Author Topic: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community  (Read 30340 times)

Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #27 on: Monday 07 April 08 18:27 BST (UK) »


This must have been taken the same day as the one Dave gave us !!  ;D some pretty powerful men there !!


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Offline Barbara.H

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #28 on: Monday 07 April 08 18:46 BST (UK) »
Wonderful - they are handsome indeed - look a bit fed up at having to sit still though don't they?

But - Why has Migky's post of the marriage certificate been removed?
It was not of the original certificate. why would Migky have that? It is already online elsewhere.
Hope you are not on the naughty step Migky, seems unfair to me if you are.  ???

For anyone else who still wants to see the certificate it is here:

http://www.british-genealogy.com/forums/showthread.php?t=9080

then here:

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c214/uksearch2003/INDIAN.jpg



LANCS:  Greenwood, Greenhalgh, Fishwick, Berry,
CHES/DERBYS:  Vernon
YORKS/LINCS: Watson, Stamford, Bartholomew,
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

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Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #29 on: Monday 07 April 08 19:10 BST (UK) »
"In 1947 ... an attraction named 'Frogman Divers' ....operated by 3 demobilised midget submarine divers, one of whom possessed a Victoria Cross, who put on a display in which the public saw the divers getting through a replica of a midget sub's airlock with equipment, to make their way through mock obstruction nets"  [from Looking Back at Belle Vue by Robert Nicholls]

It took me a long time to work out that it was the submarines that were midgets, not the divers  ::) Anyway, the VC holder was Ian Edward Fraser, who was a colleague of James Magennis the Irish VC holder

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Edward_Fraser

Is serendipity a posh word for 'wandering off topic'?   ;) :D ;)

Barbara


Anyone fancy his book http://www.rootschat.com/links/0359/

By the time I got there Ken ..... the bidding had ended !!   ::)

But look at all these wonderful soldiers you have there in Manchester .... the place is inundated with them !!  :) you should have a ball chasing all these !!  :)

Barbara ... serendipity means anything you want it to mean !!  :D :D :D
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Be who you are and say what you feel -  because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind ! Dr. Seuss

Erect no gravestone .... let the Rose every year bloom for his sake ! Rilke Sonnets to Orpheus, I

Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #30 on: Wednesday 09 April 08 03:24 BST (UK) »


Thought you might like this ....  ::)

http://www.tomdavisartifacts.com/prints.htm

RED SHIRT

Not much is know about Red Shirt except that he was of the same tribe as Sitting Bull - that of the Hunkpapa Souix.  He was at the Battle of the Little Big Horn and was typical of the warriors of the period of the 1860's. He was a chief and followed Sitting Bull until the Surrender to General Miles of the U.S. Army.  Richard Wallace has striven to show the pride and defiance of the warriors who face inevitable and overwhelming odds at the hands of the U.S. Army


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Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #31 on: Wednesday 09 April 08 05:11 BST (UK) »


Surrounded by the Enemy in Salford

The mystery of where a Sioux warrior - who died in Salford 120 years ago - lies buried has been solved.

The man, named Surrounded by the Enemy, came to the north west as part of Buffalo Bill's circus in 1887 and was thought to have been buried on what is now the site of the BBC's new Media City complex in Salford.

But a policeman has traced his grave more than 200 miles away to Brompton Cemetery, a Royal park in west London.

Pc Nigel Keane, of the Metropolitan Police, said: "I suspect they brought his body down to London by train so he could be buried near his fellow Lakota warrior Paul Eagle Star.

"He was buried without any ceremony which I expect means he was not a Christian convert."

Article: http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/s/1018337_sioux_mystery_solved

Quote
I have recently been in contact with the Supervisor of Brompton Cemetery, London, and I can pass on the information that it is a matter of official record that Surrounded by the Enemy was buried there on the 15th of December 1887, and NOT in Salford.

I recently wrote an article for the Thunderbird North American Indian Society about this, so if anyone wants the details, just ask.

Four other Indians from the Wild West show were buried at Brompton. Of these, the remains of Paul Eagle Star, Long Wolf and a little girl named Star Ghost Dog were repatriated to South Dakota during the 1990s. Insofar as I am able to determine, just one - an eighteen month old boy named Red Penny - is still there, but my investigations are continuing.

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Erect no gravestone .... let the Rose every year bloom for his sake ! Rilke Sonnets to Orpheus, I

Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #32 on: Wednesday 09 April 08 05:15 BST (UK) »


Some smashing pictures on this site ....... check it out !! some we haven't seen before !!  :)

During the early reservation period, there were three men named Red Shirt living on Pine Ridge. Just a caution for the possibility of confusing the various individuals.

http://lbha.proboards12.com/index.cgi?board=Indians&action=display&thread=1160400266&page=1


The Red Shirt appearing in the photographs and who traveled with the Buffalo Bill Wild West Show was, as already noted, a member of the Wagluhe or Loafer Band, generally considered to be a mixture of Oglala and Brule.

In an interview in 1923, Red Shirt noted that he was born near a fort on the Platte River in Wyoming, the name of which he could not recall. Hans recently forwarded a reference to me that indicated Red Shirt was born near Orin Junction. For those of you not from Wyoming, Orin is roughly twenty miles downstream from Fort Fetterman.

Several books have indicated that Red Shirt was the son of Red Dog. This is incorrect. I have not been able to locate the original reference for this information but it is possible that this was a reference to one of the other Red Shirts (Remember, Red Dog was a Hunkpapa who married into the Oyuhpe Oglala).

Several sources indicate that our Red Shirt was the son of a white man and a Lakota mother. We do not yet know their names.

A young man named Red Shirt was part of the 1870 delegation to Washington D.C., though I can not say for certain that this was him. By the time of the Great Sioux War of 1876-77, he was a rising young man within one of the military societies, an "up and coming" individual among the Wagluhe. This band had been led by the prominent headman Big Mouth, until he was shot and killed by Spotted Tail; Big Mouth's brother Blue Horse by the mid-1870s was the most influential member of this band. In the fall of 1876 as the army dismounted and disarmed the agency bands, Blue Horse was arrested by Gen. Mackenzie for not turning in northern Indians slipping into his village. After that, Blue Horse seems to disappear from prominence, perhaps he stepped back from active political engagement. In this vacuum, several young men emerged as leaders among the Wagluhe, most prominently American Horse and Three Bears. Red Shirt seems to be most closely associated with Three Bears during this period; perhaps kind of his lieutenant.

Given his association with the Loafers, I doubt that Red Shirt was at the Little Bighorn, though we should note that a number of young men had gone out independently from their band. In later years, newspaper articles about the Wild West Show specifically stated that Red Shirt was at the Little Bighorn, but that should be taken with some skeptism, given the Buffalo Bill Cody PR machine. No doubt it was good for business for the Indians in his show to be advertised as having been at the LBH. But the possibility cannot be entirely discounted without further research.

Red Shirt became leader of a small band of Loafers on Pine Ridge about 1878-79. In his 1923 interview, he showed commissioners his chief's certificate dated 1879 signed by the Commissioner of Indian Affairs and the Secretary of the Interior. In 1880, he traveled to Carlisle Barracks and on to Washington D.C. with Red Cloud.

Red Shirt's leadership role appears to have only lasted a few years. He soon became involved with the Wild West Shows which seems to be his main economic support for the next several decades. We will have to do some more research into his final decade to know if he became involved again at all in Oglala politics. He died in 1925
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Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #33 on: Thursday 10 April 08 00:52 BST (UK) »


Buffalo Bill's Wild West show

Tuesday April 28, 1903
guardian.co.uk

Upper Chorlton Road continues to be one of the busiest thoroughfares in Manchester, and after a fortnight of abnormal tramway traffic, constantly crowded footpaths, an army of zealous hawkers and a generous provision of police, the residents have almost forgotten the former secluded character of their district. The Wild West Show has achieved something very substantial in drawing so many Lancashire people to a suburb which is two miles from the railway stations and which is not easily reached by an almost unlimited number of persons within a limited period - say an hour in the afternoon and an hour in the evening - even with the assistance of the splendid electric car service. For, as always, everybody wishes to go by car at the same time, and, however long the procession of cars may be, it must have a limit, and that this limit has left the demand unsatisfied has been shown by the fact that the sixpenny buses and waggonettes from the city, not to mention the cabs, have done excellent business. On Saturday last, as on other days when the weather has been good, the stream of arrivals at the show ground continued for an hour or more after all the popular seats had been disposed of. In such weather as that of yesterday there has not been anything like the same demand for seats, and it has been under such circumstances that the disadvantage of distance from the popular centre and the railway stations must have made itself evident to the management. The organisers of the show, however, report that they have done exceedingly well, and they will be satisfied if their provincial tour progresses as prosperously as it has opened. Their prosperity has not been confined to themselves, and the Tramways Committee and the cabmen will suffer a sensible loss of income when the show leaves Manchester for Liverpool at the end of this week. It ought to be acknowledged that notwithstanding the succession of so large and miscellaneous a population as is attached to the Wild West - Red Indians, Mexicans, cowboys, Cossacks, negroes, and so forth - the good character of the neighbourhood has undergone no deterioration. The behaviour of our passing visitors of so many races and from so many lands has been excellent.

http://century.guardian.co.uk/1899-1909/Story/0,6051,98922,00.html

AND ...... just so you know ..... Buffalo Bill did take his Wild West show to Liverpool .... twice !!
Newsham Park July 5 – 18 1891 and Edge Lane Exhibition Site from May 4 – 23 1903

 :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

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Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #34 on: Thursday 10 April 08 02:55 BST (UK) »



A Scottish historian who has researched the fate of a Lakota Indian who died while touring with Buffalo Bill’s Wild West Show has uncovered more information about another Native American. Tom Cunningham resumed his boyhood interest in Native American history in the United Kingdom in 1991. Since then he has spent hours researching the story behind the Native Americans who toured with the former Army scout and opened his Wild West Show in 1883 in Omaha.

Cunningham says he now has pinpointed the location for the grave of an Ioway child, Corsair. ....... Corsair was born while his mother was sailing down the Missouri River, the first part of her travels to the United Kingdom. It was on another boat, this time from Edinburgh to Dundee, Scotland, that the 8-month-old boy died. He was buried in February 1845, after the Ioways conducted their funeral rites and then allowed burial by the Society of Friends, or Quakers. The Quakers had become the Ioways’ “firm and trusted friends,” Cunningham writes.

Corsair was buried Feb. 12, 1845, in a donated plot in Westgate Hill Cemetery, near Newcastle-upon-Tyne. Cunningham has been unable to find the grave, but he has located its site with what he calls reasonable precision. Corsair’s mother later died of tuberculosis and was buried in Paris.

And Cunningham also has uncovered the story of Red Penny - a Lakota child who traveled with Buffalo Bill in 1887-1988. Red Penny, too, was buried in Brompton Cemetery, joining Surrounded, Paul Eagle Star, Long Wolf and Star Ghost Dog. According to Cunningham, only the remains of Red Penny and Surrounded remain in Brompton. The other three were repatriated for reburial in South Dakota in the 1990s.

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Erect no gravestone .... let the Rose every year bloom for his sake ! Rilke Sonnets to Orpheus, I

Offline liverpool annie

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Re: The Salford Sioux - Manchester's own native American community
« Reply #35 on: Friday 11 April 08 18:31 BST (UK) »


Now this disturbs me !! ..... I can't believe they would use this proud man's picture on the package of a sleep aid and joint cream ..... I'm stunned !!     :o

http://www.lakotaherbs.com/about.html

But they must have had permission ... wonder where they got it from ?? family maybe ??

I posted on the US board to see if I could find census information !!

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,297641.0.htm

Annie  :)
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Be who you are and say what you feel -  because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind ! Dr. Seuss

Erect no gravestone .... let the Rose every year bloom for his sake ! Rilke Sonnets to Orpheus, I