when I tried it said  "This site does not support the current version of your web browser".  I tried anyway and it asked me to specify my birthdate, even though I already had done.

9
I have been trying to find out about an ancestor, my grandfather's sister, Mary Ellen Greenwood, born in Salford, England on 25th June 1869.  She is on the English censuses in 1871, 1881 and 1891, living with her parents.  After that there are no records for her; I can't find a marriage record or censuses or anything, but there is an emigration record that could be her. 

Mary Greenwood age 30, birth date 1869, Servant, departure date 27/9/1899 from Liverpool, England to Philadelphia, USA.  The ship name is Rhynland, master Doxrud.

It does fit, as I know that at least one of her sisters was a domestic servant "in service".

I think Mary Ellen Greenwood must at some stage have married in America and had children, as I have done an autosomal DNA test and share quite a lot of DNA with people in America (68 centimorgans with one, which is a similar amount as a known DNA match of a descendant of another of my grandfather's siblings).

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