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Thanks for the comments. I have the 2 marriage certs, and both Williams are the same age and both their fathers were called william.  In 1873 William and Emma married william aged 23, in April 1876 William married Catharine aged 27 allowing for birthdays and when they fall, Emma's William could of been 27 in 1876 when Catharine and William got married. Its such a coincidence that 2 families linked through marriage would have 2 William Harveys the same age whose fathers were called William. I know Emma and William are ours because my Mum hs told me of her aunty having the middle name Chirgwin and she hated it. I wonder if the error is William and Phyllis Payne being Emma's Williams parents.

Thanks. I've had another look on the 1881 census, Charles snr is down as an agr. Labourer, but all the dates etc fit to what you've found out. So its the right family.

So why would he be down as an ag. Lab and you've found him as a Journalier? More's the point what is a journalier? when I put it in on google it just says daily...daily what, is it a journalist?

Would he of had 2 jobs or perhaps he changed job. In 1881 they lived still in District of de marais at no 5 Beequets Cottages, Grouville.

You know you said you live at the same place as the Bree's did in 1877, where on the map is that I've had a look today but couldn't find it. I found Grouville, but not the exact place you mentioned.

Sorry for all the questions.
Alison

Hi Stewart

Thank you so much for your help, I think you have hit the jackpot, Paul Charles Bree and the details you have given fit what I have under "Charles" Bree, the children you have listed fit what I have but haven't proven, wow what a find.

If this helps at all I have double checked my Gt.Grandad's marriage and Death certs, this is the Charles Bree b. 1873 or 1874. - He married July 10th 1898 in penzance aged 25. He died 18 March 1905 age 31. So if his birthday was between 18 March & 10th July, he would have been born in 1874 (if my maths is correct!).

The two people who have lodged Bree family trees at the Societe Jersiaise, are you able to get access to what they have submitted or can I write for access somewhere. I think my Bree's cover both St.Martin and Grouville. I think they started in St.Martin and moved to Grouville whilst still having children.

By the way not sure how I have come to let you think I am called joyce, my name is Alison, sorry about that, and thank you so very much, there's no way I could of done any of this without actually coming to Jersey, and I'm afraid that isn't on the cards. I get to Penzance record office now and again, but thats 5hrs away.
Thank you
Alison

Thank you for your offer of help. The details I need certifictes for are as follows

Birth of Charles Elias Bree born in 1873 or 74 in St. Martins. (he died in Penzance on 18.3.1905 age 31). Looking at his marriage cert he was born 1873. I need his birth cert.

His father was also Charles Bree b. 1850 or maybe 49 in St. Heliers, Jersey, he was 36 on the 1881 census, I need his Birth Cert and also marriage details. I know his wife was Mary A. but I dont have a maiden name all I know she was born in St. Martins. In 1881 she was aged 36. So again Charles mariage details are vital for me to go on. In 1881 he was living in Grouville

Here we get a bit sketchy, I think Charles b.1950 his Father was Elias Bree b.1825 but again no proof I can lay my hands on. Any help there with a birth index no would be so appreciated.

Hope this helps, and once again thank you very much for your very kind offer of help.