1851 census Margaret and Samuel Davies please

[chrisjen]

Any help greatly appreciated in looking up Margaret and Samuel Davies/Davis, Margaret around 28, Samuel around 25, in 1851 Census of Cynwyl/Conwyl Elfed. At long last due to David Pinkney's help, I think I might have their marriage certificate!  The marriage certificate I've received states they were married in Conwyl Elfed in 1845, but doesn't give residence at time of marriage, so I thought it might be worth checking banns in Carmarthen Records Office for any possible info on this.   The certificate also states Samuel's father was John Davies, Flintsman, which I haven't come across before, also witnesses were Thomas Jeremy and David Edward.   Both Margaret and Samuel were listed as servants so I'm assuming they were employed away from home.

Thanks for any thoughts or suggestions!
Chris

[osprey]

Do you have them on any other census to give clues?

this is a possible
Cenvy Row, Kidwelly H0107/2469 folio 182 pg 13
Samuel Davies head mar 29 ag lab b. parish of Llannewydd
Margaret wife 29 b. parish of Llannewydd
David son 2 b. borough of Kidwelly
Catherine Phillips lodger 43

Llannewydd is the parish next to Conwil Elfed. Not entirely sure about the name of the row but the description of the district mentions Cenfi. This could be the family who are in Llantwit juxta Neath in 1861 at RG9/4087 folio 70 pg 7.
  

[down-under]

Would this be your David Edward??

1851 H0107/2474 folio 167 page 9 Conwil Elfet Carmarthenshire

David Edward age 33 Millers lab Conwil
Mary age 34 NewChurch
Harriet age 12 Chrldren born Conwil
David age 10
John age 7
Ann age 3
Mary age 1

Pam

[osprey]

I've had a look on the 1841 and there's a possible for Samuel
Newchurch H0107/1383/21 folio 16 pg 1
Samuel Davies 15 ag lab
Benjamin Davies 15 ag lab
possibly employed by William Jones

Also in Newchurch is this interesting family
Fynondrain(?) H0107/1383/21 folio 26 pg 4
John Davies 50 Army P (I assume pensioner)
Rachel 30
Ann 9
Sarah 7
David 5
William 2
John 6
all born in county

which led me to this family in 1851
Gate Bwlchclawdd(?), Llangeler H0107/2482 folio 309 pg 16
John Davies head mar 68 East India Company pensioner b. Cardigan, Llechryd
Rachel wife 41 b. Carms, Pembrey
William son 13 scholar b. Pembrey
John son 9 scholar b. Llannewydd
Margaret dau 7 b. Llangeler
James son 3 b. Llangeler

think that John's age should have been 6 months in 1841 as he was the last entry and the rest were in age order. I haven't checked flintsman on an old occupations site, but assume it was something to do with guns which would go nicely with being an army pensioner, and I believe there are records of pensioners - try the Armed Forces board.  
 

[chrisjen]

Many thanks Osprey, and down-under, you've given me a marvellous amount of info to follow up!   I did find Samuel and Margaret on 1851 Kidwelly, but greatly appreciate the checking of Conwil in case there was another couple with the same names.   They have eluded me for 2 years, I've searched records in Carmarthen RO, for marriages, and finally found them after widening the search!   It wasn't helped by the variety of places born shown on the different census records.

In my ignorance, I thought Flintsman could be something to do with quarrying,  so this is a great lead to follow up, together with the record on David Edward, it looks finally as if I'm getting results thanks to your help!

Many thanks for your time and effort,
Chris

[osprey]

Try as I might, I can find no reference to a flintsman. It seemed to ring a bell with me, but perhaps I was getting confused with flintlock. I really hope it was something military as I rather like the look of that family. Perhaps it would be worth a query on the armed forces board and I'll go back to my parallel universe where Davies families are easy to find in Wales.    

[chrisjen]

Osprey, thanks again for checking on "Flintsman", I've tried as well on various military sites, no luck so far.   I did have some success with National Archives on East India pensioners, found records of all John Davies, I tried to narrow fields down using birthplace, but so far couldn't find Llangeler.   

Because John is so much older than Rachel in 1841, I suspect she could be his second wife, did some searching on Cardigan/Carmarthen marriages, came up with two possibles, one in Conwyl 1833, a John Davies is shown as widower, the second is 1830 Penboyr,  a John Davies with a birthplace of Llangeler, using the age of the first child, Ann, shown in 1841, either could fit!  I looked up Parish records for births/baptisms in Llangeler, it looks like they were destroyed by floods in 1861!!  Typical, I thought to myself!  I was hoping to find Samuel's birth, or maybe even John's.   Even in a flight of fantasy I thought that the Samuel and Benjamin Davies aged 15 in 1841 could be twins!

As you suggest, I'll try the Armed Forces board, some kind soul might know the answer.

Regards
Chris

[osprey]

Ages on the 1841 census were usually rounded down for people over 15, so Samuel and Benjamin are both between 15 and 19. I wondered about Rachel being the second wife, but as her age is rounded down, she's between 30 and 34, so that's feasible. Could be first marriage if he's been in India for years. I think that John was the only John Davies in Newchurch old enough to be Samuel's father.

All the best with your research.