Author Topic: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn  (Read 18622 times)

Offline tommacgregor

  • RootsChat Leaver
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *
  • Posts: 1,248
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« on: Tuesday 15 April 08 10:00 BST (UK) »


Hello All,

Can anyone living around the Rumbling Bridge area of Kinross help me out.
I am led to understand that a Margaret Hay, born around 1795 at Rumbling Bridge married David Hepburn at Leslie in Fife on the 26th of February, 1815.

For some time I was under the impression that David had married a girl from Arngask in Fife, but came across a snippet of information recently suggesting that this was not the case and that he had married a local girl.

Although I now live in Melbourne, Australia, I was born in Fife, and spent my early childhood there. I am well aware that the distance between Leslie and Rumblingbridge is only about 7 miles.( If that!) To me, that's local.

No matter how hard I try, I am unable to locate that all-important connection between the birth of a Margaret Hay around 1795-1799, and her marrying David Hepburn.

I would be most grateful if anybody interested in Family History could help me out.

Kind Regards,


Tom.

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline Piglet01

  • Email address not working please contact support
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,488
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 16 April 08 20:55 BST (UK) »
Hello Tom,

I'm a country loon.  A 'teuchter 'from Aberdeenshire.

A simple search of the IGI - all counties of Scotland - 1810 to 1850 brings up the following children to a David Hepburn and Margaret Hay - all 'extracted.

1. ANDREW HEPBURN Birth: 11 DEC 1815 Leslie, Fife, Scotland
2. WILLIAM HEPBURN Birth: 11 AUG 1817 Leslie, Fife, Scotland
3. JANET HEPBURN Birth: 03 AUG 1819 Leslie, Fife, Scotland
4. DAVID HEPBURNBirth: 26 MAY 1821 Leslie, Fife, Scotland
5. JAMES HEPBURN Birth: 10 MAR 1824 Leslie, Fife, Scotland
6. JOHN HEPBURN Birth: 13 JUN 1826
7. JOHN HEPBURN Christening: 12 SEP 1830 Leslie, Fife, Scotland
8. HEPBURN Male Christening: 12 SEP 1830 Leslie, Fife, Scotland

Regards,  Steve :O)

I'm well aware that the last 3 may be the same person.  With John being christened late? - or another birth - the first John having died.   No.8 I'm guessing is also John?

Did this family emigrate or stay in the UK? - had a quick look for Margaret on the 1841 census and couldn't find her - got to run...............................


RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline tommacgregor

  • RootsChat Leaver
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *
  • Posts: 1,248
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 16 April 08 23:11 BST (UK) »



Hello Steve,

Many thanks for your kindness. The answer is John was born in 1826 but not christened until 1830. I'm starting to get answers to the Margaret Hay mystery. Received an e-mail from an elderly gentleman living in Cyprus who has taken the trouble to give me a huge amount of detail.

If you think that Scotland to Cyprus is a long swim, then believe me, it's a lot longer to Victoria in the south of Australia.

Again, many thanks for your help.

Kind Regards,


Tom.

Offline sancti

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 7,876
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #3 on: Wednesday 16 April 08 23:16 BST (UK) »

Offline tommacgregor

  • RootsChat Leaver
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *
  • Posts: 1,248
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #4 on: Monday 21 April 08 06:49 BST (UK) »


Hello All,

Having been given some interesting information from various kind individuals, I have been chipping away at various records from a part of Scotland that I don't really know much about - Kinross.

I don't think that many researchers really like to expose the skeletons in the closet when sharing the details about their ancestors, but, what the Hell, how many Family Tree's don't have an illegitimate birth in it somewhere?

DDJJake, our good friend, now residing in Cyprus, was able to point me in the right direction initially, and then Monica and Sancti came to my rescue confirming and expanding that information and giving me the opportunity to look at the whole picture from a different aspect.

It would appear, (I feel as if I'm walking on hot coals, so I'm treading very carefully!), that Margaret Hay, who married one of my Hepburn ancestors, David Hepburn, on the 26th of February, 1815, was born in 1779 around the Rumbling Bridge area of Kinross. Although I don't have a really good knowledge of this pretty part of Scotland, I do know that Rumbling Bridge is a mere spit away from Cleish in Kinross. Cleish, of course is only about 6 miles away from Ballingry - an area that I'm very familiar with, since a number of my close family lived there when I was just a wee bit younger!

Margaret would appear to have had a terrible start to her life since her mother, Janet More (or Moore?), died giving birth to her. Although her birth was illegitimate, it is assumed that her father was John Hay. I simply couldn't resist taking a look at yet another tragic episode in the lives of my ancestors, and so started to comb through what records I could find using the "tools" available to me.

Was Janet More (or Moore?), the daughter of John Moore? There is an Extracted Christening Record showing that a Janet was christened at Fossoway & Tulliebole in Kinross on the 17th of October, 1756. If this young lady was indeed the mother of Margaret Hay, then she would have only been about 24 years of age when she died in childbirth in 1779.

That was only the start of my search, and even though I have little hope in exposing the whole story, I believe that it is worth the effort to try to give some pieces of information to other researchers who may be researching the descendants of these individuals.

I will continue with this interesting story in my next posting.

Kind Regards,


Tom.

Offline tommacgregor

  • RootsChat Leaver
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *
  • Posts: 1,248
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #5 on: Monday 21 April 08 07:24 BST (UK) »


Hello Again,

Although I have no definitive proof of any connection to the individuals mentioned in my previous posting, one has to bear in mind that we are looking at places like Rumbling Bridge and Cleish in Kinross, and that the population of such places would certainly have not been all that large in the 1700's. Therefore, when I look at names such as Hay and Rutherford, I'm not in the least surprised to note how they keep cropping up in my searches.

O.K., let me try to put some flesh on the bones by mentioning that a William HAY married an Isabel RUTHERFORD on the 15th December, 1738 at Cleish, a mere four miles or so from Rumbling Bridge.

Their children were: (and these are Extracted birth/christening records):

William Hay christened 16th December, 1739 at Cleish in Kinross.
Isobell Hay christened 21st October, 1741 at Cleish in Kinross.
Marion Hay christened 17th June, 1744 at Cleish in Kinross.
John Hay christened  9th August, 1746 at Cleish in Kinross.
Marion Hay christened 30th April, 1749 at Cleish in Kinross.
Robert Hay christened 28th April, 1751 at Cleish in Kinross.
Janet Hay christened 11th April, 1753 at Cleish in Kinross.
Janet Hay christened 13th April, 1755 at Cleish in Kinross.
Agnes Hay christened 19th March, 1758 at Cleish in Kinross.

It would be easy for me to speculate that there could have been some connection between the John Hay, shown above ,and Janet More, but that would be pure speculation. What I would far rather see, is an in-depth examination of the individuals above, to see who they eventually married and who their children were.

In all probability there are descendants of the individuals listed above still living in the Fife/Kinross area, and they may just have some information about their ancestors that they would be willing to share with us.

I look forward to hearing from them, and, as always, I would ask other researchers out there to check the informtion that I have given before inserting it into their Family Tree.

Kind Regards,


Tom.


Offline tommacgregor

  • RootsChat Leaver
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *
  • Posts: 1,248
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #6 on: Monday 21 April 08 08:01 BST (UK) »


Hello again,

In my previous posting, I mentioned William Hay who married Isabel Rutherford on the 15th December, 1738 at Cleish in Kinross. In this posting I'm moving forward in time by about 80 years.

JOHN HAY married Janet RUTHERFORD on the 23rd of May, 1819 at Kinross. At this point in time I have no idea whether or how these two individuals may be connected.

Their children:

Elizabeth Hay. Extracted birth record born 9th May, 1820 at Cleish in Kinross.
Jean Hay. Extracted birth record born 9th February, 1822 at Cleish in Kinross.
Peter Hay extracted birth record born January, 1826 at Cleish in Kinross.
Janet Hay extracted birth record born 6th June, 1828 at Cleish in Kinross.
Jean Hay extracted birth record born 9th February, 1832 at Cleish in Kinross.

I believe that what we are looking at are some of the descendants of the Hay family living in Cleish, but again, I must caution that this is pure speculation on my part. However it is interesting to note the marriage between members of the Hay and Rutherford families.

In my next posting I will be taking a look at the marriage of another Hay, a William Hay who may be related to John.

Kind Regards,


Tom.

Offline tommacgregor

  • RootsChat Leaver
  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • *
  • Posts: 1,248
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #7 on: Monday 21 April 08 08:13 BST (UK) »


Hello again,

In this posting I want to show other researchers on RootsChat a few details about a WILLIAM HAY who married Elizabeth (Betty) PATON on the 3rd of January, 1819, (about four months prior to the marrige between JOHN HAY and JANET RUTHERFORD.

Their children:

John Hay extracted christening 18th January 1820 at Cleish in Kinross.
William Hay extracted christening 16th December, 1821 at Cleish in Kinross.
John Hay extracted christening 10th December, 1822 at Cleish in Kinross.
Jean Hay extracted christening 17th March, 1824 at Cleish in Kinross.
Betty Hay extrcted christening 21st November, 1826 at Cleish in Kinross.
Robert Hay extracted christening 30th January, 1829 at Cleish in Kinross.
Adam Hay extracted christening 23rd April, 1831 at Cleish in Kinross.

I would be delighted to hear from any descendants of the individuals that I have mentioned in the above postings. Naturally enough, I will be more than willing to share with them details of my ancestors going forward in time from Margaret Hay who married David Hepburn on the 26th February, 1815 at Leslie in Fife.

Kind Regards,


Tom.

Offline MonicaL

  • RootsChat Honorary
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 25,700
  • 'Girl with firewood'
    • View Profile
Re: Margaret Hay - wife of David Hepburn
« Reply #8 on: Monday 21 April 08 21:08 BST (UK) »
Hi Tom

Margaret Hay's father was confirmed as John Hay from Margaret's christening entry:

MARGARET HAY     Christening:  23 APR 1783   Fossoway And Tulliebole, Kinross, Scotland
Parents:JOHN HAY and JANET M.

Monica  :)
Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk