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Messages - BushInn1746

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1
World War Two / Re: RAF postings
« on: Tuesday 22 May 18 23:25 BST (UK)  »
Hi Liz

Bear in mind the ORB (Operations Record Book) of a Squadron or Unit, mainly deals with the Operations, that the Unit is involved with, along with some general information.

Although early WW2 some Unit ORBs are not as good, at recording the Operations in reasonable detail.

Mark

2
The Common Room / Re: Will and Death date variations
« on: Tuesday 22 May 18 18:28 BST (UK)  »
Having explored various possible discrepancies, have we now established that the real difficulty is that the burial was recorded as 9 Mar 1745, and the will was apparently written on 14 May 1746, 9 weeks and 3 days later?

I'd still like to know if there are any alternative sources for the burial (BTs etc), otherwise I'm wondering if it might be down to a copying error somewhere - March for May or vice versa, and a figure 1 added or omitted. The fact that these dates are in different years complicates it a bit, and I'm not quite sure how to resolve that.

Syd, you do realise that the NBI is incomplete.

Some people were buried in Burial Grounds, Chapels on Country Estates, which have long ceased to exist. Landed people and I've heard of a Quaker and other people being buried on their own Estate, Farm or land.

I've just been asking about a Nonconformist Burial Ground North-east England, we know from the Monumental Inscriptions taken about 200 years ago, that the Burial Ground is at least 300 years old. However, the Burial Registers only survive back to 1792.

A Will being Proved might be the only evidence of the death now.

Mark

3
The Common Room / Re: Will and Death date variations
« on: Tuesday 22 May 18 17:58 BST (UK)  »
Under current English law, marriage invalidates any will written before the marriage (unless, I believe, it is explicitly written in anticipation of marriage to a named spouse-to-be). I don't know what the situation would have been in 1745 or 1746 (or whatever).

See Married Women's Property Act, 1882
Basically, if married after 1882, a woman has been able, under the provisions of the Married Women's Property Act, 1882, to hold any property, and to deal with it, just as though she were a feme sole. So she has if married previously, provided the property has been acquired subsequent to 1882; but not otherwise.
(published in Title Deeds Old and New, 1928)


Then this book Title Deeds Old and New by Francis R. Stead, p.47, also referring to Common Law before the 1882 change in the Law refers to coverture. Jointly seised and curtesy. Then several pages to the end of the chapter.

The wife could not devise by will during coverture ; but, if she survived her husband, she re-entered into full possession of her freehold estates. The husband could not deal with such estates beyond the extent of his interest therein ; nor could the lands, beyond the limit of such interest, be affected by his debts. Together they could alienate ; but in such case it was requisite for the wife to be examined apart by a judge or two commissioners (after 1882, one commissioner).

There is more to it than above. The book also says page 46 ... A Will is revoked by marriage. But, under the new law, a will expressed to be made in contemplation of a marriage is not revoked by the solemnization of the marriage (L.P.A., 1925, Sect. 177.)

The above is NOT to be taken as Legal Advice as parts of the 1928 book will likely be out of date, refers to old Laws too and the above are only bits of the old book text.

Mark

4
The Common Room / Re: Will and Death date variations
« on: Tuesday 22 May 18 16:33 BST (UK)  »
Marriage Licence/Allegations below (partial only)

Could the confusion be that Henry's WILL mentions his "Marriage Articles" dated 7 Nov 1745?

Syd R said "copy held" of the actual marriage record. Would be interesting to see the original parish marriage record and the name of the church.

Hello

Just noticed this thread and took me to this post.

"Marriage Articles" is like a Marriage Settlement relating to landed property.

The date of the "Marriage Articles" is when the property settlement is drawn up in repect of their landed property, or Estate/s.

Mark

5
World War Two / Re: RAF postings
« on: Tuesday 22 May 18 12:32 BST (UK)  »
Hello Liz

The following Volumes were original documents (not microfilmed), so any Reader will require a "Readers Ticket", so ensure you have the required printed address ID and formal photographic ID with you, to prove who you are AND the address where you live at.

See "Visit Us" page before going.

7 STT possibly the following
AIR 29/740
7 School of Technical Training Locking, Innsworth Lane, Gloucester, UK. Includes Movement Instructions. With appendices, May 1940 to April 1944
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C4100449

Abroad
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C7161158

Probably not going to be hugely detailed. Bear in mind some of these Units moved about, but not seen.


Technical Training (search in AIR 29, 1939 to 1945)
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_aq=Technical%20training&_col=0&_cr=AIR%2029&_dss=range&_sd=1939&_ed=1945&_ro=any&_hb=tna&_st=adv


19 Operational Training (search results 1939 to 1945)
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r?_ep=19%20Operational%20training&_col=0&_cr=AIR&_dss=range&_sd=1939&_ed=1945&_ro=any&_hb=tna&_st=adv


You can find some RAF Stations Operations Record Book under "AIR 28"

Mark

6
World War Two / Re: RAF postings
« on: Tuesday 22 May 18 11:15 BST (UK)  »
Hello

1940 Example
Reference to Padgate Thursday 31 Oct and
moved to No 2 Wing, the day after, Friday 1 Nov
http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/ww2peopleswar/stories/56/a7501556.shtml

Tuesday 5 Nov, reference to being  ... posted to Wing 4 Padgate.

Mark

7
World War Two / Re: RAF postings
« on: Tuesday 22 May 18 10:31 BST (UK)  »
Hello

3RC Padgate - 3 Recruitment Centre
1 Wg Cosford - possibly 1 Wing

Mark

8
Yorkshire (West Riding) / Re: Inquest
« on: Saturday 19 May 18 19:53 BST (UK)  »
Hello Jacqueline

Young age too at 23 years old!

Stan's point about that the Coroner wants to establish "the precise circumstances of death" is relevant.

If witnesses were present, the Coroner would likely want to hear first hand what they saw, any mention of pains or health complaints previously, especially if death occurred suddenly or was unatural. Witnesses giving evidence, swear an Oath first.

 ----------

Not much, but regarding Jno C Malcolm

The Yorkshire Evening Post,  Monday 9th January 1893

Two of the deaths inquired into at the Town Hall that afternoon, got into the evening newspaper ...

CAUGHT IN THE FLAMES.
LEEDS AND HORSFORTH BURNING FATALITIES.
This afternoon, the Leeds Borough Coroner, Mr. J. C. Malcolm, held a court at the Town Hall, one of the deaths inquired into being that of Ben Appleyard, aged five, of Cragg Hill, Horsforth, who died at the Leeds Infirmary ...

Mr. Malcolm also held an Inquest upon the body of Isabella Burnell (47), of 11, Blackburn Yard, Holbeck Lane, Leeds, who was admitted to the Infirmary on Friday ...


Both were accidental death. Reference to a Jury in the first case above.


Leeds Coroner 1927 to 1993
Looks like those files went to WYAS, Wakefield
http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/c/F219247

Pity, looks like 1927 is the earliest for Leeds 
https://huddersfield.exposed/offtherecord/index.php/Coroners_records

Mark

9
Yorkshire (West Riding) / Re: Inquest
« on: Friday 18 May 18 16:24 BST (UK)  »
Hi, could any one help find the Inquest for Elizabeth Horne dated 9 Jan 1893 in Leeds. I've got the death cert which states she died from Heart Disease so I'm wondering why it went to the Coroner.


Hello Jacqueline

Possibly a sudden death unknown cause.

Does the certificate say heart disease certified 2 weeks (or other period), suggesting the heart trouble was known about before death?

 ...

Mark


Hi Mark, Death certificate says the cause of death is Heart Disease Natural Causes, so if its natural causes I wonder why there was  a need for an inquest.
Thanks for your help
Jacqueline


There are, however, exceptions to this general rule; sometimes, the precise circumstances of death are only determined at inquest, and a coroner might then be able to give a verdict of natural causes.
See http://jcp.bmj.com/content/53/5/340


Stan


Hello Jacqueline

If a person drops dead suddenly or collapses and is pronounced dead, the cause of death to begin with appears sudden and unknown, perhaps even unatural. The Coroner would have been notified and relatives and witnesses would be called to an Inquest (probably at a local public house), usually that evening or the following day.

The Coroner after Inquiring was obviously satisfied either by the witness evidence and/or an Examining Doctor present that heart disease caused the death and therefore has returned natural causes.

 ----------

I have an 1870 example of an ancestor's brother, William Hood dying 5th July 1870 aged 54 who had been out digging up potatoes at his home called Byefield that morning, walked about two miles into the nearby town of Selby, and collapsed in front of his mother Sarah Hood at their premises and died. They still had an Inquest, it appeared he had been troubled before, but died suddenly from natural causes, probably heart disease, was returned.

Mark


Added: do you have the Coroner's name and building name / pub name where the Inquest was held? Due to OCR scanning of old newspaper type face, I cannot find her searching name only? Not all were published.

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