Author Topic: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor  (Read 56212 times)

Offline Ding

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #27 on: Tuesday 26 August 08 01:47 BST (UK) »
Hi Kris,

The main thing I was going off is the drawn tree I sent to you some time ago. It shows 2 marriages for Richard Martyn. Samuel Martyn (his father) is in Roman print which means he married into the family of Thomas Martyn since 1696. I had also checked the IGI and OPC.

I havent looked at the census yet. If the first Margaret in Padstow died in childbirth the timing of the second would fit. I have come across a couple of mistakes on the tree before.

It looks as if the Stoke Dameral marriage fits this family.
 ???
Ding

 
Lincolnshire Bell, Australia Bell, Cornish Peters, Australian Peters, Cornish Martyn, Cornish Pollard.

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Offline krisesjoint

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #28 on: Tuesday 26 August 08 02:18 BST (UK) »
Sorry Ding, 

Yes Margaret did die in Childbirth. I have been focusing in on these two sons. As you say we have found mistakes before. I sat here last night trying to find them with no luck. Didn't add a single thing I didn't already have. Hope you have better luck than me. If they had 2 more sons I would like to know where. There are other Martyn's in Devon so this marriage may not connect.........Kris
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Offline Ding

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #29 on: Friday 29 August 08 04:52 BST (UK) »
Hi,
Another puzzle from the Martyn Tree.
The tree shows Margaret Martyn( daughter of Thomas & Gertrude(Turnavine)) as marrying Richard Johns & them having only 2 children:
1. Margaret (who = Henry Rice)
2. Richard (who = Gertrude Martyn)

My first problem is that the OPC shows Richard Johns = Margaret Martin 7 Jan 1729 in Crantock. It gives the grooms residence as St Agnes.
Now the IGI for children of Richard Johns Chr. after 1729 in St Agnes shows:
1. James 1 Nov 1731
2. Thomas 1 Dec 1733
3. Richard  20 Nov 1734
4. Chesten  4 Feb 1737
5. Margaret. 1 Dec 1733.
I see there is another Johns family (Richard = Honor) with children of similar names but about 10 years younger in St Agnes.
I presume the first family are that of Richard and Margaret (Martyn) and they have 5 children and not 2 as the tree shows.

I think the second mistake on the tree is with Richard (son of Richard & Margaret) who is just shown as = Gertrude Martyn and having 7 children.
The OPC shows Richard Johns = Margaret Nicholls 19 Nov 1763 in Crantock. It also shows Richard Johns = Gertrude Martyn 15 Jul 1766 in Crantock. In this marriage Richard has a (w) next to him. I cannot find a death of Margaret Johns (Nicholls) between 1763 and 1766. It appears they (Richard + Margaret) had a son Richard Chr. 8 Sep 1764.

Hope this is clear.

Ding
Lincolnshire Bell, Australia Bell, Cornish Peters, Australian Peters, Cornish Martyn, Cornish Pollard.

Offline krisesjoint

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #30 on: Friday 29 August 08 06:14 BST (UK) »
Not sure about St Agnes Ding,

We do have 2 marriages there  :-\

Richard JOHNS = Anne TREZISE 7 Apr 1722

Richard JOHN = Honnor MORRISH 28 Jun 1744

Now there are marriages in St Ag - Margaret = Francis HONEY 20 Aug 1768
Cheston = William GILL 24 May 1772 now Richard and Honnor had a Cheston also so she may be explained James JOHNS = Mary HARRIS 14 Jun 1772

Margaret Nicholls did die in childbirth. (buried at same time of sons baptism)

Kris  :D
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Offline Ding

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #31 on: Friday 29 August 08 07:46 BST (UK) »
Hi Kris,

Thanks for the reply, I guess I can go ahead and add the extra marriage (Margaret Nicholls) for Richard Johns with Burial 8 Sep 1764.

As for Richard's siblings I guess I was clinging to the fact that the OPC had his father's residence in St Agnes at the time of his marriage 1729 and the 5 children being born 1731 - 1739. What a pity the mother's name is not recorded.

I must admit that the two Chestens being born about 7 years apart has thrown me. I can only find the one marriage. The older one would be c35 and the younger c28.  I have not come across that name anywhere else.

I see there is a record of Margaret Johns = Henry Rice of Falmouth ,3 Aug 1771 in Crantock.

Have you got any record of when Richard Johns snr. was born. I have Margaret (his wife) as 1704 - 1764.

Thanks again, Ding
Lincolnshire Bell, Australia Bell, Cornish Peters, Australian Peters, Cornish Martyn, Cornish Pollard.

Offline krisesjoint

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #32 on: Friday 29 August 08 09:50 BST (UK) »
Sorry Ding, I have nothing on Richard Johns and Margaret. I do not have Richards birth nor do I have their deaths. The 1764 burial I believe is Margaret Nicholls although age is not listed it is the same day as the sons baptism and Richard did remarry do it fits. It says wife of Richard which is not conclusive but the remarriage and the baptismal date for the son leads me to believe it is Margaret Nicholls.

Yes I have the 1771 marriage of Margaret to Henry Rice which does seem to corroborate the tree but we still have the Margaret marrying in St Agnes so I don't know what to think of these other baptisms. Like you I have not come across a Chesten in the families..........Kris  :D
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Offline dmollison

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #33 on: Tuesday 02 September 08 23:14 BST (UK) »
(1) Ref the excellent photo of Penpol posted by Ding.
The house as shown looks all very much  19th century, I would
guess not earlier than about 1850.  So it must have been
rebuilt or replaced since the time of (e.g.) Joseph Martyn (1701-84).

(2) Can anyone - Kris? - tell me who to ask for a copy of the family
tree of Thomas Martyn (b 1668?) that has been referred to several times on
this thread?

(3) .. and can it be true that this Thomas Martyn lived till 1774 as is posted on
the generally fairly accurate tree by Marianne Eastgate  on "WorldConnect"!
I suspect he's being confused with one of his relations.

(4) I am still working on that comprehensive post of all the (C19th)
descendants of James Liddell and Mary Martyn (m 1793) - just some
census entries to check.

Denis

Offline krisesjoint

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #34 on: Wednesday 03 September 08 00:33 BST (UK) »
Hi Denis,

Glad you are still with us  :D

(1) Yes it is a wonderful Photo but only the home of one branch of the family. I am sure the family had many properties. Trevithick, Trebarva and Trevilly for sure prior to this and probably back to Rialton (The Munday's Home) and of course dependant upon which part of the family you are following later - Treloy, Trevemper, Polwhele spring to mind besides Penpol.

(2) Wonderful part of history is this tree from mid 1800's. I will not put the person on the spot. I will leave it to the lucky person fortunate enough to have it in the family to contact you privately if he wishes.

(3) No. This is wrong. In fact there are no burials for any Martyn's in 1774 and no burials at all in July, so I am quite certain this is wrong.  Gertrude was widowed at burial 1 Dec 1752. I have Thomas's Burial as 15 Nov 1734 - though I can't be sure it is him without proof but I believe this is him. Unfortunately with just a name and date in this period, and given I don't see a will it is never 100% certain.

(4) Look forward to seeing this  ;)

Cheers Kris  :D
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Offline Diam

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Re: MARTYN Family of St Columb Minor
« Reply #35 on: Wednesday 01 October 08 11:30 BST (UK) »
Hello
I have just found this and as another descendant of Thomas & Gertrude am fascinated.

Thanks to the famous family tree, the contents of two boxes of papers in the possession of a cousin & many hours in the Cornwall Record Office (CRO) I have gathered a fair amount of information about the family and in particular the Crantock line & Johns connections.

The picture of Penpol caught my eye. I know for certain that Joseph leased the farm as sub tenant to Thomas Rickard who had inherited the tenancy from Thomas Symons in about 1717. The lease was for five and a half years and suggests that Joseph was already in possession. Leases  were renewed until November 1801 when Joseph's grandson, William son of Thomas and Ann purchased it. My great grandfather, William, son of Silas Hiscutt Martyn and Harriet nee Johns inherited the property from bachelor uncle William in 1883 and later in that decade had the makeover carried out that resulted in the house shown in the photograph. I was taken there in 1951 when my father's cousin, son of his aunt, owned it. The last William Martyn and male heir of that line, died, shortly before his 22nd birthday in 1899.

Also there was mention of the date of the Ann Hiscutt /John Christian marriage at Looe. Do you know which church?

Best wishes
Di