Author Topic: GEORGE John  (Read 3888 times)

Offline geopet544

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GEORGE John
« on: Friday 12 November 04 11:29 GMT (UK) »
Can anyone help me with John George (my great, great grandfather) married to Jane Davies - I only know about them from their son's birth cert -  EVAN GEORGE born 4th July 1843 at Tregaron - but no DOB, POB or anything else - and estimated dates put them outside any Online databases I know about.
Note that all subsequent Georges (to 1930+) lived in and around Merthyr Tydfil - is it likely that they were there before 1843 also?
[Note that I have also posted this on Glamorgan Board]
GEORGE;  HARE;  GREEN

Offline Arranroots

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 30 June 05 14:07 BST (UK) »
Hi Geopet

sorry you have not had any replies on this.

Are you still looking for the information or has the Glamorgan board produced any results for you?

kind regards, Arranroots  ;)
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
SOM: BIRD, BURT aka BROWN - HEF: BAUGH, LATHAM, CARTER, PRITCHARD - GLS: WEBB, WORKMAN, LATHAM, MALPUS - WIL: WEBB, SALTER - RAD: PRITCHARD, WILLIAMS - GLA: RYAN, KEARNEY, JONES, HARRY - MON: WEBB, MORGAN, WILLIAMS, JONES, BIRD - SCOTLAND: HASTINGS, CAMERON, KELSO, BUCHANAN, BETHUNE/ BEATON - IRELAND: RYAN (WATERFORD), KEARNEY (DUBLIN), BOYLE(DUNDALK)

Offline geopet544

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #2 on: Friday 01 July 05 14:49 BST (UK) »
No - no replies on either, I'm afraid
GEORGE;  HARE;  GREEN

Offline D ap D

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #3 on: Friday 01 July 05 15:27 BST (UK) »
Not easy this one.

There are 2 Evan GEORGEs in 1861, both born in Caron (interchangeable with Tregaron), one of whom is a "son" of Catherine and Charles. He is born in 1845, so we can discount him.

The other is a servant, born 1844 in Caron. This sounds promising, but still doesn't confirm he's the one you're looking for.

I can send the image if you want - just PM me.

You've got his birth cert:
George, Evan
September qtr  1843; Tregaron, Cardiganshire ; Volume:    27 ; Page:    63

I had a look at the other BMD for Cardiganshire, but they seem incomplete, so no joy there either.

I would say that the family was from the Tregaron are, Evans father probably a mine worker (my lot from Tregaron worked in the lead mines), who moved down to the coal mines around Merthyr when the coal industry picked up.

On the IGI I found:

JANE GEORGE ,  Female    Birth:  07 SEP 1827   
 Christening:  03 OCT 1827   Bwlchygwynt Calvinistic Methodist, Caron-Is-Clawdd, Cardigan, Wales
  Father:  THOMAS GEORGE
  Mother:  MARY LLOYD     
  Batch No.:   C102661 

JOHN GEORGE, Male,
 Birth:  11 JUN 1831   
 Christening:  19 JUL 1831   Bwlchygwynt Calvinistic Methodist, Caron-Is-Clawdd, Cardigan, Wales
  Father:  THOMAS GEORGE
  Mother:  MARY LLOYD     
   Batch No.:    C102661 

Although not your John and Jane, there could well be a connection. The christenings in Bwlychygwynt only go up to 1837 though.
(BTW that is where my Tregaron lot went to chapel as well)

I mentioned on another thread that the Ceredigion archives / library has the 1851 census indexed. They are really helpful, so I'd try them. They might be able to point you in the right direction, or where else to look.

Stuck with:
William Williams of Llanllyfni
John Jones in Llanelli
Evan Evans in Caio
David Davies of Llansanffraid
Evans: Caio/Carms
Jones: CDG, DEN

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Nor do I think that any other nation than this of Wales, or any other tongue, whatever may hereafter come to pass, shall on the day of the great reckoning before the Most High Judge, answer for this corner of the earth": The Old Man of Pencader to Henry II


Offline geopet544

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #4 on: Monday 04 July 05 11:32 BST (UK) »
Firstly, very many thanks for the trouble you have clearly gone to. I do have Evan's birth cert, and his father John was a Tailor - so not a mineworker, although your point about workers moving to Glamorgan in pursuit of mine or mine-related work is well taken and very probably explains the move. But Evan's D.O.B. (1843) implies a likely date for John (and Jane) of 1825 at the latest, and could be many years earlier.
Do you have access to an 1841 census or any other ideas?
Cheers
Peter George
GEORGE;  HARE;  GREEN

Offline geopet544

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #5 on: Monday 04 July 05 11:42 BST (UK) »
Further to my note above, I have (from the really helpful people at Ceredigion) a sniff of a John George baptised 4 June 1815 son of David & Elizabeth George, Penyddol, Tregaron - and this David George was also a Tailor. Can you try looking for them in your early censuses or other source?
Many thanx
GEORGE;  HARE;  GREEN

Offline davierj

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #6 on: Thursday 18 August 05 00:05 BST (UK) »
There are a number of George families all tailors in Tregaron in 1841, the heads are Thomas 55,  David 25, Stephan 70 and P???  25.   Here I think is yours:

1841 Census for Tregaron, HO107/1376/1  Enumeration District 2, Page 7
All surnames George

David         45     Tailor
Elizabeth   40
JOHN         20
David        15
Jane          15
Male          10       the writing is indistinct
Elizabeth    5
Mary           4
Catherine    3

Hope this fits, cheers Dave
Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk   Research:   Clements, Jenkins, Jones, Williams, Davies, Renfrey in Cardiganshire.   Trow, Jones, Clayton in Montgomeryshire.  Renfrey, Datsun, May, Stephens in Cornwall.   Foster in Liverpoo.l   Milliner, Fry, in Gloucestershire.  Mawby, Popple in Rutland.   Kent, Fry, Robinson, Nott, Griffiths in Somerset.   Willis in Oxfordshire.   Fishlock, Snell, Fry, in Wiltshire

Offline geopet544

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #7 on: Thursday 18 August 05 10:45 BST (UK) »
Firstly, very many thanks for your kind assistance.
It certainly looks as though it is them. To prove it, I need to find them in the 1851 Census;
John married a Jane Davies - but I don't have the date - but it would be after 1841 as she is not in your census transcription, and (presumably) before 1843 when their son Evan [Euan?] was born in Tregaron.
It seems very pushy of me - but do you have access to the 1851 Census?
Also, can you email me an image of the 1841 ebtry?

Yours hopefully,

Peter George
GEORGE;  HARE;  GREEN

Offline davierj

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Re: GEORGE John
« Reply #8 on: Thursday 18 August 05 20:02 BST (UK) »
Hi Peter,

Glad to be of help.   I think it's a very reasonable request.   However, I don't have access to the 1851 census and I've tried to copy the page on the 1841 and the program will not let me ???.   Probably something technical to do with copyright etc.   It may be an idea to post a separate request for a 1851 lookup.

Incidently I also found the ladies at Aber Record Office most helpful with a tricky problem I had.   Adderchog!

Cheers Dave

Census information is Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk   Research:   Clements, Jenkins, Jones, Williams, Davies, Renfrey in Cardiganshire.   Trow, Jones, Clayton in Montgomeryshire.  Renfrey, Datsun, May, Stephens in Cornwall.   Foster in Liverpoo.l   Milliner, Fry, in Gloucestershire.  Mawby, Popple in Rutland.   Kent, Fry, Robinson, Nott, Griffiths in Somerset.   Willis in Oxfordshire.   Fishlock, Snell, Fry, in Wiltshire