Author Topic: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile  (Read 17400 times)

Offline Lass

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #27 on: Sunday 11 May 08 21:39 BST (UK) »
Are you sick of me yet??   ;)


Since I'm getting a ton of hits for IGI South America when I google Milton Bryant,  can I take it that it has some consular connections do you think??

I'm sure one of you will know the answer ;)

Lass x

Offline AMBLY

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #28 on: Sunday 11 May 08 23:05 BST (UK) »
Wahoohey! Lass! Forget grinning - I'm dancing  ;D   ;D Wonderful find - clever you!
That looks like a Batch christening almost doesn't it - I suspect they were not in the country (England)  for the event(s) ..........

If, on the IGI page - you follow the SOURCE number for that Batch C003791

It says:
Registros parroquiales, 1686-1970  Iglesia Católica. San Isidro (Santiago, Santiago) 
Translated:
Parochial Registers 1686 - 1970 English Catholics, Sab Isidro (Santiago)

Is the family Catholic in Chile?

If you follow that link, it goes to more on another page....... How is your Spanish?
I can get the gist of quite a bit and can work out pretty much in full eventually, if you need any help!
Otherwise, Babel Fish can be helpful!
http://babelfish.altavista.com/

My thinking is now - to try find a batch with deaths and marriages on it, starting with the San Isidro Parish!

Wahoo! (again  ;D)

Cheers
AMBLY
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline AMBLY

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #29 on: Sunday 11 May 08 23:20 BST (UK) »
Tons of batches to choose from, if you "View the Film Notes"
Would be nice to find some on-line at least, but suspect you may have to order film in for at least some of them.... then of course, which year batch to order  ;D  ;D
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline Lass

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #30 on: Sunday 11 May 08 23:21 BST (UK) »
Hi AMBLY!!   ;D

Yes, definitely looks like a batch - the IGI record recorded in England for Jose David reflects the christening date on the IGI record originating from Chile, so it looks like that date at least is consistent.  I can't find IGI Chile records for the births Rosa or Josefa unfortunately, at least not under Balharry.  This info doesat least tie-in with the details I got from Maria for the children of 'her' David - she told me that the children of David and Benigna were:

Benjamin
Elena (this must be Josefa Elena)
Victoria
Rosa
Margarita (possibly named after her grandmother?? ;))
and 2 others whose names I don't yet have!

I know this isn't where we were concentrating, but still!!  I'm wondering though, if these children are being registered 'back home', would this be usual if the father David had been born in Chile, son of David born in Scotland?

And yes, the family in Chile are very definitely Catholic!

Lass x



Offline Lass

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #31 on: Sunday 11 May 08 23:29 BST (UK) »
Ooooo look, you've found lots of new avenues while I was busy typing!!

Strangely, whilst my Spanish is pretty much non-existent, I can make out most of the gist of that page, and whilst my cousins' English is faultless, I do use babelfish now and then to at least make the effort to use some Spanish in our conversations!

At least now I can point Maria in a specific direction of research - for me at least, specifically the marriage record for David and Benigna in the hope that it might confirm the parents names.  Unless I can find the relevant batch online........

Thanks for sticking this out with me, it's great to have someone to 'bounce' off!!!   ;D

Lass x

Offline AMBLY

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #32 on: Monday 12 May 08 00:05 BST (UK) »
Hi Lass,

Just a thought - Would the family have also been Catholic in Scotland too? Or do you think the Catholicism came about by exposure and then conversion  to that predominant faith in CHile - perhaps via marriage....

cheers  ;D
AMBLY

Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

"Now that we're all here, I'm not sure if we're all there...."

 Entre los individuos, como entre las naciones, el respeto al derecho ajeno es la paz
 Among individuals, as among nations, respect for the rights of others is peace
    ~Benito Juarez (1806-1872)

Offline JAP

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #33 on: Monday 12 May 08 04:38 BST (UK) »
Hello again Lass & AMBLY,

Well, I've seen some monumental LDS indexing "stuff-ups" in my time but this one takes the cake :o

I hasten to add that I am a huge admirer of the genealogical indexing which has been done by the LDS - our research would be impossible without the wonderful records which they make available online and through their family history centres.  I am ever grateful to them.   :)

The old "controlled extraction program" of the LDS was excellent with very few errors  8)

But quality control on batches inserted in recent years seems to be non-existent e.g. wrong places obviously entered and "filled down" with no checking at all.  I've pointed some of them out to the LDS (email contact on Familysearch) but there seems to be a complete lack of comprehension coupled with an almost total unwillingness to investigate, explain, improve, correct, etc ...   >:(

I had checked out the source and film notes before posting the following earlier:
Quote
The baptism of a son, Jose David BALHARRY, to David B & Benigna in 1878 in San Isidro, Santiago, Chile is in the IGI - perhaps that actual record might reveal something (occupation of that David B, godparents, etc?).  I guess the film/fiche could be ordered in to your local LDS Family History centre.

But it hadn't occurred to me to check whether the same entry appeared in other countries - why on earth would it!  How fortunate, Lass, that you found names and dates for siblings (as well as him) in this batch which idiotically purports to come from "Milton-Bryant"!

Just to elaborate on the whole indexing mess, the South American and the Milton-Bryant batches each have the same batch number and the same source number.  The source number (1798170), of course, leads in both instances to the Chilean source.
However ...
- if one looks at the batch number (C003791) selecting South America as the region, one gets a list of 1558 names all in San Isidro
- if one looks at the same batch number (C003791) but selecting British Isles as the region, one gets a list of 3058 names (i.e. apparently including the 1558 but also with additional entries) and all purporting to be in "Milton-Bryant, Bedfordshire"!  Incidentally, all are pretty obviously South American names.

One wonders how any data entry person, however inexperienced, could have managed so many errors at once!!  ::)

This is obviously a widespread problem ...
I tried the next batch number - C003792.
This produces a list of baptisms purporting to be in Milton-Bryant, Bedfordshire.  But a quick check finds that it's pretty obviously a mixed list of Anglo names (all typed in upper case) and likely South American names (all typed in lower case).
The source number leads to Milton-Bryant records.

However, take one of the likely South American names - say Felipa BALQUI.
Search for Felipa in All Resources - there are two records, one is the one purporting to be in "Milton-Bryant" and the other is for Peru.  The Peru one has a different batch number (C023844) and is a list of baptisms in Amazonas, Peru - it has no source number at all ...

That noise you hear is JAP pulling her hair out while sighing in utter despair because past experience shows that there is absolutely no point in drawing all the above errors to the LDS ...  Even LDS members who run Family History centres get no joy when they try ...

Anyway, the whole point of the above is to say "Forget Milton-Bryant!" - and best not to mention it to the Chileans.  It is clearly just another of the increasing numbers of LDS indexing errors.  I guess just be grateful for the additional names of Jose David's sibling - however flawed the location.

All the best,

JAP
PS: Well, I've submitted a Contact Form on the FamilySearch site reporting this particular mess - rather more bluntly than on previous occasions.  But don't hold your breath.

Offline Lass

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #34 on: Monday 12 May 08 11:27 BST (UK) »
Hi Lass,

Just a thought - Would the family have also been Catholic in Scotland too? Or do you think the Catholicism came about by exposure and then conversion  to that predominant faith in CHile - perhaps via marriage....

cheers  ;D
AMBLY


Hi AMBLY

No, the family here weren't Catholic, strictly Church of Scotland as far as I can tell.  I would image there weren't too many CoS in Chile at that time!!  I simply assumed that Benigna would have been Catholic as that certainly is the predominant religion in Chile, and that David had 'converted' prior to or upon marriage.

Lass x

Offline Lass

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Re: David Balharry - Scotland to Chile
« Reply #35 on: Monday 12 May 08 11:35 BST (UK) »
Hi JAP

Ohhh please don't pull out any more hair, I don't want to be partly responsible for your baldness!!!  :o

I understand what you've said in your post about the indexing, what I don't get is why Milton Bryant?  Am I missing something obvious here?  The other thing that puzzles me is that whilst I can find the siblings in the Milton Bryant IGI records, I can't find them in the Chile IGI records.  It was actually a lucky accident to find them in the first place!

Anyhow, I shall move on from the dirty word (Milton Bryant!!) and see what other progress can be made today!

Lass x