Author Topic: ROBINS,DEACON,SHELLY,THOMPSON,SHARGOOL Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAFFORD  (Read 7777 times)

Offline viddavid

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Re: ROBINS Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAFFORD
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 09 March 08 17:35 GMT (UK) »
Hello Cathy,
That is a very kind offer. I have had some help from Malinda Law an archivist at the Staffordshire Record Office. She was able to find by searching admissions and discharge register ( Volume D659/1/4/12 ) quite a lot of information. She also searched the Guardians' Minutes ( DD659/1/1/15) to find Ernest left the workhouse to be apprenticed to Henry SPRAGGINS of Stafford as a shoe finisher. This was one piece of good fortune as after his second marriage Ernest was able to open his own shoe shop in Salisbury Wiltshire thanks to learning a trade.
There may be other scraps of information in the volumes of Guardians' Minutes waiting to be discovered as they are not indexed and vary in content depending on the clerk who wrote them. I'm sure you will have a fascinating time but take a box of tissues so your tears don't damage the records. As you can imagine I will be overjoyed if you find something new.

David :)
ROBINS Richmond Birmingham Stafford UK Chicago Ill.USA.
TURNER London UK
GREENHALF London UK
McGIVERN Armagh, Castleblaney & Leitrim, Ireland
McHUGH Leitrim Ireland
TIMMIS Richmond Surrey Stafford
WILSON Letterkenny Ireland,Ayr Scotland
DNA R-FGC51610  K1a10a

Offline viddavid

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Re: ROBINS Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAFFORD
« Reply #10 on: Monday 31 March 08 13:49 BST (UK) »

There is another address : 46 Newport Road Stafford. I don't know who lived there.....yet.

Still haven't tracked this down as early census doesn't have house numbers. Any ideas ?
ROBINS Richmond Birmingham Stafford UK Chicago Ill.USA.
TURNER London UK
GREENHALF London UK
McGIVERN Armagh, Castleblaney & Leitrim, Ireland
McHUGH Leitrim Ireland
TIMMIS Richmond Surrey Stafford
WILSON Letterkenny Ireland,Ayr Scotland
DNA R-FGC51610  K1a10a

Offline SamaraDan

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Re: ROBINS,DEACON,SHELLY,THOMPSON,SHARGOOL Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAFFORD
« Reply #11 on: Monday 16 November 09 22:50 GMT (UK) »
I have just found your message about the inhabitants of Gothic Cottage, White Lion Street, Stafford.  My Shargool family lived in Stafford.  Edwin Shargool was organist st St Mary's for several years.  Do you have a first name for the Shargool person?  What date was the census?

It is some time since I researched this branch of the family but there was a baby Shargool which gave me problems. It appeared and then disappeared.

SamaraDan

Offline viddavid

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Re: ROBINS,DEACON,SHELLY,THOMPSON,SHARGOOL Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAF
« Reply #12 on: Monday 16 November 09 23:58 GMT (UK) »
Hello SamaraDan,
From the 1871 England census for Staffordshire-Castle Church-District 7-Page9
Pheobe M Shargool
Age:   17
Estimated Birth Year:   abt 1854
Relation:   Boarder
Gender:   Female
Where born:   Stafford, Staffordshire, England
Civil parish:   Castle Church
Ecclesiastical parish:   St Paul
Town:   Stafford
County/Island:   Staffordshire
Country:   England
Registration district:   Stafford
Sub-registration district:   Castle Church

The latest info I have on Ernest and Arthur ROBINS is that the mother was probably an Elizabeth TIMMIS

Regards

ROBINS Richmond Birmingham Stafford UK Chicago Ill.USA.
TURNER London UK
GREENHALF London UK
McGIVERN Armagh, Castleblaney & Leitrim, Ireland
McHUGH Leitrim Ireland
TIMMIS Richmond Surrey Stafford
WILSON Letterkenny Ireland,Ayr Scotland
DNA R-FGC51610  K1a10a


Offline SamaraDan

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Re: ROBINS,DEACON,SHELLY,THOMPSON,SHARGOOL Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAFFORD
« Reply #13 on: Tuesday 17 November 09 10:39 GMT (UK) »
Thank you, viddavid,  for that quick reply!
Phebe(no "o" for some reason in the document I saw) Mary Shargool, Born 29 March 1854, in Stafford, was the daughter of Edwin Shargool, the Organist and "Professor of Music" at St Mary's Stafford and his wife, Mary Hart, whose date of death coincides with Phebe's birth. Phebe was later a music teacher who married a widower, Thomas Kent in Nov 1898 in Seighford `parish Church.  He had a son, Reuben Kent from his first marriage. I don't think Phebe had any children. She had two sisters, Mary Louisa and Amy Frances who both died young.

The puzzling Shargool I mentioned was a baby, Emily Mary Shargool, who died in 1882 in the Foregate Street area.  Her parents were said to be Hezekiah Shargool and Eliza Chivas.  Hezekiah "made his mark" which for a Shargool was surprising as they all seemed to be well educated.  I have so far not found this couple in the 1881 census or anywhere else!

Offline viddavid

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Re: ROBINS,DEACON,SHELLY,THOMPSON,SHARGOOL Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAFFORD
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 27 April 11 16:12 BST (UK) »
Hello SamaraDan,

Still plodding away with this. I came across a Hezekiah Shall in the 1891 census. A boarder aged 54 , a chain maker, born Walsall Staffordshire. RG12/ 2253/ 66 p 43.

Regards

David
ROBINS Richmond Birmingham Stafford UK Chicago Ill.USA.
TURNER London UK
GREENHALF London UK
McGIVERN Armagh, Castleblaney & Leitrim, Ireland
McHUGH Leitrim Ireland
TIMMIS Richmond Surrey Stafford
WILSON Letterkenny Ireland,Ayr Scotland
DNA R-FGC51610  K1a10a

Offline SamaraDan

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Re: ROBINS,DEACON,SHELLY,THOMPSON,SHARGOOL Gothic Cottage White Lion Street STAFFORD
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 27 April 11 20:24 BST (UK) »
Interesting,viddavid, so he might not have been a Shargool after all, although the father of the baby was called Hezekiah Shargool.  Not a very usual name.  Thank you for giving me food for thought. Hezekiah couldn't write his name so that might have been someone's guess about his name.  I haven't been looking at genealogy for some time but these problems do stay around until they're solved.  All the best to your own research.

Offline gilaves

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My thoughts on Ernest's parentage due to the list of people who shared accommodation is that one of the Irish men was Ernest's father due to the DNA showing 29.1% Irish Scottish, and Welsh DNA the rest is English 50% and Scandinavian the remainder. If there is Irish DNA in it to that extent then somewhere he had strong Irish origins and seeing the races involved in the people in that house I would go for one of them as the father. But what of the claim she was married to Austin before my grandfather Ernest or the youngest Ann or Arthur were born.
 To surmise, the situation looks very dubious, she seems to be drifting between men, and I imagine a sort of um an unstable person, who  had children accidentally, or based on trust of one of these men. It would be different if she had one but three!!!! she must have thought that man was going to hang around unless she was truly fickle. Then hiding behind this man Austin after she had three children, after all who put her name down in that census saying  the father was Austin, was he in fact always the father, but wouldn't commit. I don't think so, I think more likely its one of the Irish men, who let her down. Then, Austin didn't want to take them on Ernest, Arthur and Anne, and they ended up boarding in Birmingham and then in the workhouse.

Has anyone ever considered they might be the by product of an Itinerant Irishman?? has anyone looked up the records if there are any on that basis.
Based on the DNA we think that Wilson is the father, because the amount of Irish DNA in my match would have to be accounted for by Ernest's father  most likely being Irish and as they said in the records Scottish also, which is stated. All the Scandinavian names have son on the end
 The DNA was 18% Scandinavian so Wilson for the Irish Scottish  reference and the son on the end of his name, it fits. Maybe a search about him would come up with something.
 The other thing which puzzles me is Anne what happened to her, did she die, did she marry have children if so her predecessors must be out there somewhere.  ( my husband as you will gather from the name Mahoney is Irish and put together these proposals incidentally). There has to be a lot of Irish Scottish Welsh blood in Ernest and Arthur for the percentage to come out so high.