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Messages - pughcd

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Hi Westmorland folk,

The 1851 census of Gressingham, Lancashire shows Agnes Brown, 51 of Lupton, Westmorland and husband, Thomas Brown, 50 of Kellet, Lancashire. Thomas Brown married Agnes Park, 3 October 1825 at Gressingham, Lancashire. Later censuses suggest Agnes is from Cartmel, Lancashire but I am going with the earlier offering as my Park family hail from Lupton, Westmorland.

Previous help here on this Forum found a baptism for my Isabella Park b 1804 Lupton, baptised on 20 May 1804 at Mansergh , daughter of John Park & Margaret Dickinson of Lupton.

This Agnes(s) Park born about 1800, Lupton would fit in with my family group but again I cannot find any references to Lupton or even Mansergh baptisms for this period.

Any help would be most welcome,
Thanks in advance.


Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: myFTDNA
« on: Monday 08 July 19 17:33 BST (UK)  »
Hi Kerrill,

So you have taken an Ancestry DNA test which is an autosomal DNA test and you have transferred the results to Family Tree DNA. You have also taken a mtDNA test at FT-DNA. Hopefully that is what you are saying?

So the reason you are not seeing any overlap with these tests is that the mtDNA is a mitochondrial DNA test. It is completely different from autosomal DNA. It is true that you inherit the mtDNA from your mother but the mtDNA haplogroup and matches have nothing to do with autosomal DNA matches.

My mtDNA haplogroup is H1a6, and my most distant maternal line ancestor was born in 1754, Konradswalde, Kreis Stuhm, West Prussia (now Poland). My matches also share the H1a6 haplogroup but are of little help in genealogical terms.

At FT-DNA it is possible to sort out maternal and paternal matches. Do you have access to your parents' DNA results?

Hope this is of some help.

Lancashire / Re: Lost family from West Derby
« on: Thursday 20 June 19 17:14 BST (UK)  »
Hi Wilcoxon,

I have found the son Joseph Weis, born abt. 1876, Banger (sic), North Wales on the 1911 census for Walton on the Hill, Lancashire. He is a Jobbing Gardener. This fit with the 1881 census where his father Josp. Weiss, age 41 of Germany was also a Gardener. He is married to Mary, and they have a infant son, Leslie.

There appears to be probable birth record for a Joseph Arthur Wise, Q1, 1875, Wrexham, Denbighshire, Wales (Denbighshire, volume 11b, page 321).

Hope this helps.


Hi Keelan,

If you check out the "Shared cM Project 3.0 tool v4" at the DNA Painter website you can enter the shared cM result. The highest Relationship Probability for 31.4cM is 53.56% covers 6C, 6C1R, 5C, 6C2R, 4C1R, 5C1R, 7C, Half 3C2R, 4C2R, 5C2R, 7C1R, 3C3R, 4C3R,  5C3R,  8C or more distant. This tool would support your prediction of 7C1R.

Good luck with your search.

Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: 1st cousin or half sibling confusions
« on: Sunday 24 February 19 17:33 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Gadget,

I tested my mtDNA at FT-DNA, I am H1a6 and we can trace my mother's maternal line back to Pomerania, Poland around 1800. There is a basic no-frills mtDNA haplogroup at 23and Me.

I have also taken autosomal DNA  tests at Ancestry DNA, FT-DNA,  23andMe and uploaded to My Heritage and GEDmatch. At FT-DNA and GEDmatch I can see my X- chromosome match with my sister.


Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: 1st cousin or half sibling confusions
« on: Sunday 24 February 19 15:51 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Gadget,

Indeed and it appears to confirm that there is some confusion here. Maternal haplogroups are defined by mutations on the mitochondrial DNA. This is nothing to do with the X chromosome.


Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: 1st cousin or half sibling confusions
« on: Sunday 24 February 19 14:05 GMT (UK)  »
Hi Melba_Schmelba ,

Sorry but you are falling into the trap of equating the X-chromosome with the mitochondrial DNA.

The mitochondria is a circular organelle found in the cytoplasm of all cells. It is 16,569 base pairs in length in humans. The mitochondria are involved with day to day energy production at the cellular level. During reproduction, the female ovum or egg contributes the majority of the cytoplasm as well as the female chromosomes, whilst the male usually just provides the male chromosome to the zygote. Thus in general terms the vast majority of cytoplasmic mitochondria develops from the initial female contribution of cytoplasm to the new zygote (Introduction to Genetic Analysis, Griffiths et al. 2015, Freeman Press). The mitochondrial DNA can be compared to a reference DNA  and the subtle differences can allow scientists to classify the mtDNA into haplogroups. These haplogroups can be displayed as  a phylogenetic tree based on the historic development of the genetic mutations of the DNA that come to represent new haplogroups.

This is all completely different from the nuclear chromosomes, which include the sex chromosomes X and Y. These are inherited as pairs, with one chromosome  coming from the male and the other from the female. Thus chromosome 1 pair has a male and female chain, chromosome 2 pair  has one male and one female chain etc up to chromosome 22. These makes up the autosomal DNA.  Then the 23rd chromosome pair are the sex chromosomes; made up of XX (women) or XY (men).

At the website it does state that " The Ancestry DNA test analyzes your entire genome- all 23 pairs of chromosomes.." Consequently, if you then transfer the raw data to GEDmatch you will be able to utilise the X chromosome matching tools, although Ancestry does not report this data specifically within it's pages.

So to sum up mitochondrial DNA is found in the cytoplasm of cells and the 23 pairs of autosomal and sex chromosomes  are found in the cell nucleus. Thus X chromosome  inheritance has nothing to do with mitochondrial DNA. Hope that is clear but I am happy to follow up further.

The brilliant blog "DNA Explained" has several good pages on X chromosome and mtDNA and


Ancestral Family Tree DNA Testing / Re: Y-dna test and a different last name?
« on: Monday 11 February 19 16:04 GMT (UK)  »
Hi TheCaliforniaLife,

I would recommend that you go to the FTDNA Learning Center and find the Webinar entitled "Help, My Y-DNA Matches have a Different Surname" by Elise Friedman or watch here


Hi Fretep,

I presume that you have checked the actual parish register or fiche locally for Mansergh, St  Peter's since nothing exists online before 1813 (baptisms) & 1839 (marriages). Would be great to know what's available.

Many thanks,

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