Author Topic: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?  (Read 5351 times)

Offline buskin

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WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« on: Sunday 28 May 06 22:02 BST (UK) »
My mother was taken from her family in approx: 1906 along with her two brothers. Her name was Jane Ann Weldridge, her dad was Nicholas and mam Bridget/brigid. She was put in a convent orphanage, and never saw her family until the day she died. She lived in Baldoyle, Co: Dublin. The family is on the 1901 census, but is not on the 1911 census. She married my dad in Dublin. He was in the Free State Army, and she in service. She left Ireland on the day she married and left for Liverpool the same day.
She never knew why she and her brothers were put in an orphanage, but presumed her dad had died. When she died in 1979 i started searching, and two years ago managed to contact family members of her two brothers.
One side didn't want to know and didn't think their gran
would put a child in an orphanage, although they heard a vague rumour that their grandparents had a sister.
Fortunately, the other brothers family were very friendly
and we met in Dublin last year, a 100 years after it happened. From what we gleaned, her two older brothers went to the orphanage to bring her out, but they were told she had died, so away they went. It's sad to reflect
that when eventually she was put into service her mam and brothers were only a couple of miles away.
However here's the rub, i was taken to her grave [unmarked] in the old Kinseely cemetery. Later after a few drinks in the 'Sheaf of Wheat' an old relative started to open up and, said not to judge my gran to harshly, as it was very possible the children were taken from her because of her rebel leanings and activities. This stunned me, and then went on to say she was in and out of Kilmainham and Wicklow jails.
The following day we went to Kilmainham and saw the
archivist, who said many many names were not recorded, though one was close to it a 'Brigid Bryan' as opposed to Bridget 'Brien, but as the copy was indistinct, it was possible it was her, but couldn't be sure[i'm not sure either], did i know which organisation  she was with. Of course i didn't know. On talking further with the guide/historian, he suggested the church could have had them removed. I have had a trace and search done for Nicholas from 1901-1910 with no results. I couldn't understand this as mam thought he died about 1906. However later on that night my son in law who is a helicopter instructor, and who helped train the garda helicopter crew in Liverpool on the merseyside helicopter was doing a return meet with some of the garda lads, so that night he mentioned it to one of the old retired officers. He looked at him, and said if it's true he was involved with the cause, it could have been as simple as he was spotted on his own, and quitely dropped.
Therefore, no Name, no grave, no record. But i find all this hard to believe, whilst not doubting anyone's voracity.
SO. Are there any records of members of the organisations active at the time, or any suggestions. I believe Larkin and Connoly recruited in the Coolock area.
My grandad was Nicholas Weldridge, though michael at birth, and my gran was Bridget 'brien/O'brien or Bridget Weldridge.
Any suggestions would be welcome.

Offline kintree

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #1 on: Monday 29 May 06 20:24 BST (UK) »
Buskin

It is one of the features of rebel organisations that they are NOT documented - they have to remain as invisible as possible.

However with an unusual name like Weldridge it should be easy to check GRO records of birth, marriage and death.  Have you done so ?

Can you clarify when your parents married ?

Adrian
STEVENSON County Derry;  KINSMAN;  BATTERSBY Dublin

Offline buskin

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 31 May 06 21:37 BST (UK) »
Hi,Thank you for your reply Adrian.
To clarify further. I know Nicholas's birth date, and i have a copy of his marriage to Bridget 'Brien. I also have the 1901
census for Baldoyle showing them all alive and living in Baldoyle Co. Dublin with the children, but they are not there on the 1911 census. Nicholas was an agricultural labourer, and from my mams recollection, she was put in the convent orphanage at approx: 6years old. I paid a researcher[admittedly an Australian one] to check with the GRO, and he reported that there was no trace of Nicholas 5 years either side of 1906[mam being born in 1900] for any record. Although, he was specifically looking for a death. The name has been written as Woldridge/Wildridge, but he said he checked those as well. So unless he was kidding me, and didn't check, for which i cannot see why he would do this, i am left with the mystery as to why he isn't on the GRO records.
The old relation i spoke to seem to think that Bridget Weldridge kasted well into the 1950s, but i'm not certain about this as there was no headstone on her plot, just the bare earth.
My own Mam & Dad married on the 31st October 1929 at
the Catholic Church of Terenure.
Dad- Cornelius McEnery - Soldier- collins Barracks.
Mam- Jane Anne Weldridge - in service - Eaton Sq: Terenure.
The only other tentative clue as to think the old chap might have been right in saying the children were taken from them because of their activities, is the fact that the O'Briens had a large extended family, and surely would have taken the kid's in if something untoward had happened, but they never. Or, never had the chance to.
That's about it, unless you want more info:, but once again, thanks for the reply.But how stupid of me not to have thought of the point you made about secret organisations :-[ the brain must be getting banjacksed!!GG.

Offline kintree

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 10 June 06 13:56 BST (UK) »
GG

I note that 2 Weldridge births (Owen & William Joseph) and one infant death (William Joseph) are recorded in London in 1907 & 1908 - could these be connected ?  Could Nicholas and Bridget (or Nicholas without Bridget) have put children in care in Dublin, and gone on to establish a new family in London ?

Adrian
STEVENSON County Derry;  KINSMAN;  BATTERSBY Dublin


Offline buskin

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 10 June 06 21:17 BST (UK) »
Hi Adrian, Many thanks for your time and effort on this, but no!, bridget stayed with her family, minus Nicholas, who can't be traced, and later with her son Terence and his son Nicholas in Coolock. The family in Coolock say they have no idea what happened to nicholas. Which is really the main search. But they cannot throw any light whatsoever on his demise. Except to say that my mam had the orphan bit wrong, but, bearing in mind she was only about six, i wonder what she really thought as a little girl.
I am aware of Owen Weldridge, and though loosely related,
and from Dublin. He, unfortunately is not the key.
However, thank you once again from the bottom of my
 heart. i suppose i'll not find the truth this side of the veil gg.
Kind Regards, tony [buskin] Mc:

Offline Christopher

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 14 June 06 14:18 BST (UK) »
Hiya Folks,

I am surprised that there are no records. I'm not convinced that Larkin was organising a secret society.
Was he not attempting to organise unskilled workers into a Trade Union? http://struggle.ws/cc1913/ica.html

Chris

Offline kintree

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 14 June 06 22:20 BST (UK) »
Buskin

Christopher has a point - I was carried away by the thread title, and failed to consider socialist organisations. Not that I am about to point you to any specific records! But you should try Christopher's link, and web-search more generally for archives of socialist organisations in Dublin.

Adrian
STEVENSON County Derry;  KINSMAN;  BATTERSBY Dublin

Offline Christopher

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 14 June 06 23:26 BST (UK) »
Hiya Adrian and Tony,

This article is worth reading. It gives a historical background to many of the events in Ireland. There is a phrase near the beginning of this lengthy article "He who does not learn from history will forever be doomed to repeat it." That phrase is similar to one which I like by Sir Winston Churchill "If we open a quarrel between past and present, we shall find that we have lost the future." http://www.marxist.com/ireland/republicanism_intro.html

Christopher

Offline buskin

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Re: WELDRIDGE/ Rebel Organisations?
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 18 June 06 20:53 BST (UK) »
Hi Adrian and Christopher. Please accept my apology for not answering earlier. I have been having trouble posting my reply to you both, which i promise you was longer than this one.
Let me say that i appreciate both of your replies, and will follow up your suggestion about the labour movements
records. When i posed the question it was a wide generality, hoping to illicit the widest possible type of replies, to generate fresh ideas for myself, which i could pursue. This i will do.
The reason i mentioned Coolock in connection with Larkin and Connolly, is that it was one of it's main recruiting areas, but nothing more than that. I also accept that Larkin was a true labour organiser, and had no plan for a subversive rebel movement. However after the general strike collapsed in 1914 after the 1913
lockout, in which over 20,000 workers took part. it collapsed when starvation forced the workers to return to their jobs. During this period because of police brutality
directed at the strikers Connelly had formed the Irish Citizen Army in 1913, so already elements of the labour movement had been shoved over into the military side of revolt. Maybe Larkin did not embrace this, but Connelly certainly did.
Anyway Chris/Adrian if i get over to your genealogy get together in 2007 maybe we can chew the fat ;).
All this to one side though, all i'm really trying to do is find Nicholas's last resting  place and year of his death, because it would appear it certainly wasn't when mam was put in the horrible orphanage.
Kind regards.
Tony [buskin] Mc: