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Topics - weenie

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Yorkshire (West Riding) / William Beaumont of Milnthorpe b abt 1760 who are his parents ?

« on: Friday 12 May 23 18:23 BST (UK) »

Good evening all ,
my terrible brick wall i thought id have a gander at again.
William Beaumont was born abt 1762 - according to his death in 1837 buried at Sandal Magna but from Kirkburton.

i have his marriage to Sarah Hanson 19 oct 1787 at Sandal Magna his parish states Hoyland
children i have as follows :
Hannah 1788, John 1789, Joshua 1791, Violetta 1793, Martha 1794, Jane 1796, Jonathon 1798 , George 1800, Thomas 1802, Joseph 1804, Ann 1808.

DNA connections through Joshua, Jonathon and my line is Ann Beaumont 1808.

now i have not come across a baptism for William but there is 2 possiblities

23rd June 1759 Wakefield son of Joshua and 1761 Dewsbury son of John

a fellow DNA cousin and i are trying to work out who is william parents.

i thought Joshua Beaumont who married Sarah Brook they were from Almondbury and Joshua was of Upperthong - presuming old name for Overthong clothier. but there is also a daughter baptised in Almondury Hannah of same year as William 1759 so this is the only link i dont think Joshua and Sarah are his parents and of course no confirming paper trail... lthough lots of trees have these but no confirmation. my tree on Ancestry has Possibly on end.

but then... looking at the names of the children William had, and with then looking at Joshua parents is i believe to be George Beaumont and Martha Shakleton 28July 1738 Joshua baptism as Joshua marriage entry has William Shakleton as witness. possible relation to Mother Mary?
The names are as would be for naming patterns also Sarah Brook father is John - so William and Sarah Hanson 1st sons are John ( sarah dad) Joshua (William dad).
My DNA cousin also has DNA connections to the Brooks and Beaumonts in the Almondbury area which is another thing of been Joshua and Sarah Brooks, but they are struggling to connect them togther - they have a few intermingling marriages
any help would be greatly appriciated
many thanks
Weenie

Laois (Queens) / Brennan , Whelan and Finning Ballintubbert queens county

« on: Monday 27 February 23 22:45 GMT (UK) »

Good evening, im wondering if anyone could tell me about the town Ballintubbert Queens Co. how large it was the area in around 1830's please i keep looking at google but all i seem to get is the big house and gardens

i have my 4th gt grandparents Whelan and Brennan coming from Ballintubbert area. i loose track of them, after there 4th child is born , but 3 out of 4 children i have traced through. what ive noticed is that the same couple of names show up on baptisms as sponsers and also witness's to marriage. im told that it was mainly family members or very close friends if no family availble. so ive thought i would suggest that some are Brennans and that could be siblings of my 4th gt grandmother . also another name that is there a few times , ive checked the area for random marriages and births around the same time and notice the name Finning is then married to a Whelan. - i do understand how you cannot presum, i am only trying to piece it all together and get further.

it doesnt help i have 2 DNA to my 4th grandmother but they have her married to a possible brother of Whelan and the dates kinda dont fit, plus this is my maternal line, yet no match with my mum and Ancestry seem to say its my paternal side

thankyou Weenie

Yorkshire (West Riding) / who and where are Ralph and Elizabeth Ledger?

« on: Tuesday 31 January 23 19:42 GMT (UK) »

Hi all, my Nana Nellie was living with Ralph and Elizabeth Ledger on the 1921 census at 6 Peel Street Hunslet.

now ive traced my nana fully now the 1921 census has been released. back story below.
my nana mother left the family when she was 3/4 years old. her dad died 1916 in Hunslet Workhouse infirmary, and we was told an aunt looked after her who wasnt very nice - out of 3 sisters one of them was sent as a british home child, her older sister left with the mum and my nana was back in touch after her marriage her other sister moved to Hull and then returned and when my nana split from husband lived with the 2 sisters on Water lane until she met my grandfather.

now this Ralph and Elizabeth i just cannot seem to trace. according to 1921 census he is born Batley 1869 the 1911 census says he born 1872 ive also found 1910 tax record. all living at 6 Peel Street. same address on my nana marriage certificate to her husband in 1928.

i think i have found 1881 census but as Ralph Stead down as lodger son head is Elizabeth Ledger in Dewsbury
ive searched the GRO indexe and cannot find a birth for a Ralph Ledger or Ralph Stead anywhere.

Elizabeth well i have a marriage for them1909 Hunslet her maiden name is Hill she is 10 years older 1862 her birth and born Chard, Somerset.

i would like to trace these people as they were my nana foster parents
many thanks
Weenie

Yorkshire (West Riding) / is James ROPER actually my James RAPER?

« on: Monday 16 January 23 19:31 GMT (UK) »

Hi , im wondering if anyone could help me , i think my James Raper is James Roper on the 1881 census but im unsure.

my James b 1833 Holbeck , to parents William and Ann Raper, James married Matilda Wild in 1855 had childre Sarah and Hannah

The Raper siblings were bakers /biscuit and confectionery makers
now ive traced Matilda with the children to her death 1883, although James isnt with them - i think he may have seperated - as ive found 2 prison records in 1870s for him been drunk and disorderly.

now i also found a James ROPER in the 1881 census , birth a bit out but living as Lodger married occ bread baker. livining with the Mary Ann Walker family who are also baker/confectionaries and grocers. There is also a grandson called William Henry Roper aged 6 whos mother is Mary Ann Walkers daughter who married William ROPER of Leeds Travelling confectioner his father is Paul Roper according to the Shadwell reform records William Henry Roper parents died young and he lived with his grandmother Mary Ann Walker.

am i climbing up wrong branch? i just cannot seem to find James Raper after his marriage to Matilda apart from prision records. he also isnt the James Raper in Scarborough either .. tried that avenue.

it is also not the 1st time Raper is Roper used

many thanks
Weenie

Lancashire / where is William Jones ??

« on: Thursday 13 October 22 19:17 BST (UK) »

good evening all, i would like some help trying to find the whereabouts of William Jones.
I thought the release of the 1921 census would help .. but im still unsure of which william Jones. - i do have the subscription btw.

so William Jones was born 1872 Mold Wales to Owen and Eleanor Jones. William moved to Liverpool sometime between 1901 and 1911. with the rest of the family sibilings and mother.
in 1911 he is listed with his sister and her family the Summersgills listed as single and smithstriker.
i have lost him after that. now i have traced his sisters both Margaret and Mary Summersgills on the 1921 Census and he isnt with them. his brother John is also AWOL since 1891 in Liverpool but ill dig further after i hope to find William.

now looking at the 1921 census i did find one that suggested could be him living with Eliza Mary as his wife , he occupation is a lunatic Attendant no children.
i looked up a marriage and found one for
William to Eliza Mary Minshaw in 1915. but it says his father is William so dont think its mine.

where oh where could he be?

Weenie

Flintshire / who is Aprille Myfanway Jones??

« on: Saturday 25 June 22 21:32 BST (UK) »

good evening all,
i have recently connected to my 2nd cousin through DNA which im so pleased with because my grandfather never spoke about his 3 younger siblings to his children, so when i found them on the 1911 census when it came out its been a brick wall all these years, so obviously when the younger sibling John wilfred Jones grandaughter connected with me it was a huge delight.
but of course it also brings more brick walls so im trying to find out who Aprille Myfanway Jones is?
so ive been told that my 2nd cousin dad didnt speak to his father (John Wilfred Jones) when he left his mother to be with another woman, apparently he had a son called Robert to this other woman. now when John Wilfred Jones passed away someone contacted his son and he went to the funeral and has his death certificate
unfortunatly that is what we know apart from on the death cert it has informant as Aprille Myfanway Jones in Qualification side it says occupier
what i have learned from Ancestry and my findings are as follows:
John wilfred Jones b 24 Nov 1902 Bury Street Wrexham
Lived at Turnpath Cottages in 1908 when twin brothers were born
they the moved to Leeds West Yorkshire between 1908 ad the 1911 census lived at Penreavan Place Leeds
21st July 1924 Johnn Wilfred married Nora Wilson at family home 23 Mellville Place Leeds, sister Dora and sisters husband Thomas Jordan witnessess. known as Wilfred Jones then.
John Wilfred and Nora had twin boys Wilfred and Kenneth 1928 Leeds occupation Waiter
1939 is at 212AA Training camp Huntingto Cheshire, Sargent Leeds rifles retired
27 July 1984 death Fobyty Glan Clwyd Bodelwyddan (looks like this on cert -sorry if wrong) hence posting in this board
address is 29 FFord Pendames Maes Pennant Nostfn Clwyd (again sorry if spelt wrong)

my cousin seems to think the son Robert was born around 1938 where is unknown.
i am unable to show the death cert as i respect my new cousins wishes of not sharing.

so if anyone can help would be greatly appriciated,
i would also like to add that my grandfather is Robert his son ( my uncle ) is called Wilfred , im premusing after John Wilfred his brother , known as just Wilfred and to find out his son to other woman is called Robert , possibly after his brother and father. - i dont know if significant but when the decendants of the first 3 children Dora, Ada and Robert have never heard of the 3 younger brothers it seems very odd especially of the naming pattern. also my cousin did know of all siblings that her father told her ??

Weenie

Yorkshire (West Riding) / Ann West where is her family ?

« on: Tuesday 02 November 21 22:34 GMT (UK) »

Evening all , im posting in this board rather than the North Riding as i feel it fits better here.
I thought my 4th gt grandparents were William Dobson and Ann Bland, however last week i stumbled upon a RC batism of there set of twins which state Ann is Ann West. however i can not find a marriage to William and Ann West. here is what i have

William b 1800 York, to John and Mary Dobson. he doesnt appear on the 1841 census that ive found. but appears on the 1851 census without Ann with children John b 1830 (my line) Mary Ann b1831, Elizabeth 1838, William the 2nd b 1840 , Thomas 1843 and Bessy 1846 and his father John. william is Widowed on this census and marries Mary Rutledge Alderson 1853 and appears on the 1861 census with her, i think Mary dies 1871 and William 1874 but not 100%.
now Ann appears on the 1841 census without William and children Sarah b1833 twin, Ann 1835, Elizabeth 1838 and William 2nd b1840 -
Children John and Mary Ann are in Blue coat and Gray coat school on 41 census.
now all children are baptised at St Sampson York. then last week i found a RC record for twins Sarah and William b 1833 baptised the day after birth and states parents William Dobson and Ann West. there is also a baptism for them at St Sampson a month later, William died in 1834 so i guess they batised the twins asap. so im wondering where the Ann West comes in.
for years ive had the marriage as Ann Bland 1830 St Sampson York. so i did the usual GRO mmn with the children after 1837 and all are West.

so where is the marriage for William Dobson to Ann West?.
The 1841 census puts Anns birth abt 1811 but a possible death in 1849 puts it at 1806. now there is a baptism for Ann West 1805 Saxton in Elmet to Robert West and Frances, he a Tailor, ive also found possible siblings Francis, 1794, Hannah 1801 and Ruth 1810. all same Saxton in Elmet occ Tailor .
i also cannot find any marriage or further information on Robert and Frances. there is a marriage Robert West to Frances Hall in 1815 Pickering, but i very doubt this is theirs with children born 20 years previously.

so Where is the wedding of William Dobson and Ann West?. or her parents for that matter?

ive also wondered if Ann was West and married a Bland but drawn a blank.
any help greatly appriciated

Weenie

Lancashire / very long brick wall hoping to chip away for Eleanors parents

« on: Monday 02 August 21 21:37 BST (UK) »

Good evening all , i have this very long time brick wall of mine, and hoping i can at least chip it away ....somehow?

I have Eleanor Jones b abt 1838 Liverpool, according to census' married Owen Jones 14th Sept 1863 Parish church Flintshire.
now i have traced Eleanor with husband and children right through to her death in 1913.
1871 to husbands death livng at New Street Mold, in 1891 census she is living with her Daughter Margaret who married Richard Summersgill in Mold. 1901 Eleanor is living in Liverpool as a visitor at 5 Rossett street in 1911 livng with daughter Mary Elizabeth and husband Walter Sumersgill ( both daughters married brothers)
children are as Follows:

John Jones b1865 traced till 1891 census as a tram conductor living in Liverpool
Margaret Jones b 12 April 1867 - 1940 married Richard Summersgill in 1899 moved to liverpool from Mold, between 1891 -1901 census died in Liverpool 1940 had 10 children.
Robert Owen Jones b 12 June 1869 Mold, Married Sarah Annie Elizabeth Smith in Wrexham 27 Dec 1893, lived in Wrexham till 1909 where he moved to Leeds had 6 children (my grandfather one of them) died 1940.
William Jones b June 1872 traced him through census in Wales then 1911 living with sister in Liverpool no further trace or possible marriage .
Mary Elizabeth Jones b 18 Nov 1881 traced her to 1891 census in Wales missing 1901 census, but married Walter Summersgill in 1910 in Liverpool same as 1911 census . died 1964. 1 child together.

on the marriage certificate it clearly shows Robert Jones as father occupation Tailor.
Now i know these siblings to be correct because i have 2 DNA matches one to Sibling Jane Jones b 1851 Liverpool who married James Albert Shepherd - her marriage states father Robert Jones occupation Tailor.
and then Mary Jones b1842 Liverpool who married William Tupman in Manchester 1863 says father is Robert occupation Tailor. also there son Owen is with Eleanor on 1881 census.

so i believe that parents are Robert Jones and Margaret Jones... possible marriage 1832 ..not sure?.
but children are
Eleanor 1838, cannot find baptism - ordered birth cert of 1838 Liverpool.. not mine says parents are Owen and Mary.

Robert 1838. baptism 6th May 1838 Pupia Street Robert and Margaret occuption Tailor. have a robert on 1851 census with Parents Robert and Margaret Jones , children Margaret, Robert, Ellen, John Elizabeth - no further trace....

Margaret Jones baptism 18 Sept 1839 Pupia street Robert and Margaret coocupation Tailor. married Griffiths Jones 1859 had 6 children.

Mary Jones baptism 21 March 1842 Earl Street, Robert and Margaret occupation Tailor. as written above traced and DNA match

Ellen Jane Jones baptism 20 Sept 1843 Gibralter Street Robert and Margaret occupation Tailor - no trace after 1851 census.

John Jones baptism 9 Aug 1846 Burlington Street Robert and Margaret occupation Tailor. no trace after 1861 census.

Elizabeth baptism 1 Jan 1849 Burlington Street Robert and Margaret occupation Tailor no trace after 1861 census

Jane Jones baptism 18 May 1851 Highfield Street Robert and Margaret occuptaion Tailor - as written above traced and DNA matched.

William Henry Jones baptism - Not liverpool like rest of - but England select 3 sept 1856 Robert an Margaret Jones. beleive to be traced on Glasgow and Liverpool crew lists on Ancestry to 1903 then no trace.

Robert and Margaret i believe to be born abt 1810
1861 census at Lathems buildings Liverpool says born Carnarvanshire for Robert - rest liverpool
Robert 1809
MArgaret 1810
John 1844
Eliza 1849
Jane 1851
Wy Henry 1856

1851 census Highfield Street Liverpool says Carnarvan for Robert rest Liverpool
Robt 1809
Marg 1810
Robt 1841
Marg 1839
Ellen 1843
John 1846
Elizabeth 1848

i have a possible 1841 census for Robt and Margaret with Eleanor at comus street now has Births as follows
Robert 1814
Margaret 1816
Elleanor 1838

now there is baptism for an Eleanor at 1838 Comus street but it says RICHARD and Margaret occupation Tailor !!

As you can see i have 2 DNA matches to 2 siblings that actually dont appear on Census with others ?? i have tried the births for Eleanor and nothing matches.. i am wondering if Ellen Jane is Elleanor but still used Eleanor and thought that was her birth 1838 when infact later on ? .. if you get me

.

which other birth certificatee could i get to make sure these are correct siblings which then maybe put me further back ?

i also think I have Margaret in the 1871 census on her own but not sure 100%

any help in this major brick wall is appriciated

Weenie

London and Middlesex / where is Lawrence Darnbrough Alias Harry Harley after wormwood scrubs ?

« on: Monday 21 June 21 19:23 BST (UK) »

Hi, im hoping im posting in the right board, as my mystery mans last known location was Wormwood Scrubs in 1922. so here is his back story

Lawrence Darnborough b 1st Sept 1886 in Leeds to Joseph Henry Darnborough and Mary Ann Osborne. Now Lawrence marries Minnie Peaker 11 May 1913. Now here it gets tricky. I have for Lawrence the following records. :
1891, 1901 census
WWI pension records , medal rolls , medal cards UK court martial records - all in Lawrence Darnborough.
However 1 April 1914 he is convicted of stealing sentence 1 month division and 1 month concurrent.
Then 19th June 1914 convicted again stealing - sentenced 3 month and 3 month concurrent
17 Dec 1914 struck off under para 182 regulations.
Now interestingly he changes his name to Harry Harley as alias and marrys a Elizabeth Ann Boyle, north Shields, Northumberland. Oct 1915. Then 28 April 1916 Newcastle police court Harry Harley age 28 is imprisoned for 12 months.
Now as Lawrence Darnborough he is
28 April date of official discharge papers
5th June 1916 at York discharged having been convicted by civil power of theft.
28 Feb 1918 conviction in Mansfield as Lawrence Darnborough aka Harry Harley
30th April 1918 Lawrence is court martial at clipstone
1918 on Leeds Absent voters register at Fleece Cottage Leeds Central - minnie address.
2nd sept 1919 his medal records says Deserted
1920 electoral registers at 15 Fleece cottage Leeds with wife Minnie.
1921 electoral register living at 3 Fleece place with Arthur Herring- Arthur Herring is another mystery as he appears with Minnie mother on Registers upto 1930 , then in Salvation Army hostel on 39 register.
Then 7th june 1921 Wormwood scrubs convicted to 18 months as Lawrence Darnborough alias Harry Harley. discharged Sept 1922 intends to live in London as a baker
Where is Lawrence/Harry after this? Minnie never had kids, I know Elizabeth had 1 daughter who died under 1 month known as Elizabeth Ann Harley June 1916.
Minnie died 1961.
Any help greatly appreciated thankyou

Weenie